From the article<p>"“These sales of counterfeit operating systems,” Microsoft lawyer Bonnie MacNaughton wrote to the judge, “displaced Microsoft’s potential sales of genuine operating systems.” But Lundgren’s disks had no licenses and were intended for computers that already had licenses."<p>and even worse,<p>"Hurley decided Lundgren’s 28,000 restore disks had a value of $700,000, and that dollar amount qualified Lundgren for a 15-month term and a $50,000 fine. The judge said he disregarded Weadock’s testimony."<p>Weadock was an expert witness (for the government no less) in a Microsoft antitrust case. When asked what the value of the restore disk was, he responded with zero, or near zero. The prosecutors were initially looking for $299 a disk -- the value of a full license.<p>This is the most egregious case of a judge ruling on something he or she does not understand I've seen in a while. This is an item Microsoft gives away for free to anyone with an internet connection, all this guy was trying to do was sell them for $0.25 to cover the cost of a disk and make it easier for people to fix their broken computers (allegedly).
This is one of the most unabashedly sinister first-world articles I've read in a while.<p>Microsoft's argument hinges on two damages: Either, they didn't get to charge a convenience fee to customers, or they were losing revenue by people unexpectedly extending the life of their computers.<p>Foolish judges and evil lawyers putting a decent person away for 13 months.
Gizmodo[1] added this --<p>"Unfortunately, in what seems to have been a huge mistake, the disks had “labels nearly identical to the discs provided by Dell for its computers and had the Windows and Dell logos,” the Times wrote. As a result, Lundgren pleaded guilty to two of 21 charges, conspiracy and copyright infringement. He told the paper, “If I had just written ‘Eric’s Restore Disc’ on there, it would have been fine.”<p>[1]<a href="https://gizmodo.com/e-waste-innovator-will-go-to-jail-for-selling-windows-r-1825518742" rel="nofollow">https://gizmodo.com/e-waste-innovator-will-go-to-jail-for-se...</a>
Everybody is reading this wrong, which isn't a huge surprise because the Post seems to have nobody on hand who understands the facts of the case and relied on an interview with Lundgren heavily. He was not providing people with restore media they could use to fix their own machines. He was taking the restore media, burning it onto discs _with official Microsoft and Dell logos on them_ and then _selling them to computer refurbishers who would then include them with PCs they were selling._ In other words, people were buying PCs with these counterfeit restore discs passed off as actual Dell/Microsoft product. Yes, the media only works with a valid Windows license on the machine already, but reselling the PC like this with the counterfeit restore media likely voids that Windows license agreement. Lundgren is far less innocent than the Washington Post article implies.
Reading the court documents, the conclusion is that the guy is shady and the journalist and the newspaper are borderline lying.<p>The correct headline is:
"E-waste recycler loses appeal on 28,000 counterfeit windows installation disks, must serve prison term"<p>>The sentencing judge determined that the appropriate infringement value was the value of the infringed discs to small registered refurbishers: $25. <i>The court found credible the government expert’s testimony that he was able to use the infringing discs to install functioning Microsoft software</i><p>So there were 28,000 discs with Microsoft and Dell logos which can be used to to install functioning Microsoft software<p>That's a different picture than the one painted by the article.<p>>In particular, the court noted that it did not find it
reasonable to believe that Lundgren and his codefendant had spent at least around $80,000 to create discs that had no value. Using the $25 infringement amount, Lundgren’s guideline range was 37 to 46 months imprisonment. The court
sentenced Lundgren to 15-months imprisonment<p><a href="https://www.courtlistener.com/pdf/2018/04/11/united_states_v._clifford_eric_lundgren.pdf" rel="nofollow">https://www.courtlistener.com/pdf/2018/04/11/united_states_v...</a><p>Did the journalist read the court papers?
Sounds like this guy made a really bad decision in putting the Windows and Dell logos on the disks, and then selling them (albeit for $0.25, which would seem to just barely cover the cost of production.) But that bad decision pales in comparison to the court's decision to value at $25 what Microsoft was giving away for free. If anything, he was saving them a significant amount of bandwidth.
