TE
TechEcho
Home24h TopNewestBestAskShowJobs
GitHubTwitter
Home

TechEcho

A tech news platform built with Next.js, providing global tech news and discussions.

GitHubTwitter

Home

HomeNewestBestAskShowJobs

Resources

HackerNews APIOriginal HackerNewsNext.js

© 2025 TechEcho. All rights reserved.

Don’t Fix Facebook, Replace It

402 pointsby jenkinsjabout 7 years ago

34 comments

vinniejamesabout 7 years ago
We did replace it, almost 10 years ago. It was called Diaspora[1], no one cared about privacy then. No one really cares about privacy now, at least not enough to do anything about it.<p>1. <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.m.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Diaspora_(social_network)" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.m.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Diaspora_(social_network)</a>
评论 #16762680 未加载
评论 #16762543 未加载
评论 #16762720 未加载
评论 #16763132 未加载
评论 #16763958 未加载
评论 #16762854 未加载
评论 #16763174 未加载
评论 #16763213 未加载
评论 #16770663 未加载
评论 #16769012 未加载
评论 #16762096 未加载
评论 #16764127 未加载
评论 #16761998 未加载
评论 #16766017 未加载
评论 #16767307 未加载
评论 #16766139 未加载
sidcoolabout 7 years ago
I tried explaining my 20 year old cousin about FB. Her constant argument was &quot;I don&#x27;t share anything private on FB&quot;. She checks in on FB everywhere she goes. Posts her pics all the time. I could not instill any sense of concern for privacy.<p>What I could conclude is that the appeal of social is too great to have any caution. Call me a pessimist, but I don&#x27;t think FB is going anywhere. People will keep using it inspite of the risks. It&#x27;s like a smoking addiction. It&#x27;s bad but very difficult to give up.
评论 #16762088 未加载
评论 #16761915 未加载
评论 #16766566 未加载
评论 #16762016 未加载
评论 #16762734 未加载
评论 #16762419 未加载
评论 #16764437 未加载
jamestimminsabout 7 years ago
It&#x27;s interesting that Tim Wu discussed the cycle of technology starting amongst outsiders and then becoming monopolized in his (phenomenal) book The Master Switch. The cycle always repeats itself by the next new technology coming along, making the prior one less significant.<p>We seem to have accepted that the internet is essentially the final communication tech. Maybe that&#x27;s true, but it seems improbable. Simply based on his past writing, I&#x27;m surprised he isn&#x27;t advocating for a solution based on the blockchain.<p>I&#x27;m not suggesting that&#x27;s the right answer; I merely find it curious that he didn&#x27;t apply the same assumptions to the future as he did to his historical analysis.
评论 #16761145 未加载
评论 #16761552 未加载
评论 #16762729 未加载
jjrhabout 7 years ago
I think in the long run we will use a decentralised&#x2F;federated system. Privacy concerns aside, it just doesn&#x27;t make sense to rely on one service or expect one social network to meet everyone&#x27;s needs&#x2F;desires.
评论 #16760454 未加载
评论 #16760572 未加载
评论 #16761372 未加载
评论 #16763100 未加载
p49kabout 7 years ago
Has anyone seen a product that was functional, polished, and enjoyable to use that would be capable of replacing Facebook? I haven&#x27;t. Diaspora, Mastodon, Ello are the only things that I can think of, and none of them come close to matching the basic functionality and the &quot;it just works&quot; factor of Facebook.<p>Maybe someone should put in some resources to create a polished product and see what happens? It doesn&#x27;t even have to be some idealistic p2p distributed system or anything like that, just a company who actively works to minimize the data they store and to allow users to control and manage their data effectively.
评论 #16767138 未加载
评论 #16763946 未加载
评论 #16763066 未加载
评论 #16763506 未加载
评论 #16763121 未加载
vijaybrittoabout 7 years ago
&quot;Another “alt-Facebook” could be a nonprofit that uses that status to signal its dedication to better practices, much as nonprofit hospitals and universities do&quot; -&gt; Honestly, I don&#x27;t think this would be sustainable to function as a social network. At least I don&#x27;t think it would work in a capitalist society.
评论 #16764056 未加载
评论 #16764418 未加载
gvurrdonabout 7 years ago
The only possible thing for which I might need Facebook would be for groups, as some hobbies seem to have almost entirely moved there for event organisation and general discussion.<p>Previously we used to use forums such as phpBB, but setting up one of these involved finding someone able to host the forum software on their server. Tapatalk could be set up to improve the mobile experience, but most users seemed to find that somehow difficult. There was also a constant battle with spam and malware.<p>I&#x27;m not sure what would suit - Mastodon and Diaspora don&#x27;t seem to me to be the right solutions here. Currently, I am making do with being out of the loop and missing things.
ohiovrabout 7 years ago
I think we need alternatives to text only communication. If we could judge each other&#x27;s tones maybe we would chill out a bit.
评论 #16761424 未加载
评论 #16760929 未加载
pi-squaredabout 7 years ago
