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Ask HN: Have you regretted making something open-source?

352 pointsby haydenleealmost 8 years ago

38 comments

sheetjsalmost 8 years ago
We build open source tools for processing spreadsheet data (<a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;sheetjs&#x2F;js-xlsx" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;sheetjs&#x2F;js-xlsx</a> is our largest and most popular open source project). Our open source tools have been used by government agencies, S&amp;P 500&#x2F;Dow companies, and startups alike. We&#x27;ve found people have taken the library, removed header comments, and sold as-is. Some startups have taken our web demo <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;oss.sheetjs.com&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;oss.sheetjs.com&#x2F;</a>, replaced the name with their own, and tried to use that to raise money. But those aren&#x27;t really regrettable -- it&#x27;s written off as &quot;shameless people are shameless&quot;.<p>The truth is, you can never really know what would have happened if you didn&#x27;t open source in the first place. Would an open source alternative emerge? Would people pay for your project or would it die in relative obscurity? That&#x27;s unknowable.<p>If there&#x27;s any regret, it&#x27;s probably the amount of time spent doing support work for the open source libraries. It&#x27;s not particularly interesting (usually pertaining to something in the README), time consuming (everyone seems to have their own secret project that they don&#x27;t want to discuss, so you have to draw out the underlying issue slowly), and uncompensated.
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_wmdalmost 8 years ago
Throwing random code over the wall is fairly harmless, until it sees any level of popularity, at which point you become the sole point of contact for a sea of people expecting bug fixes for free. That can be rewarding, but it can also be intensely draining.<p>Imagine looking at your personal inbox giving you the same feeling of dread as you&#x27;d expect looking at your work inbox after being off for a few weeks..<p>I&#x27;m currently trying to offload one project because it&#x27;s getting too much, and just finding a new maintainer who knows C and Python to a decent standard has turned out difficult. None of the regular project users have stepped up. Shrugs
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symisc_develalmost 8 years ago
Not regretting it, but open sourcing our embedded PHP engine PH7[1] did hurt our sales (I think) when some Chinese company started abusing the software by embedding it in their hardware without paying any license fee (The software is dual licensed and require a commercial license for closed source code). I have a indirect proof of that abuse but starting a lawsuit against a Chinese co won&#x27;t lead to any result?<p>[1]: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;symisc&#x2F;ph7" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;symisc&#x2F;ph7</a>
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mholtalmost 8 years ago
I think I regret making Papa Parse[1] open source under the MIT license, anyway. Turns out it became incredibly popular and I missed a lot of opportunities to make a profit on the side. But it is used by government agencies around the world, and non-profit organizations like the UN and Wikimedia, so at least it&#x27;s doing some good. But I know quite a few large businesses are using it at the core of their products... for free. Oh well. It was fun to build.<p>[1] <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;papaparse.com" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;papaparse.com</a>
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erikbalmost 8 years ago
The opposite. In my country it&#x27;s really hard to get any ownership of your content if you are an employee. For instance you work as secretary for a bodyguard company and in your private time lead a pop-rock band. It&#x27;s not impossible that your boss can grab a share of your music earnings.<p>In this regard open-source is really helpful, because it enables me to write code in one gig that is good enough to earn my pay there, but allows me in a legal way to use the same code in my next gig. Instead of giving my boss monopoly over my long-term viable content, I make it free to everybody and therefore useful to my future self.<p>I would even argue it&#x27;s good for the boss too, since this way I am more motivated to produce, and 90% of the code used in production is totally useless once the author is gone, since most developers aren&#x27;t good enough to reuse preexisting code and will instead start writing their own code from scratch.
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repomies6999almost 8 years ago
While I don&#x27;t regret it, last experiences with open source probably made me to not do it again. Essentially people seemed to assume that if I release a project, it also means that I&#x27;m require to provide free support for it, etc. The attitude from users of the software was depressing - in fact to me it feels that my paying customers are nicer on average.
