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Microsoft disables Spectre mitigations as Intel’s patches cause instability

757 pointsby tomtoiseover 7 years ago

29 comments

zingmarsover 7 years ago
These updates most definitely could've been handled better. I was having a busy week with exams and I get a call about around 10 machines not booting (this was before the announcement). Sure enough, last thing everyone reported was updating. I call the supplier and apparently they have reports of at least 2000 machines (at that moment) that had to be reimaged across the city (from what I could tell, all were older AMD PCs) because of this dumb update. I was used to not being to able to trust software, but if I can't trust hardware now either, farming does suddenly appear much more appealing.
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tjoffover 7 years ago
I lost many hours over this last week. The system was unable to boot and finally a thread on reddit came to the rescue ( <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.reddit.com&#x2F;r&#x2F;techsupport&#x2F;comments&#x2F;7sbihd&#x2F;howto_fix_inaccessible_boot_device_caused_by&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.reddit.com&#x2F;r&#x2F;techsupport&#x2F;comments&#x2F;7sbihd&#x2F;howto_f...</a> ).<p>This actually made the system boot but there are some leftovers being installed on first boot that I&#x27;ve been unable to disable that also causes the system to be unable to boot.<p>So now, the machine is running but as soon as it is restarted we have to re-image the disk, go through the process of manually removing patches, and then pray that we don&#x27;t have a power shortage as we&#x27;d have to do everything yet again on next boot.<p>I&#x27;m not convinced that this patch will solve the issue either, because if this updates requires a reboot the fix won&#x27;t be installed if we can&#x27;t boot. I might try to install this update from the recovery console see if that works.<p>Quite frustrating.
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cesarbover 7 years ago
In a related development, there are proposed patches to the Linux kernel (not yet merged) to blacklist the broken microcode updates: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.spinics.net&#x2F;lists&#x2F;kernel&#x2F;msg2707159.html" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.spinics.net&#x2F;lists&#x2F;kernel&#x2F;msg2707159.html</a><p>That patch disables the use by the kernel of the new IBPB&#x2F;IBRS features provided by the updated microcode, when it&#x27;s of a &quot;known bad&quot; revision. Since Linux prefers the &quot;retpoline&quot; mitigation instead of IBRS, and AFAIK so far the upstream kernel (and most of the backports to stable kernels) doesn&#x27;t use IBPB yet, that might explain why Linux seems to have been less affected by the microcode update instabilities than Windows.<p>Also interesting: that patch has a link to an official Intel list of broken microcode versions.
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ComodoHackerover 7 years ago
&gt;However, Intel does not appear too concerned that the incident will affect its bottom line - the company expects 2018 to be a record year in terms of revenue<p>There is an interesting paradox in our industry. If you pay enough attention (read: money) to security, you will be late to the market, your costs will be high and you lose profit. If you don&#x27;t pay enough attention, you take the market, get your profits, but your product (be it hardware or software) and reputation will be screwed later. And worst of all: there&#x27;s never enough attention to security.<p>So by simple logic, an optimal strategy is to forge your product quickly, take your profits within a [relatively] short period and vanish from the market. I guess we&#x27;ll see this strategy executed from IoT vendors when market start to punish them for their bad sec.<p>For Intel, that &quot;long period&quot; just happened to be REALLY long.
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stinosover 7 years ago
&quot;Here&#x27;s a patch&quot; - &quot;Here&#x27;s a patch to disable that other patch&quot; - ...<p>What&#x27;s next? Repeat? Sounds like this could turn into a maintainance nightmare quickly. Also because I&#x27;ve introduced things like that myself in the past, and that was for normal applications and not a kernel or OS. Somewhere, someday, there&#x27;s usually this one exception for which none of your rules hold true and the thing blows up in your face. Anyway, I&#x27;d love to see the actual code for this. Not a chance probably?
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PerusingAroundover 7 years ago
I&#x27;m amazed on how Intel&#x27;s stock price still keeps going UP, despite all these problems... just WOW.
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HugoDanielover 7 years ago
So much for the embargo period. I guess the bsd people were not so wrong after all. They might as well just had published it as soon as it was found.
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tallanvorover 7 years ago
