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Backwards Economics

25 pointsby KeepTalkingabout 15 years ago

8 comments

lautabout 15 years ago
Too much focus on "creating jobs" just like politicians. It's easy to create make-work for everyone. The key is creating value. If the government allocates the resources you end up with starvation, as history shows.<p>The soccer example is a good example of what is the real problem. Regulation and legislation that stands in the way of private business. Instead of fixing the problems created by government, more government involvement is proposed.<p>If the soccer games is really something people want, anyone, including Scott Adams, can start it and charge 5 dollars. Why would the government need to be involved? If litigation is a problem, that should be solved instead of giving government sponsored activities preferential treatment to avoid the law.<p>Adams acknowledges that "government screws up everything it touches." But then later writes "Suppose the initial investor is the government". Why wouldn't the government screw up the investing too?
mhbabout 15 years ago
Except government is willing to run its "businesses" not just at break-even, but at a loss. It also has a political power incentive to expand its businesses whether or not they are profitable in any sense.<p>This will discourage, and possibly prohibit (e.g., first class mail) private, potentially more efficient and profitable (in the true sense), competitive businesses from coming into existence.
roundsquareabout 15 years ago
Interesting, but I don't think I would trust the government to stay out of the mix.<p>On his education idea, I think he is downplaying the skill involved in teaching/tutoring. Its not easy, and many people may not have the patience for it.<p>For the energy idea, I would imagine the installations require a lot of specific technical knowledge. Although this can probably be taught, this requires a large number of qualified teachers.<p>Still, overall I like the idea of the government setting up and investing in socially responsible/helpful companies with the aim of breaking even. Maybe it would help to have a scheme where the government must (try to) get out of the company in X (10?) years.
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steamer25about 15 years ago
<i>The reason I suggest government funding is that unlike a private investor, the government can make a huge return on a business that simply breaks even, assuming all of the employees pay income taxes.</i><p>If government is funding the business, they're providing the payroll. E.g., If, I, as the government owe you $20 in payroll and you owe me $10 in taxes; my net is -$10. There is no huge return. I'll grant, however, that there is a potential for the government's constituents to be satisfied with merely breaking even.<p><i>Plus you have the ripple effect on vendors to the company, and the benefit of reducing unemployment.</i><p>Keynesian multipliers don't work. They are offset by the government taking money out of the private economy before they can put it into their make-work programs. E.g., Say I start a business under this plan called "Running for Fun". Sales at ShoeMart, SportsPlex and SpandexLand all go up. However, the lady that was taxed to pay for my program had a business called "Enviro-Maid". She would've spent that money with her vendors, Eco-Detergenze, RecycloScrubs and SolarVacs but now she can't. It's a zero-sum game.<p>If it did work, the government could hire one set of people to dig ditches and another to fill them in (it's a health program!). The problem is that no actual wealth or value is created although you might create some bureaucratic positions to keep track of the 'progress'.<p><i>If the government is involved, there are no insurance issues because a government can simply make it a law that you can't sue it.</i><p>This is actually a good idea. But instead of (literally) expanding the government into everybody's business let's extend that same protection against baseless claims to non-government entities.<p>Overall, I agree with Adam's general sentiment of utilizing 'net technologies to organize opportunities against underutilized skillsets. I'm just not sold on the government involvement--especially in education where programs like Khan's Academy and the concepts surrounding OCW are poised to overthrow the public indoctrination monopoly.
jclabout 15 years ago
Previous discussion: <a href="http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1181324" rel="nofollow">http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1181324</a>
DanielBMarkhamabout 15 years ago
<i>But imagine you can solve that by having each business run by qualified business people who have a profit motive. The government would be the funding source, set a few high level rules, and otherwise stay out of the mix. </i><p>Now imagine you have a new pony. See how easy that is?<p>Sorry Scott, being able to take labor and capital and make money with it isn't just something you "imagine" and it happens. Really smart, sharp, excellent business guys flail around at this all the time and couldn't make a dime with a lemonade stand. There's simply a lot more to it than people wanting to work and smart business people.<p>You're doing a lot of skimming, hand-waving, and smoke-blowing. I love Dilbert, and you are an awesome person, but in my opinion these blog entries of yours aren't hitting on so much lately.
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nhebbabout 15 years ago
If it were a site that helped bootstrappers self-organize, then it would be a great idea. Otherwise, it would just be more government control and a likely source of fraud.<p>I hate to be cynical, but as it turns out, I'm really good at it.
lionheartedabout 15 years ago
&#62; Suppose the initial investor is the government, and the sorts of businesses are only the types that are good for the country: health, education, and energy.<p>This might work in theory, but in practice, the money always goes to politicians' friends, allies, and funding sources. Consider all the bridges to nowhere built. Or my favorite example - building troop transports that the Joint Chief of Staff says the Army doesn't need or want any more of. One billion per transport, but we aren't likely to be needing a larger scale Normandy-style invasion transport any more, so they go unused and take up space and require maintenance. But they're built in some influential politicians' district, so each year they keep building and shipping one of these billion dollar paperweights that the Army doesn't want.<p>In fact, I'll go a step further - there's a decent chance that some of these programs will actually be destructive by chasing out legitimate businesses that can't compete with government subsidized preferentially treated nonsense.<p>In theory, we could stipulate that "the government will only fund good, non-corrupt stuff." This, however, has pretty much never worked in practice anywhere, especially not in a representative democracy where politicians take legal bribes (we call it "campaign finance") and then the politicians give business and money back to the people who campaign financed them. I mean, what do you call a politician taking money, using it for his own gain, and then giving public money back to the person who gave him money? That's almost exactly the definition of corruption to me, but it's institutionalized in America as campaign finance. So no, I have no faith that the politicians would allocate funding to "only the types that are good for the country." At least, they're not doing it right now with the billions and trillions they're spreading around, and I don't see any reason to think additional funds would be spent more judiciously.