I wonder what is the penetration of these kind of news outside our bubble here at HN, reddit and the like. I&#x27;m wondering the rest 2 billion people (which to a first approximation is probably just about everybody) care about this or are willing to care if few of their techie friends leave facebook. Is there some mathematical model + social science that could estimate the network effects of say, every techie person does leave facebook for good - what would happen to the rest?<p>Most of my non-techie friends have heard briefly about &quot;some kind of scandal with facebook&quot; but I cannot possibly appeal to them talking about &quot;privacy&quot; or they are stealing and selling your data - &quot;Oh, everybody does that, you can&#x27;t not use the Internet&quot;.
评论 #16763060 未加载
908087about 7 years ago
I find Zuckerberg&#x27;s argument that Facebook needs to be the way it is so that &quot;people who can&#x27;t afford it can have access&quot; pretty repulsive and incredibly sleazy.<p>If people can&#x27;t afford a few dollars a month, why in the fuck would it be acceptable to expose them to manipulative ads that encourage them to hand over money that Zuckerberg claims they don&#x27;t have? He tries to paint himself and his company as altruistic, while simultaneously exploiting the hell out of the people he claims to be &quot;helping&quot;.
jenkinsjabout 7 years ago
I&#x27;m captivated by the phrase &quot;free content (sic) is the creature, the servant and indeed the prostitute of merchandizing&quot;. -Walter Lippmann
heisnotanalienabout 7 years ago
Why can&#x27;t I just pay for FB a monthly fee and as such they have no need to make money by selling my data or spamming me with crappy ads?
评论 #16762764 未加载
评论 #16762582 未加载
评论 #16763548 未加载
ntnsndrabout 7 years ago
I briefly spoke with Wu some weeks ago about platform cooperativism. I suppose he wasn&#x27;t impressed.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.vice.com&#x2F;en_us&#x2F;article&#x2F;qvxbgq&#x2F;its-time-for-mark-zuckerberg-to-give-up-control-of-facebook" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.vice.com&#x2F;en_us&#x2F;article&#x2F;qvxbgq&#x2F;its-time-for-mark-...</a>
supermattabout 7 years ago
What a naive article!<p>The reality is that we can either have a paid-for walled garden so that bad actors cant leach data, or a decentralised and trust-driven network.<p>It only takes a &quot;friend&quot; using a nefarious client&#x2F;implementation to send all your data to a 3rd party.
评论 #16763052 未加载
chxabout 7 years ago
Better will be <i>hard</i>. If you want people to come, you need to build something that Facebook doesn&#x27;t provide. I have no idea what that will be but I do not think just privacy protection would be enough. By far.
narvenabout 7 years ago
Do we really need another crap to replace it? just shut it down.
herbstabout 7 years ago
Why even replace it? Pseudo chronological single wall views are simply not a modern way to consume information anymore.<p>Not to mention, which crazy brain even proposed to fix it?
jenkinsjabout 7 years ago
I don&#x27;t necessarily agree with the sentiment but respect Dr. Wu&#x27;s option. I&#x27;m also interested in the HN community&#x27;s options.
jacinaboxabout 7 years ago
A quick research job has revealed that most of the interesting features of facebook, in particular &quot;liking&quot; posts and friend suggestion, are patented by facebook. It would be difficult therefore for a new entrant to copy its features.
评论 #16761943 未加载
yy77about 7 years ago
If privacy is really a concern, one should live like Jack Reacher, even not use credit card. Current situation is that, we want to happy share and attract attention on facebook. If it did something wrong, let the court sues it.
ravenstineabout 7 years ago
NY Times was among the numerous media companies that slobbered over Facebook for years and gave them free publicity. And now I&#x27;m supposed to listen to them when they say to replace Facebook.
billconanabout 7 years ago
I think my ideal social network would be something like reddit + medium + slack.<p>and it will be for expanding my social network and finding people alike, not for watching daily bullshit from existing friends.
jyriandabout 7 years ago
Orkut, please come back.
nso95about 7 years ago
It will neither be fixed or replaced
评论 #16762719 未加载
pcuniteabout 7 years ago
I don&#x27;t want my stuff in the &quot;cloud&quot;, I want it shared from my lawn. My own personal space to where people can access my stuff, that I share, and we can converse over whatever that is ... my own GDPR rules.
评论 #16761374 未加载
naskwoabout 7 years ago
For photo sharing, I set up www.famipix.com in 2005...
feelin_googleyabout 7 years ago
