TE
TechEcho
Home24h TopNewestBestAskShowJobs
GitHubTwitter
Home

TechEcho

A tech news platform built with Next.js, providing global tech news and discussions.

GitHubTwitter

Home

HomeNewestBestAskShowJobs

Resources

HackerNews APIOriginal HackerNewsNext.js

© 2025 TechEcho. All rights reserved.

A debtors’ prison in Mississippi

229 pointsby nthitzover 9 years ago

22 comments

rdtscover 9 years ago
The poor are an easy target for governments and private entities, simply because they are easy to abuse and there are so many of them.<p>Unlike the wealthy they simply do not have the time, money, resources, ability to unify and fight back as a single block (save some outraged protests and rioting resulting from attack or mistreatment by police, but those one can argue do more harm than good). If they don&#x27;t have an extra $20&#x2F;month, chances are they will not have time to sit and write a letter to a senator, or to call a lawyer or organize campaigns.<p>As the article put it, adding these fees and doing this is really an administrative step, it&#x27;s just too easy not to do it. If they, say, tried to raise taxes on top tax bracket, that would turn into a long uphill battle probably. There would be local town meetings, letter to legislative representatives, calls to country club networks of friends and so on.<p>So as a result there are lots of payday loans places, high fees for courts, jail time (unless fee is paid on the spot), for the poor. Even once they go to prison they are turned effectively into slaves, they can&#x27;t even call home because they nickle and dime there as well.
评论 #10439913 未加载
评论 #10439859 未加载
评论 #10440173 未加载
评论 #10440564 未加载
评论 #10439884 未加载
dx211over 9 years ago
&quot;All of which means that because Anderson was too poor to pay his $170 fine, his overall debt ballooned to $580. His fine more than tripled, solely because he was too poor to pay it.&quot;<p>This seems pretty much like the status quo. If you default on your credit card bill, and ultimately choose minimal payments until it&#x27;s paid off, rather than bankruptcy, you&#x27;ll end up paying several times the value of the original loan.<p>That said, if you go to the Biloxi court house&#x27;s web site, they offer people the ability to do a payment plan for tickets, but they explicitly say &quot;Remember that release on a payment plan is a privilege afforded by the Court and a violation of the payment order will result in your immediate arrest.&quot; I think that&#x27;s pretty terrible since in this post-6th-amendment society, &quot;arrest&quot; is frequently indistinguishable from &quot;imprisonment&quot;. Debt, especially something so trivial, should be a civil matter.
评论 #10439877 未加载
评论 #10440424 未加载
评论 #10440291 未加载
评论 #10440343 未加载
评论 #10439900 未加载
rrggrrover 9 years ago
If your blood isn&#x27;t already boiling here are other examples: <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;jonathanturley.org&#x2F;2013&#x2F;04&#x2F;07&#x2F;the-rise-of-debtors-prisons-in-the-us&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;jonathanturley.org&#x2F;2013&#x2F;04&#x2F;07&#x2F;the-rise-of-debtors-pri...</a>
评论 #10440021 未加载
ArkyBeagleover 9 years ago
Just to tie this to Ferguson: <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;marginalrevolution.com&#x2F;marginalrevolution&#x2F;2014&#x2F;08&#x2F;ferguson-and-the-debtors-prison.html" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;marginalrevolution.com&#x2F;marginalrevolution&#x2F;2014&#x2F;08&#x2F;fer...</a>
baldfatover 9 years ago
Social Justice is a big part of who I am. I get so mad when i read it and read this<p>&gt; This means that poorer counties are more reliant on fines and fees produced by municipal courts, which inevitably come from the poor residents of those areas. Those governments then put pressure on police departments to generate revenue by targeting residents for traffic offenses, jaywalking, and other misdemeanors and petty crimes...<p>&gt; The city got poorer. That meant less revenue from other sources. So the city sought more revenue by imposing more fines and fees on its citizens. Which of course only makes them poorer.<p>&gt; Private probation companies have a strong incentive to keep people on probation for as long as possible.<p>I live in a poor city with a school district where 90% of the students qualify for free lunch. We are privatizing Public Education to also feed off the poor take the money out of the community and are rewarded if the Public School system does poorly.
FussyZeusover 9 years ago
The uncomfortable question that needs asking here is why are all these cities hurting for money so badly and the answer is us. We as taxpayers are constantly demanding and electing politicians who promise (and deliver) tax cuts. Then we turn around and bitch because potholes don&#x27;t get fixed.<p>If you want your Government to run well, you need to goddamn pay for it. People need to grow up.
评论 #10440483 未加载
everyoneover 9 years ago
When the really big criminals (corrupt bankers and wealthy businessmen) cant pay fines they just declare bankruptsy (or their corporations do) and nothing happens to them. Afterwards they seem to be perfectly well off.
rayinerover 9 years ago
Similar injustices in Georgia, with people jailed for traffic tickets: <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.motherjones.com&#x2F;politics&#x2F;2015&#x2F;02&#x2F;georgia-probation-misdemeanor-poor-jail" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.motherjones.com&#x2F;politics&#x2F;2015&#x2F;02&#x2F;georgia-probatio...</a>.
tdb7893over 9 years ago
Isn&#x27;t it vastly more expensive to jail people than reduce a 170$ fine that obviously couldn&#x27;t be paid?
评论 #10440319 未加载
评论 #10440478 未加载
marincountyover 9 years ago
