About a year ago, I quit my job at Apple because I wasn't able to apply my technical skills in my role and I was not successful in transferring to another department (full blog post: <a href="http://minimaxir.com/2017/05/leaving-apple/" rel="nofollow">http://minimaxir.com/2017/05/leaving-apple/</a> | HN discussion: <a href="https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14270897" rel="nofollow">https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14270897</a>)<p>Despite the loss of a salary and <i>frustration</i> in getting another job (Tweetstorm about data science job hunting: <a href="https://twitter.com/minimaxir/status/951117788835278848" rel="nofollow">https://twitter.com/minimaxir/status/951117788835278848</a>), quitting was 100% the correct move in retrospect.
Yeesh, the mindwash is strong. I had a hard time continuing to read this post after the Prestige by Association section. Working at a respected company known for cutting edge work is generally a good sign but it does not make you an Internet God or widen my eyes.<p>It is like saying you went to Harvard or MIT. That's neat. You are probably reasonably intelligent. However, even that isn't an automatic and I'll reserve judgement until I've made my own assessment.
The OP has joined Facebook in June 2013. Assuming he has 3+ years of experience in Microsoft he must have been hired at Facebook at L4 which puts his salary as 135k + 250K (stock, may be more when Seattle office was just getting started).<p>Facebook stock was ~$25 in June 2013 which means he has got 10000 RSUs of Facebook while joining. Value of this stock today is around $1.5M.
He is in Seattle and his taxes are way low compared to CA.<p>OP must have been scoring refreshers ($40k (Jan 2014), $100k(Jan 2015), $150k(Jan 2016). Let's assume has around $300K of vested stocks.<p>OP has made $1.8M in stocks at Facebook and may be some good bonuses and quitting Facebook after has vested his initial grant.<p>You shouldn't quit Top Tier tech jobs period unless you're this author who has made >2M.<p>At the growing pace of FB, Google and Amzn, anyone quitting at L5 levels will learn that they could have ended up as Director in 6-8 years if they work hard in these firms.
Let me bring a non SV perspective. A lot of people seem to forget that most developers live outside of SV where the salary vs cost of living makes just as much sense.<p>1. For a software Engineer who has kept their skills up and lives in a major metropolitan area, it doesn't take 2 years to get a job. It usually takes me about two weeks.<p>2. Who defines themselves by their job? A job is just a way for me to pay my bills. I go to work, come home and twice a month money appears in my account - no more no less. But see #1 about keeping your skills marketable.<p>The framework I use for leaving a job is simple. There are three reasons to leave a job - technology, environment, and money.<p>Technology - if you're learning marketable technology, I can deal with a not so great environment and a below market salary for awhile. Once I build my resume, I can leave for more money. On the other hand, don't stay at a company no matter how good the money is if it will cause your skills to atrophy. You leave yourself vulnerable and you cut off optionslity.<p>Environment - if I can find another job with a better environment, make the same amount of money and move forward technologically. I'll leave. Life is too short to stick with an environment that you hate.<p>Money - All other things being equal, why not make as much money as you can? I don't want to be in management but if I can make a significant amount more money doing what I enjoy, why not?<p>I've been hopping jobs for 10 years after staying at one company 9 years when I should have left after 2. But now, I'm starting to get the job hopping stench about my resume and I'm near the top for my local market. It would be counter productive for me to leave by choice in less than 3 years.
This may be the only 2 word "How To" I've ever written:<p>Just quit.<p><pre><code> 1. It's a job, not your life.
2. It's a company, not a person.
3. "Top Tier" means neither.
4. If you were hit by a bus, they'd cry for 7 minutes and never think about you again.
5. "My work is my reference." is my standard response to that request. It works. To those who matter.
6. Moving on can skyrocket your growth when done properly. Listen to your gut.
7. "I stagnate easily." is my standard response to "Why so many jobs?"
