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How Much Equity a Technical Cofounder Should Get

29 pointsby nathanhalmost 15 years ago

19 comments

lionheartedalmost 15 years ago
No, no, no, no. This is exactly the kind of thing a business guy would use to make what should be an exercise in research and negotiation into seeming like it's "scientific". Bullshit. Research and negotiate for what you're worth. This is the biggest mistake I see technical people make with businesspeople - ask for more, don't be meek and buy the business-guy "this is how it is" BS with unnecessary totally subjective fancy charts. And I say this all as a business guy, by the way.<p>Edit: Here's how I'd reply: "That's a great chart, it makes total sense to me, I can see how you'd come up with the 20% number... just from the research I've done on how much exits are usually worth, I'd be looking for something around 30% to come onboard, and I'd expect to work my ass off to be worth that. I'm making pretty good salary right now, but I am really excited about this project - how can we make this work? What would you expect out of me for me to be worth 30% vesting over XYZ timeline?"<p>In other words, don't argue, indicate you've done some research, don't trip the other guy's ego defense mechanism, state what you want simply without grandstanding, focus on delivering value, and then ask what you'd have to do to be worth that. It'll work. Really, unless they were offering something overly fair to begin with to be cool, a businessperson will respect you more if you negotiate with them a bit. Makes you seem like you've got a spine.
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donwalmost 15 years ago
I'd argue that the prototype is worthless, unless it's validated by an active user set and/or profitability, and has been through at least one iteration where features were added or changed.<p>I've seen a good number of technical prototypes built by non-technical people, nominally via outsourcing, and in every case the only path forward was a full rewrite. Crazy interdependency and tight coupling make it easy to build a 'demo' version of a codebase, but they also make it very expensive to bolt on new features.<p>Similarly, I think the percentages are high, and don't account for any business skills that the technical founder brings to the table -- what about a tech guy who's gone through the VC dance, and built successful products in the past?
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YuriNiyazovalmost 15 years ago
This is exactly the reason why NYC is an awful place for technical founders, and part of the reason why I left. Zed Shaw has blogged about this incessantly - even when someone tries to recruit you as a technical cofounder, the usual treatment you get is "Look, you like making technical decisions? Great! All the technical decisions will be yours. You will be my pet technical-decision-making code monkey, here's 10%". Yuck.
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c1sc0almost 15 years ago
What if the technical cofound has contributed significantly to the business idea &#38; is doing more than his share of product development? This chart seems to be unfairly biased towards the non-technical cofounder because it assumes a clear dichotomy between technical &#38; non-technical skills.
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ryanjmoalmost 15 years ago
How exactly does a non-technical co-founder start earning revenue or have over 10K users? Someone must be doing their development? While this situation is possible, it seems unlikely.<p>Also, why do you get extra equity if you have raised VC funds. To me the point of a business is not to raise VC funds but to make money.<p>I also dislike the 'has significant experience or connections'. If you polled every single non-technical co-founder, I'm sure they would insist they have both those things. That is not really quantifiable.<p>I don't think this really makes sense and this will apply to only a very small set of start-ups.<p>I hope no one uses this...
gyardleyalmost 15 years ago
A technical cofounder should get as much equity as he or she is able to negotiate.<p>Technical cofounders end up feeling burnt - or walking away from opportunities feeling like non-technical cofounders are completely delusional jerks - because they don't have as much experience negotiating. When that non-technical cofounder puts an offer of 10% or 20% on the table, he <i>might</i> just be an idiot, but he might be expecting you to press back hard with a counterproposal because that's what <i>he</i> would do in this situation.<p>Instead of working out formulas which will allow you to justify why your equity is what it is, learn to negotiate. The best book I've read is Roger Dawson's 'Secrets of Power Negotiation'. Then, practice.
st3fanalmost 15 years ago