If these fees were tied to income, we might not have a problem in a few months.<p>Yes, when a rich man gets a ticket; he laughing tells his wife over dinner.<p>A poor man gets a ticket; he could be at risk for being homeless.<p>Since they started to raise fees at every level of government about 15 years ago, I felt it&#x27;s time to equate fees to income.<p>When the Rich guy comes home with a $7000 speeding ticket; the laws&#x2F;fees will change--fast. I think they tie income to fee in Switzerland? Unless the rich are effected nothing will change, or at least that&#x27;s been my experience.<p>(To all you think the poor never learn their lesson, there could be a quota system. For example, if the poor Speeder abuses the system, they would go back to paying these currently rediculious amounts.)
评论 #10441027 未加载
评论 #10440649 未加载
littletimmyover 9 years ago
The more I think about it, the more I believe that the United States is the worst place to live if you are poor.<p>There are places that are poorer, hell I&#x27;m from a third world country. But I&#x27;ve never seen anyone in the third world show utter <i>contempt</i> for the poor. No one keeps reminding the poor that it&#x27;s their fault. We call them &quot;unfortunate&quot;, Americans call them &quot;losers&quot;.<p>The US is the only place where being poor is not just a material failing, but also a moral failing. Perhaps it is a natural outcome of lionizing your winners that you absolute hate your losers, but this is fast becoming a heartless society where one wouldn&#x27;t want to live unless one is rich.
评论 #10440514 未加载
评论 #10440439 未加载
评论 #10441394 未加载
tzsover 9 years ago
&gt; During a single week in 2011, Joseph Anderson, 52, suffered three heart attacks and a stroke. The latter left the left side of his body partially paralyzed. Later that year, he suffered a fourth heart attack. Prior to his health problems, Anderson worked as a mechanic at a local Best Western. After that disastrous stretch, he has been unable to work, and struggles to get by on the less than $10,000 per year he gets in various forms of public assistance<p>$10k&#x2F;year is below the poverty level for a single person household. It is shameful that in a first world country someone can still be knocked into poverty by losing the ability to work due to medical problems.
Shivetyaover 9 years ago
It isn&#x27;t just judicial fines and such that are the problem, government as a whole has turned lower income into a debtor prison. They provide some food assistance, maybe living assistance, and such, then take away the free cash and even ability to drive with fee after fee after fee. Throw in sales taxes in some cities and the burden is greater.<p>However what this article points out is just flat out abuse and should result in government officials locked up. Just like previous stories about deals states cut with prison phone companies we have a justice system, if not most of government, which only exists to keep people poor and more controllable
DubiousPusherover 9 years ago
A few years back I met a kid in rural Michigan who was ticketed for driving without his glasses which had broken. When he was unable to pay the ticket he was fined in excess of the ticket by a judge. He had to drive to work to make the money to pay the ticket and buy glasses. And of course when he raised some money he paid the fine first rather than buying glass because it kept him out of jail.<p>Judges are supposed to have leeway to take these kinds of things into account.
cozzydover 9 years ago
It&#x27;s a shame that so many areas are so car-dependent that a driver&#x27;s license revocation can be so damaging.
therealdrag0over 9 years ago
If this resonates with you, consider joining&#x2F;donating to the ACLU!<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.aclu.org&#x2F;donate&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.aclu.org&#x2F;donate&#x2F;</a>
ericfrederichover 9 years ago
John Oliver has touched on this several times.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=0UjpmT5noto" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=0UjpmT5noto</a>
danmaz74over 9 years ago
&gt; Private probation companies have a strong incentive to keep people on probation for as long as possible.<p>Obvious... and crazy.
Kaliumover 9 years ago
A small group of individual rioters <i>two blocks from my home</i>. You&#x27;ll have to pardon me for not wanting to encourage a repeat of this by sending a message that rioting near my home garners my political support.
评论 #10442066 未加载
评论 #10440546 未加载
评论 #10440517 未加载
kordlessover 9 years ago
I can&#x27;t read any of these Washington Post articles because I&#x27;ve &#x27;read my limit of free articles&#x27;.
评论 #10439543 未加载
评论 #10439584 未加载
评论 #10439766 未加载
joeclark77over 9 years ago
It&#x27;s always amazing to watch modern-day &quot;educated&quot; New York liberals discover things that every 12-year-old with a basic education in civics understood 100 years ago.<p>The lesson of this article: Government has only one means to carry out its policies: force (more precisely, threat of force). When you vote for a new tax or fine (<i>cough</i> Obamacare <i>cough</i>) you are voting for rough men with guns to take stubborn objectors away to prison. Period.<p>This is at the heart of the libertarian argument: government should be used cautiously, and the default position should always be <i>not</i> to impose a law unless you&#x27;re sure that force is justifiable and necessary.
评论 #10440477 未加载
评论 #10440528 未加载
ElComradioover 9 years ago
What makes me skeptical of articles like this is the case studies seem to focus on people who appear to be behaving in the most ridiculous way possible. Taking a joint to court? Running stop signs on a suspended license?<p>If the situations profiled are commonplace, it should not be hard to find more sympathetic victims. That said, it is true that even if this is going on infrequently it is still an injustice and should be corrected... But the headline and article would seem to want to have us believe that we have whole prisons filled with debtors.
评论 #10441036 未加载