8. You'll probably be surprised how underwhelmed they are.
9. You'll probably be surprised how much energy you wasted over this.
10. You'll definitely be glad it's over.
</code></pre>
I've quit 80 times (including contracts and customers). No regrets about how I've done it (except for agonizing over it early in my career). I've grown almost every time.<p>No one from work cares about you nearly as much as you care about your work. Don't make this so complicated.<p>You have personal relationships you'll miss and don't want to hurt. If that bothers you, quit over beer.
So much salt in this thread. I for one, enjoyed the article. Walking away from a high-paying, generally respected job is not a easy decision for a lot of people and there are a lot of consequences to consider.<p>I think this writeup addresses them (to varying degrees of success), even if they don't apply to everyone and some folks may think they're arrogant.
It's amazing that there is a widespread tendency in Googlers to think Google is "the best place" and moving is a downgrade (i.e. <i>fear of missing out, where do I go after this</i>), while at the same time many Facebook employees feel exactly the same towards their employer and think moving is likely a downgrade (my friend who left FB to Snap told me that he had that feeling but now that he has moved he sees Snap as clearly better). These feelings cannot simultaneously be true, which shows the Kool-Aid is powerful indeed, and I think systematic and intentional in nature. At least for Facebook, they have an explicit propaganda ministry, <i>ehem...</i>, <i>Analog Research Lab</i>, actively working toward instating this feeling with posters and stuff.
How about just quitting because you don't get good work (whatever that definition might be)?<p>I find it hard to believe that most people in so called "top tier" tech companies do compelling work. Not everyone gets to work on de jour areas, most people work on maintenance and improving old code bases (BTW, there is nothing wrong with this)
> Being told something like "you are intrinsically amazing and working here proves it" flatters in a deep existential way but also insidiously creates a dependence on that validation.<p>Well that hit home.
I also quit fb in 2017. A large part was the arrogant attitude shared by many of my young peers like OP. Another factor was the over-sweetened coolaid. Fb is not the end-all, be all. It's a great place, sure, but there are smart teams and people everywhere. I couldn't finish the article.
"Your legal status in the country does not depend on your continued employment. If it does, stay away from this train of thought. The destination is a depressing and harsh realization."<p>Its sad - but most of us are out at this point..nothing more to add.
I quit my job around two weeks ago (post: <a href="https://danshumway.com/blog/leaving-oracle/" rel="nofollow">https://danshumway.com/blog/leaving-oracle/</a>). I'm mostly working on Open Source now, might expand to contracting in the future.<p>It was not an easy decision to make; I don't know if that's because of the culture I was in or just because of me. What eventually pushed me was realizing that it wasn't an all or nothing venture; the most realistic worst case scenario is that I flesh out my portfolio, learn a bunch of skills, and then join another company via a better resume.<p>I disagree about a lot here though. 2 years of income is unnecessarily lavish for most people. If you've worked at a reputable company for a few years, the "prestige" will follow you. No one will care if you worked there for 3 years or 4.
"I will be resigning effective two weeks from now. Let me know what I can do in the meantime totrain my replacement or otherwise smooth the transition."<p>Done.
> <i>you have enough savings to last at least two years.</i><p>I've always heard it as being 6 months. Especially with his next point assuming you can certainly find employment.<p>Or maybe that's what I chose to remember, because I'm lucky enough to work in a high-employment sector in a region that can't fill enough positions: i.e. my profile is in high demand.<p>(... for now. I know)
You know, in this day in age you really need to give more then a two weeks notice. Maybe 6 weeks or more. I've had to fire clients before by giving notice and I always try to work out the best possible scenario where the least amount of damage is done. I even had to deal with yelling, screaming, threats of lawsuits. I always keep my cool and do everything I can to de-escalate the situation, stay professional, etc and try to minimize damage. Every single time this has happened I get some kind of contact or letter of appreciation thanking me for keeping things professional no matter how bad things got. It just makes me feel better as a person to know that I did everything I could to minimize potential damages and to seek the best possible scenario.