Prof. Wu makes a couple of assumptions when he gives suggestions for Facebook alternatives or successors. I dont see those suggestions as the most important point of his argument however. I believe the most important point is that there must be competition, that trying to &quot;fix&quot; Facebook will not suffice.<p>Nonetheless, these are the assumptions I see:<p>1. The software alternatives or successors <i>must be commercial</i>.<p>2. The software must attract a <i>certain quantity of users</i> to be viable.<p>3. The software must enable networks <i>comprising large numbers of people</i>, perhaps in the millions or billions.<p>This scale is far greater than the average size of any Facebook users group of friends.<p>Over the years Facebook may have morphed into a &quot;public square&quot; for exercising &quot;Free Speech&quot; but in the beginning as I recall it was <i>not</i> a means to broadcast to other users outside of ones social circle.<p>Its primary utility is arguably still in enabling communication within small groups, <i>not</i> enabling broadcasting to the general public.<p>Wu&#x27;s assumptions point toward a Zuckerberg-like <i>centrally-managed</i> approach to what I see as historically a <i>locally-managed</i> activity: the human tendency to form <i>small groups</i>.<p>For many years, gamers and others have been writing software to enable small groups to communicate over peer-to-peer networking, without any funding from advertisers.<p>Wu writes, &quot;So what stands in the way of a genuine Facebook alternative? <i>It isn&#x27;t the technology</i>.&quot;<p>Thats exactly right. IMHO.
评论 #16761505 未加载
评论 #16761480 未加载
feelin_googleyabout 7 years ago
&quot;Poll: Do you trust Facebook?<p>...<p>THIS MORNING, IT emerged that nearly 45,000 Irish Facebook profiles may have been affected by the giant data breach involving as many as 87 million accounts harvested by UK data intelligence firm Cambridge Analytica.<p>Those 45,000 accounts could have been breached due to just 15 Irish people accessing a questionnaire app, thisisyourdigitallife, which included in its permissions the granting of access to all an individual&#x27;s friends&#x27; profiles.&quot;<p>Source:<p><a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.thejournal.ie&#x2F;poll-do-you-trust-facebook-3941194-Apr2018&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.thejournal.ie&#x2F;poll-do-you-trust-facebook-3941194-...</a>
feelin_googleyabout 7 years ago
&quot;These days, you might get more applause for <i>not</i> being on social media than for reaching a follower milestone in Europe&#x27;s liberal hubs such as Berlin or Paris.<p>...<p>The mechanisms used by Cambridge Analytica and the &quot;malicious actors&quot; cited by Facebook appear to have been legal and do not constitute a data hack, but rather a <i>deliberate exploitation</i> of information through tools or loopholes Facebook itself provided in the past.<p>...<p>At least two foreign governments, Australia and Germany, threatened or launched investigations into the practices on Thursday.<p>...<p>Meanwhile, in India, where more than a half-million users are estimated to be affected, the allegations have resulted in a governmental request to Facebook and Cambridge Analytica for more detailed information, with a Saturday deadline.<p>Even though India is now Facebook&#x27;s biggest market - ahead of the United States - no Indian media outlets were able to ask questions in a conference call with CEO Mark Zuckerberg on Wednesday.<p>The heavy U.S. focus immediately triggered criticism because privacy advocates are still looking into reports that Cambridge Analytica may have used Facebook data to influence Indian politics, as well.<p>...<p>German justice minister Katarina Barley already called for an E.U.-wide investigation into the misuse of Facebook&#x27;s data by Cambridge Analytica and other companies on Thursday.<p>&quot;Facebook has gambled away people&#x27;s trust,&quot; Barley said.<p>...<p>But in Europe, Germany&#x27;s justice minister and others already fear that <i>the latest regulations aren&#x27;t enough</i>.&quot;<p>Source:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.washingtonpost.com&#x2F;news&#x2F;worldviews&#x2F;wp&#x2F;2018&#x2F;04&#x2F;05&#x2F;as-facebook-confronts-tough-questions-on-data-misuse-europe-might-force-real-change&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.washingtonpost.com&#x2F;news&#x2F;worldviews&#x2F;wp&#x2F;2018&#x2F;04&#x2F;05...</a>
feelin_googleyabout 7 years ago
&quot;Do these hundreds of millions of people who cannot wait to tell the world what they are doing practically minute by minute not realise that anyone with an ounce of brain can find out everything about them just by reading their posts?<p>As the FBI admitted a while back, Facebook was the best thing that happened to collecting intelligence and saving money (because everything is in the open).<p>By having &quot;free&quot; access and use of Facebook, these people have made Mark Zuckerberg a multibillionaire.&quot;<p>Source:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.businesslive.co.za&#x2F;bd&#x2F;opinion&#x2F;letters&#x2F;2018-04-04-letter-facebook-is-not-free&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.businesslive.co.za&#x2F;bd&#x2F;opinion&#x2F;letters&#x2F;2018-04-04...</a>
feelin_googleyabout 7 years ago