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marenkayalmost 8 years ago
Definitely: the software for running World of Warcraft private servers, also known as MaNGOS.<p>Founded and released that in 2005, got so much trouble because of that and wasted loads of cash to keep up project through numerous DDoS attacks, hacks (one of them even causing github downtime in 2013).<p>oh well. Next :-)
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_Marak_almost 8 years ago
I released an open-source universal cryptocurrency banking website in 2013 called &quot;Safewallet&quot;. It has decent google ranking for SEO terms related to open-source crypto banking.<p>Every time the price of Bitcoin goes up I start getting emails from wantrepreneurs asking me to essentially work for them without pay because they &quot;have a great idea&quot; and &quot;just need a little help getting the software working&quot;. During Bitcoin mania phases ( like now ) I&#x27;ll get 2-3 of these emails a month.<p>Too many stories to list. Everything ranging from offers of $2,000 to build a &quot;BitStamp clone&quot; or the time I was suppose to be having a sales call with the CEO and instead was greeted by their lead engineer with an endless list of questions on how they could build their own cryptocurrency bank. CEO got real nasty when I politely informed him they would have to pay me for my expert advice.<p>They all want something for nothing and get an attitude when I tell them I&#x27;m not going to build them their own cryptocurrency bank for free or for minimal pay.<p>Regret spending so much time on something which has only brought me grief.<p>see: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;bigcompany&#x2F;safewallet" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;bigcompany&#x2F;safewallet</a>
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banealmost 8 years ago
I can&#x27;t get into details, but I worked at a place that was thinking about opening up some development for open source publishing. Another team was working on some very high-end algorithmic work in a specialized field and the company was pumping lots of money into internal R&amp;D for that group. They were selected as an open source test case.<p>They pushed up their code to github and within a few months a group of them had left the company to form a boot-strapped competitor using their same code -- essentially using the open source publication of their tools as a way to legally ex-filtrate corporate IP -- a nightmare scenario for many companies (and also recently in the news i.e. Uber v Waymo).<p>This one act burned all open source publishing plans to the ground and now that company open sources as little software as possible. Now, several years later, they haven&#x27;t published a single line of open source code that I&#x27;m aware of.
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christocracyalmost 8 years ago
I made an open source lib for Cordova (eventually ported to React Native and others). I found I&#x27;d gained a number of users with few contributing back, so I forked my own project, closed the source into compiled and encrypted binaries. Now I sell licenses and support, generating ~$20k&#x2F;month. Innovation has skyrocketed since I&#x27;ve been able to dedicate 100% of my time to the products for the last 2.5 years.
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nathancahillalmost 8 years ago
I maintain a mildly popular JS library on Github. I learned early on to be upfront that helping people with integrations costs me time.<p>I get a handful of emails each day requesting assistance. I direct them to the README, Stackoverflow and this page: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;nathancahill&#x2F;Split.js&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Split.js-Support" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;nathancahill&#x2F;Split.js&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Split.js-Suppo...</a><p>This has worked out well, I&#x27;ve made money off of serious users and avoided a lot of painful back and forth with people who don&#x27;t want to share code.
devjalmost 8 years ago
Lot of comments indicate that the code authors regret making their code open source because somebody rebranded their code or sold it and made money.<p>You always had a choice to stop development in the early stages and: 1) Make it proprietary - Why didn&#x27;t you do it? 2) Have a commercial version - Why didn&#x27;t you do it? 3) Change the license from MIT&#x2F;Apache&#x2F;etc - Why didn&#x27;t you do it? 4) Charge for features&#x2F;support&#x2F;maintenance&#x2F;etc - Why didn&#x27;t you do it?<p>When you use certain OS licenses, you give the permission to its user to do whatever they wish including selling it and therefore, complaining about it later doesn&#x27;t make any sense.<p>Mattermost for example, was APL. Then they changed it to AGPL because they experienced something similar.<p>Gitea was born out of the frustration that the original code was not maintained properly.<p>There are numerous examples like this.<p>So stop complaining and take action else embrace open source with all your heart.<p>When we call software “free,” we mean that it respects the users&#x27; essential freedoms: the freedom to run it, to study and change it, and to redistribute copies with or without changes. This is a matter of freedom, not price, so think of “free speech,” not “free beer.” These freedoms are vitally important. They are essential, not just for the individual users&#x27; sake, but for society as a whole because they promote social solidarity—that is, sharing and cooperation. They become even more important as our culture and life activities are increasingly digitized. In a world of digital sounds, images, and words, free software becomes increasingly essential for freedom in general. - Richard Stallman
Steeevealmost 8 years ago
I regret not making a good deal of software open source. But it&#x27;s a tough decision depending on your market.<p>One of the niches I specialized in was essentially taken over by an influx of offshore resources. It&#x27;s like going into bizzaro world when you go to a meeting on a project and someone else is using your own powerpoint presentation and is doing it wrong. It&#x27;s offensive when you go through project documentation and see that someone else has gotten paid for documents that you wrote for another customer - especially when they are not current.<p>When I began experiencing this kind of thing, I felt confident in my decision _not_ to open source software.<p>But the reality is that my biggest source of pride was given to the world at large. And all these years later I would appreciate having a lot of code which I no longer own in my portfolio. And while there are those who would have poached and pillaged my work, my income would have been minimally affected (or maybe not at all). The fact is that when I operated in that niche, the money I earned was all due to the fact that I was good, not because of any particular piece of software. Having a public portfolio of related software might have even brought in more business.