This is the biggest piece of BS that I have ever seen. If you want to work with a reward system then <i>hire</i> someone as an employee and give them a bonus (money, options, whatever) when they reach those goals.<p>Having this sort of stuff between co-founders only builds up pressure, tension and will ultimately lead to people leaving.
knoalmost 15 years ago
This article reminds me of an actual life situation I’m currently living. A friend of mine is an entrepreneur; MBA guy he has under his belt, couple of well funded, failed, heavily tech startup.<p>The guy is very smart and has tons of ideas, most of them requiring a lot of tech implementation. His downfall according to my own analysis: his lack of respect for tech guys, he is stuck with the ninety outsourcing mentality, he basically sees a tech guy as some dude that work can be outsourced anytime to India or any other place in the world.<p>I think a non tech guy, an MBA guy who wants to succeed in Tech startup need to get in trustful and respectful partnership with tech guy(s). Tech guy should have an equity base on how important his contribution really is to the business. With my friend startup I have seen poorly executed tech companies failing miserably despite being well funded.
st3fanalmost 15 years ago
Also, I've been in numerous situations where the technical team (and techie co-founder) deliver time and time again while the non-technical co-founder does not manage to sell or monetize the product. If you want to play the blame game then this should work both ways.
Rickasaurusalmost 15 years ago
Pfffft. I already have a working prototype, with 10k users and I'm only getting 35%? You can take a walk pal.
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chegraalmost 15 years ago
What does the non-technical founder do that the technical founder can't?<p>I have see alot of cases where the biz guy says he has the connect or he will sell the product but when its built, he expects the techie to come along with him and sell it. Or he simply says the connect fell thru.<p>Alot of times I sit and think what would I have a business guy do? Write a business case? Write a marketing plan? Raise capital?<p>Then I say to myself all these can be done by me and more than likely the the biz guy has just as much experience as me in accomplishing these goals.<p>But the point is i'm confused about a biz guy's value.
kravalmost 15 years ago
The guy who builds - he gets half, minimum.
charalmost 15 years ago
I stopped reading this once I saw the huge flow chart. Not only does this over-complicate things, but it is the completely wrong way to allocate equity among founders.<p>I'm a strong believer in founders splitting equity evenly. If you want this technical person to act like a founder, he should get an equal share. If you want an early employee, treat him as an early employee, but don't expect him to work like a founder.
morelikealmost 15 years ago
Add 100k for every engineer on the team, subtract 150k for every MBA on the team.
retubealmost 15 years ago
this is nonsense. the numbers and starting points are completely arbitary. Every business is different, every founder will have different skills and contribute in varying ways and to differing degrees.
anamaxalmost 15 years ago
Here's how to value past work.<p>Imagine that you are sitting in a coffee shop with your biz person. Someone walks up, shows you a prototype and offers to sell it and the idea. For the sake of argument, said someone is selling exactly what the biz person claims is so valuable.<p>How much will you pay for it? How much will your biz person pay for it?<p>That's when you find out that the biz person feels that their contribution going forward is significantly more than yours.
chaostheoryalmost 15 years ago
Unless the non-technical founder has a lot of involvement in the business (e.g. the founder is a designer, the idea is very business development intensive / sales, etc...), I think the chart should be updated to start the tech founder at 95% ownership or more if all that's there is just an idea.<p>Ideas are cheap.
mindcrimealmost 15 years ago
Great, now how about an article that is based on going in the other direction... technical founder has an idea and has it X% implemented ( where X can be 0-whatever) and is seeking a non-technical co-founder to focus on sales/marketing/bizdev/etc?
hooandealmost 15 years ago
Supply and demand applies to equity distribution, whether you're technical or not. If you have skills that are rare for a particular startup, then you should be able to demand a larger share of equity.<p>Every cofounder should get equity based on the question "What is this idea worth without this person?". If you could hire any skilled programmer to replace the technical cofounder, then they shouldn't get a large amount of equity. If they are bringing domain knowledge, specific experience or an uncommon level of expertise, then they should get a lot of equity.
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