There is nothing different about quitting a job at a brand name than most other places except in people asking you "You worked for WHO? WHY?????" And issues regarding bonuses and stock award vests.<p>Unless you came to such a company through a visa. Things get harder when the implication of quitting is "get shipped right back to where you came from."
Oh good lord. If you want to quit a job, quit it. Top tier tech is no different to anything else. OP should have titled this post "How to not realise you're having an existential crisis and respond to it by massively over-complicating a very simple career decision."
This is one of those posts that should really be written in the first person, perhaps titled "How I decided to quit my job at Facebook".<p>Although I work in the same industry as this person, my point of view couldn't be more different. None of this is useful to me and I don't know what he is talking about.<p>It's presumptuous to assume others share your viewpoint and values. It feels like he is living in a bubble, which is not an uncommon criticism of Silicon Valley employees.
Most people who want to quit, will. It is more a question of when. There are many valid reasons for sticking around a while -- to try to invoke change, waiting on vesting, set up your next move, etc. But I have talked to very few people who, in hindsight, wish they had stayed longer. Most people who quit, when looking back... they wonder why they ever stayed so long in the first place.
The article is blocked for me, but writing a blog about why you quit and what you plan to do next seems to be pretty effective. Any insider blog or article about FANG seems to do well, but one's which describe why a person DOES NOT want to work there have increased likelihood of going viral. I'm sure those writers get flooded immediately by recruiters and the like.
For some reason, I was so sure it was a sarcastic post, that while clicking to read it I was already half-smiling imagining the first topic would be:<p>- <i>"First, make sure you write a public post announcing to the world that you quit Facebook/Google. What's the point of quiting if you can't tell anyone??"</i><p>Imagine how disappointed I was.
Quitting a top tier tech job isn't the difficult part. The difficult part is figuring out what to do next.<p>I quit my job as a Head of R&D for a major tech/publishing company and started <a href="https://tradedash.io" rel="nofollow">https://tradedash.io</a> (crypto desktop trading platform) with an old friend of mine who also quit his job as one of the first employees in a major fintech unicorn. For both of us, it was hands down the best decision we've ever made career wise.<p>For years we were depressed, working jobs that we didnt value only for nothing other than the money and stability. Even though I make a whole lot less today, I haven't had a single night where I don't sleep like a baby. Quitting our jobs was the easy part once we figured out what it is that we wanted to do.<p>For anyone looking to quit their job: figure out what to do next. Once you know what you want to do, everything else will become much easier.
> "I stopped having a career vision for myself for the last year or so of my tenure at Facebook, for no particular reason."<p>Author cites "career vision" as motivation for leaving, but why no moral qualms about working at Facebook?
Beyond 2 years salary in savings, one should also factor in the cost of medical insurance. One bad accident or illness will eat that savings account in a heartbeat.
How to Quit? really?<p>"Hey Jerry, got a min? Look, I don't think this is working out. Here is my letter of resignation, and my two week notice. Thank you."<p>Done!<p>How hard is that to do? There is nothing holding you in chain in that job unless you are actually being held in chain in that job, at which point you should seriously analyze your life choices.
> If your company's reputation can widen the eyes of everybody you meet when they learn where you work, your company has given you a very powerful perk.<p>But you worked at FB, so everyone knows you're just a PHP monkey. j/k
Relevant XKCD?<p><a href="https://xkcd.com/1768/" rel="nofollow">https://xkcd.com/1768/</a><p>I was able to bide my time and leave at just the right time.
I find the only people whose eyes go wide almost popping out of their head are younger people just entering the workforce whom may have never met someone who works at a big company whose products they use everyday (or recruiters I guess). It's like you're a celebrity to them. Hell, some of these kids used to get pumped when I was telling them I was merely heading to some Apple conference or Google I/O.<p>No one with experience in the industry gives two shits even if you worked at Facebook, Google and Apple, because they have no illusions about what it means to work there or what it must say about you.