KirinDavealmost 8 years ago
Yes. I did horrible things at the start of clj-time in my fork. I was so disgusted with my solution I abandoned it.<p>Those decisions got propagated and didn&#x27;t get fixed for a long time. I should have kept it closed and let someone else do it properly, rather than unless abandonware on the world.<p>In fact, come to think of it, I regret everything I&#x27;ve ever open sourced. I can&#x27;t think of even one time it lead to a positive outcome. I can&#x27;t think of even one time it didn&#x27;t lead to a decidedly negative outcome.<p>The same is true of my writing. Every time I&#x27;ve wrote about the advancements of programming, people have made it their goal to oppose it and mock me over it.<p>Lots of people love to talk about how great this community is. But I&#x27;ve never seen our world as much more than a slowly spreading cloud of venom in a larger medium of confusion. I&#x27;ve felt this way ever since the days when I was a kid and the title &quot;hacker&quot; was rigorously gatekept in local and isolated oligarchies.
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calpatersonalmost 8 years ago
One pattern I have seen a few times is that a company develops some important internal piece of software and then later the opens the source code (normally motivated by the notion that other people will contribute to it - which they rarely do).<p>What normally happens next that the company loses control of this software which they probably didn&#x27;t realise was so important to their core business as the employees who worked on it are empowered move to other companies and develop private forks or start up as a micro-ISV&#x2F;contractor business based around providing private forks of the software to clients.<p>I think what people don&#x27;t realise is that most of the legal structure around open source software is for software used by end-users. For internal software the GPL doesn&#x27;t function in the same way: other organisations are more than able to keep private forks and realise all the benefit of the software without contributing back.
neilkalmost 8 years ago
I&#x27;m encountering difficulties right now with a project I open-sourced. Some other people made it a core part of their business, but then I left the company, so I can&#x27;t merge patches to the official branch. And to be honest I don&#x27;t have the time to do this (I work for another growing startup).<p>But it&#x27;s <i>still</i> it&#x27;s one of the best things I have ever done in computing. It was fun, and I got paid to do a kind of pure research, and enhance my own reputation while doing it. My former employer got free patches from very big and talented companies. I&#x27;ve made some interesting connections through this, that&#x27;s for sure.
CJeffersonalmost 8 years ago
I have regretted using the GPL, twice.<p>First time I made a project I wrote myself (a CP solver called Minion) GPL. I now know several companies had interest in it but we&#x27;re afraid to put any GPL in their toolchain. I&#x27;ve never received useful external contributions, so I may as well have used BSD.<p>The second is a project I work on where GPL V2 was chosen. Now some committers have passed away so we are stuck on 2, so can&#x27;t link with other, GPL v3-only code
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prodicusalmost 8 years ago
Nooo. Open source was always something I really believed in. I don&#x27;t have projects which are used by the masses, but the random thanks by a stranger when he finds something I made and open sourced[1] as useful is priceless. But that&#x27;s just me.<p>[1]: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;tasdikrahman&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;tasdikrahman&#x2F;</a>
byuualmost 8 years ago
As a whole, I&#x27;m much more happy that I did than if I hadn&#x27;t.<p>Over the past 13 years, I&#x27;ve been developing console emulators for 12 systems and counting. If my work were closed source, I would not have received patches and contributions from 30+ people and counting. And I wouldn&#x27;t have met several amazing people who ended up becoming very good friends for a very long time. One in particular has been amazing in helping me open up and be less guarded all the time.<p>I was also able to sell one complete commercial license, and received a partial payment for a license from another company that then vanished (I tried to refund the latter, but e-mails to them no longer work.) I&#x27;ve received a very large number of donations over the years. Should be around $5000 in license sales, $7500 in donations, and another $2500 to fundraise hiring a person to decap chips and extract program code from them for improving emulation. I&#x27;ve also had multiple people make very specialized custom hardware that has helped me out more than words can express. I&#x27;ve had people trust me and lend me thousands of dollars worth of rare games for the purpose of verifying information for emulation and then returning them.