By my reading of the article, Microsoft is disabling some mitigations for Spectre due to instabilities that Intel&#x27;s microcode update have been causing.<p>Intel certainly isn&#x27;t making any friends these days...
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notspanishfluover 7 years ago
It is not only Microsoft reverting this patch. HP, Dell or Red Hat are doing that as well.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.bleepingcomputer.com&#x2F;news&#x2F;microsoft&#x2F;microsoft-issues-windows-out-of-band-update-that-disables-spectre-mitigations&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.bleepingcomputer.com&#x2F;news&#x2F;microsoft&#x2F;microsoft-is...</a>
mosselmanover 7 years ago
So what can I do for my next self-built pc? Get some AMD equipment, or is that not enough?
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megaman22over 7 years ago
I&#x27;ve not been impressed with my Windows 10 installations of late. All my machines that don&#x27;t have the Long Term Servicing Branch have had wild instabilities and performance issues the past few months - crazy things, like the task manager taking minutes to launch, and the whole shell periodically crashing. The Fall Creators Update was so bad I had to wipe and start over on some boxes. It&#x27;s not engendering a lot of confidence in their competence of late.
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nippplesover 7 years ago
Gee, if only they had a Linus Torvalds type around to block irresponsible commits.
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Thimothyover 7 years ago
I never got them. The last update in my windows is from Dec 2017. My antivirus is compliant, the registry key correctly set up and yet it refuses to update.<p>I still haven&#x27;t had the time to debug it, but I wonder how many people are out there with their OS silently refusing to update.
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speedieover 7 years ago
So , Linus was right for cursing at Intel ?
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ohiovrover 7 years ago
My brother was hit by a recent update to Windows 7 that prevented the machine from booting. He went to Microcenter to buy a hard drive. There were a lot of people doing the same thing for the same reason when he was there.
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shultaysover 7 years ago
Amount of fuck-up in this whole issue is mind blowing. I am getting more surprised with every new I get
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bartlover 7 years ago
&gt;Intel, AMD and Apple face class action lawsuits over the Spectre and Meltdown vulnerabilities.<p>I sure hope Intel will face a class action suit over this botched update. Many professionals have wasted countless hours dealing with this junk.
cjsukover 7 years ago
Not what I wanted to wake up to this morning. I suspect we’re in for a rough ride for a long time thanks to this mess.
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chrisperover 7 years ago
Just checked for Updates, but there don&#x27;t seem to be any?
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mm-vorticesoftover 7 years ago
Linus was right
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debtover 7 years ago
I mean, is this an unmitigated disaster on Intel&#x27;s part? It&#x27;s like a train wreck in slow motion.<p>A part of me feels this stories like this are going to keep getting worse until Spectre is finally used in the wild.
dsignover 7 years ago
What a mess!<p>The day this blew up we rented our first physical server for the express purpose of running secure critical workloads in unpatched environments. Yes, I know that there is nothing secure, but not everything we do is running a chunk of logic uploaded by an attacker, so we will take our chances.
hi41over 7 years ago
What does the Spectre bug mean for a person planning to buy a new windows computer? Should I buy an AMD CPU based computer instead of an Intel based computer?
Roritharrover 7 years ago
I&#x27;m pretty sure these patches were responsible for my notebook crashing everytime i hooked it up to our Thunderbolt 3 Dockingstations.
kuonover 7 years ago
Anybody know what is the status of FreeBSD? I googled a bit and found nothing except &quot;we wait&quot;, is it still the case?
mehrdadnover 7 years ago
Anyone know if people who had disabled the mitigations via FeatureSettingsOverride = 3 were still affected?
mark_l_watsonover 7 years ago
A more accurate title would be that Microsoft disabled the specter mitigation’s due to a flawed Intel update, right? I thought this was all Microsoft’s fault until getting half way through the article.
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rootw0rmover 7 years ago
Ugh, is this the cause of the weird bugchecks I&#x27;ve been having this week? Just gave myself 64gb page file and enabled full memory dumps so I could track it down in WinDbg. I always forget something on fresh installs...
IanSandersover 7 years ago
Meanwhile Intel stock is at 5 year highest