&quot;Australia&#x27;s privacy commissioner has launched an investigation to determine whether Facebook breached the Australian privacy act.<p>...<p>Facebook has admitted 311,127 Australian users are likely among the up to 87 million users worldwide whose data was unknowingly and &quot;improperly&quot; shared with the British political consultancy agency.&quot;<p>Source:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.theguardian.com&#x2F;technology&#x2F;2018&#x2F;apr&#x2F;05&#x2F;facebook-suspects-300000-australians-had-data-shared-with-cambridge-analytica" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.theguardian.com&#x2F;technology&#x2F;2018&#x2F;apr&#x2F;05&#x2F;facebook-...</a>
dreamygeekabout 7 years ago
It&#x27;s too messed up now anyways. The privacy settings sucked right from the beginning of Facebook. And it just kept getting worse. Guess people are just used to it now just like slaves get used to slavery and can&#x27;t get out of it.
feelin_googleyabout 7 years ago
&quot;In 2013, Brandon Copley, the CEO of Giftnix, was threatened with legal action after using the technique to demonstrate how personal information could be easily gathered at scale.<p>&quot;Multiple Facebook profiles were extremely easy to scrape,&quot; he explains. In a series of conversations with Facebook security developers Copley explained the issue and was told there was &quot;no security vuln here, even though it does seem like one on first glance.&quot;<p>The method of scraping can work in multiple ways but largely relies on feeding Facebook&#x27;s API a list of phone numbers or email addresses that have been automatically generated. These could also have been obtained from data breaches or leaks of information online.<p>&quot;Just query Facebook as often as possible until they ban your IP for querying too fast, and at that point you just slow down until the queries stop,&quot; Copley explained in an email. &quot;I was doing my work purely for research and exposing the vulnerability for Facebook&quot;.<p>...<p>The issue was again raised by researchers in 2015.<p>Reza Moaiandin, who founded cybersecurity company CyberScanner, published a blogpost about the &quot;loophole&quot;. he said he was able to gather thousands of users personal information by guessing their mobile numbers. Within this information were details of names, locations, and profile pictures.<p>In response Facebook told him it didn&#x27;t &quot;consider it a security vulnerability&quot; but had controls in place to stop it being abused. Zuckerberg&#x27;s most recent statement goes against this, admitting Facebook&#x27;s efforts to stop malicious actors hadn&#x27;t worked.&quot;<p>Source:<p><a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.wired.co.uk&#x2F;article&#x2F;facebook-news-data-scraping-mark-zuckerburg" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.wired.co.uk&#x2F;article&#x2F;facebook-news-data-scraping-m...</a><p>&quot;A few months ago, I discovered a security loophole in Facebook that allows hackers to decrypt and sniff out Facebook user IDs using one of Facebook&#x27;s APIs in bulk - therefore allowing them to gather millions of users&#x27; personal data (name, telephone number, location, images, and more). This post is an attempt to catch Facebook&#x27;s attention to get this issue fixed.<p>By using a script, an entire country&#x27;s (I tested with the US, the UK and Canada) possible number combinations can be run through these URLs, and if a number is associated with a Facebook account, it can then be associated with a name and further details (images, and so on).<p>...<p>For those of you who are wondering why I haven&#x27;t notified Facebook about the issue, the truth is that I have - back in April (2015).<p>Although I did receive a reply, initially the engineer I was in contact with was unable to reproduce the issue himself, and therefore failed to understand the technical details of how it should be <i>fixed</i>.<p>...<p>After a couple of months of waiting, I initially thought someone else will look into it and <i>fix it</i> but I heard nothing, so I raised the flag with them again. They finally came back to me and told me that this is not a big issue - they have set limits and I should not worry about this problem. But frankly, I am very worried.<p>...<p>Comment from reader:<p>Great blog post. I reported an almost identical issue (albeit a different API) to Facebook in January 2014 but faced similar difficulties getting them to recognise the scope for abuse. I was able to lookup contiguous blocks of mobile numbers (in blocks of 5,000 at a time) with no discernible rate-limiting - I could pull them down as fast as my connection could handle (maybe ~50k numbers&#x2F;min).<p>If you make any headway with Facebook let us know and I will try pinging them again. It was especially worrisome as the number range I tried (NYC) had a hit-rate of about 20%.&quot;<p>Source:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;salt.agency&#x2F;blog&#x2F;facebook-security-loophole&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;salt.agency&#x2F;blog&#x2F;facebook-security-loophole&#x2F;</a>
exolymphabout 7 years ago
Normies don&#x27;t care about privacy enough to stop using Facebook.