<p>But I would be lying if I said it was all good. At the time of writing, I am aware of <i>eighteen</i> forks of my emulator. Two of these projects in particular never talk to me or submit upstream fixes, and instead commit changes to their own repository with extremely derogatory remarks about me and my programming skills. Two of these intentionally undermine and sabotage the entire goal of what I&#x27;ve been working on from day one (namely, adding known-incorrect hacks to speed up emulation. My distaste for hacks was the whole reason I got involved with emulation in the first place.)<p>Most of the forks of my software are from versions I released either three and a half years ago, or six years ago. A small number of them are quite popular, meaning my work may as well have been discontinued for those users.<p>One fork collects over $2,000 a month on Patreon off the backs of others&#x27; emulator cores including mine -- even ones that are explicitly non-commercial. One developer just wantonly ignored my GPL license and sells my emulator on Steam, doesn&#x27;t provide any attribution or credit for using my work, and plays games when people try and get the source code to said work (but to be fair, one person did obtain it.) That one was made particularly worse because he wasted a good 20+ hours of my time over the span of six months promising repeatedly to license my emulator, only to back away at the last minute and pull this without even telling me.<p>I&#x27;ve had people very blatantly read through my source code to improve their emulators and documentation, and not just avoid giving me credit, but outright deny having ever looked at my code. In the most egregious case, someone copied a set of opcode mnemonics from a CPU core. Only ... that CPU core was never publicly documented: I made up every single mnemonic myself, and the only place those mnemonics existed were in my source code.<p>I&#x27;ve ended up with two people who have harassed and impersonated me online for six and eleven years respectively now, for reasons I really can&#x27;t comprehend. I&#x27;ve had half the main staff of the most popular emulator out there make a passtime of digging through my 400K-line codebase, looking for individual lines that were poorly written to mock completely out of context in a public chat area -- and they&#x27;re people I still have to work with often.<p>But what I always remind myself is, it&#x27;s easier to dwell on the negatives. It&#x27;s possible I could have made a lot more money with commercial licensing sales if my work were closed source. But my software is vastly better than it would be without all the help I&#x27;ve received over the years due to being open source. And I benefited a lot from other open source emulators, so it would be pretty selfish to not return the favor to others. There&#x27;s no sense in me trying to force people to use my version of my software. I&#x27;d rather have a smaller number of users who actually fully appreciate what I&#x27;m going for. And I have a pretty thick skin at this point for the rest of it.<p>That said, do put as much thought as you can into this before releasing as open source. Once you do so, you can <i>never</i> go back. Even if you try, your work will be forked at the last open source release. But speaking for myself, if I could go back and do it all again, I would still keep everything open source.
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stutsmansoftalmost 8 years ago
I made a Delphi component once. It was immediately modified in ways I disagreed with, renamed, and spread by someone else.<p>The person who did this didn’t even have a conversation with me about it before doing so.<p>This was before GitHub and forking and such, but it made me feel angry and unappreciated.<p>The code that went around was almost entirely my work.<p>I’m still bitter 25 years later and I’ve never contributed to Open Sores again.
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devdadalmost 8 years ago
As a business owner, it&#x27;s much easier for me to have an invoice (for the books) than explaining why I sent money through PayPal. Nothing is impossible, but it&#x27;s more of a hassle for me to donate.<p>We recently started to go through our commercial projects in a structured way and setup a small budget for OSS donations &#x2F; support. Please setup some easy way to just give a receipt for support or anything else I can document. Purchase via CC is okay but I need receipts. :)<p>Thanks to all creators in here that let&#x27;s me keep a much higher development pace.
tyingqalmost 8 years ago
One use case that&#x27;s often regrettable is software targeted at non-tech people. I made a free plug in for a shopping cart platform. Lots of happy users, but the occasional person ranting about how it doesn&#x27;t work for them, and is expecting free troubleshooting and bug fixes on their schedule. A couple spinning into insults and swearing when the answer is &quot;sorry, but I&#x27;m unable to help, maybe try a similar plugin from someone else&quot;.
