TE
TechEcho
Home24h TopNewestBestAskShowJobs
GitHubTwitter
Home

TechEcho

A tech news platform built with Next.js, providing global tech news and discussions.

GitHubTwitter

Home

HomeNewestBestAskShowJobs

Resources

HackerNews APIOriginal HackerNewsNext.js

© 2025 TechEcho. All rights reserved.

DevOps Engineering: Who does your automation?

40 pointsby emcookealmost 15 years ago
Here a brief intro for those that aren't familiar with DevOps: http://www.jedi.be/blog/2010/02/12/what-is-this-devops-thing-anyway/<p>Before being introduced to the concept of DevOps, we at Twilio struggled with what to call the role. It requires a different kind of thinking. To us, DevOps is about automation to improve productivity, reduce risk, and achieve scale. DevOps engineers should always be striving to deprecate themselves. It has been more then 2 year since we founded Twilio and we've never had a sysadmin or an ops person. This has forced us to write better software automation from day one. However, having someone that can provide leadership on DevOps issues (and fundamentally understands distributed systems/CAP/etc) to the whole team is extremely valuable.<p>Configuration management tools like Chef and Puppet are the beginning but a more complete view of infrastructure and service automation (e.g., http://redeyemon.sourceforge.net/) seems inevitable in the long term.<p>We are looking to hire a Lead DevOps engineer. Here is the detailed job description if you know someone that might be interested: http://twilio.jobscore.com/jobs/twilio/devops-engineer/bSHjYWq2Sr37U6eJe4aGWH

5 comments

mmtalmost 15 years ago
Sometimes I wonder if DevOps isn't really just those who would truly prefer to be developers but don't mind sysadmin work and, for whatever reason, started out doing the latter.<p>I, too, cringe a little when I hear the term, perhaps because I've always viewed myself as a "pure" sysadmin. That is, this is the kind of work which continues to bring me joy after 2 decades. Application development, on the other hand, despite an ability to code, does not.<p>CM tools (current and their predecessors like cfengine) as they tend to be implemented strike me as a way of avoiding administering the whole <i>system</i>, by focusing on a single component (servers) and reducing them to a lowest common denominator.<p>It also fits the pattern of trying to solve problems entirely in a custom software solution, a trait I associate with developers, not sysadmins. This is the source of my inference of DevOps' true leanings.<p>The reality is that the system consists of considerably more than fungible servers[1]. There's the underlying hardware, the peripheral hardware like disks, database software[2], network hardware and configuration, and service providers.<p>These are all traditional sysadmin areas, with <i>plenty</i> of room for professional growth and overall benefit. So much so, that I have difficulty imagining why any SA (not a developer in SA's clothing) would wish to do more dev at the expense of increaaed mastery of the infrastructure.<p>By way of example, something I wrote on LinkedIn, in response to why I'm not a fan of puppet:<p><pre><code> I'm uncomfortable with any system that attempts to maintain state in place on a running system, as well as possibly override the native packaging ethos. That the client takes its own local file inventory on a fresh system, rather than trusting the one the package manager has, is wasteful at best. What's worse, to me, is that it creates yet another system to administer. I haven't yet found anything similarly suitable for the Ubuntu/Debian world, but I very much liked Cobbler a couple years ago, as it was primarily a wrapper for what could otherwise be standard, standalone services (kickstart, package repo). Even without such a wrapper, yum/rpm or apt/dpkg can do nearly all the work" </code></pre> [1] Virtualization and "cloud" notwithstanding, as anyone who's experienced an outage with a hosting provider or an i/o perofrmance issue with a cloud server can attest.<p>[2] Which can be like an encapsulated OS itself
chuhnkalmost 15 years ago
Yea I think like some the term DevOps makes me cringe as well since people use it as a job title when it should be more thought of like agile development, just another term to describe a process of working.<p>I use chef because I needed a way to consistently deploy software in exactly the same way every time to multiple servers. A repeatable deployment process that scales. Why did I pick chef over puppet or cfengine? Because I also wanted to learn ruby and the entire thing is in ruby, win. Plus we have a ruby on rails team in the office, if ever I needed a hand, they were there or if they wanted to write recipes to deploy software thats not an issue either.<p>DevOps is just a new buzz word. My title is System Administrator. I have a depth of knowledge in the infrastructure of all our technologies and how they are interconnected. I know how to deploy, maintain, scale and do it all over again. My knowledge in programming in second to that but is necessary to automate repetitive processes. DevOps I guess is being classed as a way to bring the IT team together, making sys admins and developers aware of each others "agendas" when it comes to running apps on servers. I as a sys admin have to understand what each of our applications does throughout its life cycle, from the browser right down to the database. Because if something goes wrong, I'll be the first to figure out where that happened and relay this back to the developer. By understanding core functionality of the code I can make it clear to the developer, "look you are executing a query on the database thats scanning millions of rows because its not using an index, its occurring in this controller in your code". We are seeing this term DevOps be classified now as more and more startups are emerging, because its essentially alot easier to execute in a startup environment where everyone is talking to each other to roll things out, everyone is trying to solve problems together. In large companies you'll see a massive separation and segregation along with processes to keep people in their place and slow results.<p>I hope that all makes sense. DevOps as a process is not new, the classification of it as this term is.
fragmedealmost 15 years ago
Linky - <a href="http://www.jedi.be/blog/2010/02/12/what-is-this-devops-thing-anyway/" rel="nofollow">http://www.jedi.be/blog/2010/02/12/what-is-this-devops-thing...</a><p>Call it what you will, 'DevOps' is just what you'd expect a <i>good</i> sysadmin to do in a sufficiently large org. That there is on going friction between developers and sysadmin ("it works on my box" is a valid excuse?) is perhaps a larger sign of the culture and people involved.
评论 #1552146 未加载
评论 #1551930 未加载
评论 #1552107 未加载
评论 #1552337 未加载
评论 #1552240 未加载
gaiusalmost 15 years ago
40 years ago IBM called these guys "systems programmers". That this is a new concept to some people is symptomatic of a wider problem in the industry: everything needs to be shiny and new so every 10 years we reinvent the wheel with new jargon.
评论 #1555565 未加载
nordgrenalmost 15 years ago
There is a bit of the same movement in CCP Games where I work, it's not called DevOps here, but there are groups forming in both the EVE Online software team and the Core technology group with an engineering focus on QA, which in practice translates pretty well to the DevOps style of thinking about the needs for this type of development and quality work. Here's one of the advertised positions for example:<p><a href="http://www.ccpgames.com/en/jobs/job-details.aspx?jobid=101" rel="nofollow">http://www.ccpgames.com/en/jobs/job-details.aspx?jobid=101</a>