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Johnny_Brahmsalmost 8 years ago
I have regretted my choice of licences, so now I only go copyleft. That has allowed me to monetize some small libraries with a pretty specific use case. Some companies wont use code they haven&#x27;t got an invoice for.
leeoniyaalmost 8 years ago
i originally open-sourced some interesting algorithms built atop a lib i also open-sourced and realized later when building SaaS that it was unwise to have them open, so i force-pushed a commit that removed them from the repo after seeing that all public forks were out of date and did not have them yet.<p>it helped that the lib never got popular so it was easy to do. there could still be some fork&#x2F;clone somewhere that has them though :)
nvivoalmost 8 years ago
I regret publishing some ideas I had as an open source project. Once it got other people&#x27;s attention I had so much work trying to document, answer issues and maintain the project that in the end I got tired of it all and had to stop. I really loved the project, but open source is a lot of work, and most of it is not development, but choosing who to give attention, trust, etc, you must be prepared for that. If I kept it for myself I would probably still be working on it and would be using it in my work related projects.
richardknopalmost 8 years ago
I haven&#x27;t regretted making anything open source.<p>I do agree with the sentiment expressed here several times. Once my open source project gets popular it seems that there is a flood of incoming bug fix &#x2F; feature requests and it is quite overwhelming.<p>People expect you to just work on the open source library almost as it were your full time job (without a compensation). So that can be frustrating.<p>This problem can be solved by finding skilled contributors who would be willing to work with you on maintaining the project but this can be quite difficult.<p>Let&#x27;s say your project is just reasonably popular (1-2 thousand stars on Github), you will be hard pressed to find willing contributors. It&#x27;s much easier once the project gets very popular (5k stars I guess).<p>It also depends on the language and niche of the library. Might be easier to find contributors in certain languages than others.<p>Having said all that, my open source projects have actually paid me back in a way of interesting work opportunities that I wouldn&#x27;t otherwise stumble upon. And it&#x27;s a nice to have some reasonably well received open source project on your CV.<p>Finally, I would like to shamelessly plug my project: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;RichardKnop&#x2F;machinery" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;RichardKnop&#x2F;machinery</a><p>Core contributors &#x2F; maintainers always welcome!
geekodouralmost 8 years ago
I made a static blog generator based on github (<a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;geekodour&#x2F;gitpushblog" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;geekodour&#x2F;gitpushblog</a>) I thought people will like it, It seems I wasted about 1month making that in my free time. I even wrote a funny blogpost about it in a blog generated by that generator ( <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;geekodour.github.io&#x2F;posts&#x2F;dont-waste-your-time-making-your-own-open-source-project" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;geekodour.github.io&#x2F;posts&#x2F;dont-waste-your-time-makin...</a> )
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pryelluwalmost 8 years ago
A small group of maintainers and me (also oss maintainer) are working on solving oss funding issues. This is not a startup or a pitch. If youd like to join the conversation drop me a line at pryelluw[at]gmail
princekoltalmost 8 years ago
I don&#x27;t know if it counts, but I have decided on not publishing a project I worked on (sporadically) for 14 months either as a binary or as open-source code because of previous experience with a fairly popular open-source software I published a few years ago.<p>People expect you to work full-time on your project and get angry when you don&#x27;t fix bugs. I have enough stress at work, where I&#x27;m paid to do things.<p>That hasn&#x27;t stopped me from making things open-source though, I still enjoy it, and it has caused me to contribute more to other projects.
chafportealmost 8 years ago
Copycats ! I&#x27;ve released a small library to display cross-platform dialogs (because I couldn&#x27;t find what I needed) and 2 weeks later a copy cat released a similar Library&#x2F;API but based on a different approach. In the next years, at least 2 other competing projects joined the party. Mine is tiny file dialogs.
suretecalmost 8 years ago
Not yet. Things we sponsor we always open source. They&#x27;ve always gone further than we ever hoped.
88e282102ae2e5balmost 8 years ago
I&#x27;m glad I did it, but it was definitely more work than I was expecting.
mmiratealmost 8 years ago
Obviously, anyone who made anything popular and permissively-licensed has undergone such regret when corporations scooped it up and used it gratis without contributing anything back.<p>Lesson: if you use a permissive license, you are acknowledging that your work is worth nothing to you. Because that&#x27;s what you&#x27;ll get for it; whereas it may easily be worthwhile to sell a proprietary-licensed binary of your copylefted work.
mherrmannalmost 8 years ago
Not me and not OS but Pieter Levels said he regretted offering an API for Nomad List [1].<p>[1]: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;twitter.com&#x2F;levelsio&#x2F;status&#x2F;861259743603470336" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;twitter.com&#x2F;levelsio&#x2F;status&#x2F;861259743603470336</a>
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arca_voragoalmost 8 years ago
I think the difference between Foss and &quot;open source&quot; should be noted in questions like this.<p>Open source != foss
shmerlalmost 8 years ago
Any particular reason you&#x27;d expect someone to regret it?
fdikalmost 8 years ago
Never.
LeicaLattealmost 8 years ago
Yes