“One of his projects was to manufacture thousands of ‘restore disks,’ usually supplied by computer-makers as a way for users to restore Windows to a hard drive if it crashes or must be wiped. The disks can be used only on a computer that already has a license for the Windows operating system, and the license transfers with the computer for its full life span. But computer owners often lose or throw out the disks, and though the operating system can be downloaded free on a licensed computer, Lundgren realized that many people didn’t feel competent to do that, and were simply throwing out their computers and buying new ones.<p>Lundgren had 28,000 of the disks made and shipped to a broker in Florida. Their plan was to sell the disks to computer refurbishing shops for about 25 cents apiece, so the refurbishers could provide the disks to used-computer buyers and wouldn’t have to take the time to create the disks themselves.<p>...<p>Eventually, the Florida broker, Robert Wolff, called Lundgren and offered to buy the disks himself as part of a government sting, Lundgren said. Wolff sent Lundgren $3,400, and the conspiracy was cemented. Both were indicted on a charge of conspiracy to traffic in counterfeit goods and criminal copyright infringement.”<p>This should not result in jail time. Is Florida really so free of violent crime and other more serious offenses that this case is a priority for federal prosecutors?
It's really frustrating when reporters don't link to decisions so we can see the logic behind the rulings. Found what I believe is the opinion in case you're interested:
<a href="https://www.courtlistener.com/pdf/2018/04/11/united_states_v._clifford_eric_lundgren.pdf" rel="nofollow">https://www.courtlistener.com/pdf/2018/04/11/united_states_v...</a><p>Here's the original request for appeal:
<a href="https://regmedia.co.uk/2018/02/20/lundgrenappeal.pdf" rel="nofollow">https://regmedia.co.uk/2018/02/20/lundgrenappeal.pdf</a>
I'm in two minds over this. First, it's ridiculous that someone is being jailed for 15 months for trying to make it easier to keep using older PCs and reducing waste.<p>On the other hand that's the risk one takes when dabbling in the world of proprietary software. Where discouraging people from upgrading is seen as a threat to revenue and is attacked accordingly.<p>Had he printed 34,000 Linux disks we'd never have had this case and sentence, but then perhaps no one would have used those old PCs. It seems that someone has to lose.
This is ridiculous. This should be a civil case at most. We are entering into a dangerous era for our own selves when we allow this sort of punishment for software issues.<p>Additionally, this guy recycles 41 million pounds of e-waste a year. He should be celebrated. As a result of that, I can only imagine his larger clients may have to drop the use of the services of his company. Apparently, we don't care, and many comments online are philosophic in tone.<p>Even if the strategy were misguided, this outcome is absurd.<p>That Microsoft would so vigorously pursue this guy has rekindled my dislike for the company. They almost seemed to be on a turnaround path with developers with a cool editor and a new approach. This shows that they and their products are to be avoided at all cost as before.<p>All I can say is that, as developers, we need to work to not embrace Microsoft as they try to restore their relationship with us. And if you work there, well, what can I say... you should speak up about this or leave for more fair waters.
One of the phrases I keep from this article is: “I don’t think anybody in that courtroom understood what a restore disk was”.<p>I remember listening to Steve Gibson (GRC), on SecurityNow podcast, saying that this is the exact reason why he is not willing to testify to a Court of Law any more. Having testified in court for some cases as "specialist" it is (almost always) needed to find metaphors and analogies on anything-technology. Some judges and lawyers are educated but twisting the meaning of something (misinterpreting the truth) is often the case.
it is sad and amusing that at least three comments on this thread point out that the wapo article is substantially incomplete.<p>From the original LaTimes article:<p>"In 2013, federal authorities intercepted shipments of 28,000 restore discs that Lundgren had manufactured in China and sent to his sales partner in Florida. The discs had labels nearly identical to the discs provided by Dell for its computers and had the Windows and Dell logos."<p>Oh. Well that changes things substantially - copyright infringement on discs created in China in bulk looks a bit fishy and more malicious than the wapo points out.<p>What if the discs were rooted?<p>What if their intent was to charge the other recyclers $10 a pop vs the $25 msft charged for the same thing?<p>I bet all those things were discussed in the courtroom and I'd love to see a really good source to understand this case vs watching the media try to wind up the pitchfork brigade as usual.
I want to know what harm he has done or what danger he poses to society that warrants a 15 month prison sentence.<p>I feel like this is what pardons are for.
This is just shameful prosecution of law for the sake of law and not whether it's appropriate. Even the judge recognizes the greater good that was at play and the non-malicious intent.<p>It boggles my mind that some DA put the effort in to this case.
Can’t blame this on Microsoft. Legal department probably said “these disks look visually similar to Dell disks, therefore we must press charges or everyone will start stamping out lookalike CDs and they’ll be able to get away with it by pointing to us not pressing charges here”. Blame the legal system, not Microsoft. All companies are under such obligations to not dilute their IP.
Doesn't a restore disk contain binaries from the operating system? So he's distributing somebody else's work, with their logo on it. However well-intentioned, its pretty dodgy. No matter what Microsoft does with those binaries, they weren't his to resell?
So, the price MS paid to have him jailed was <i>less</i> than the cost they would incur if people used those discs to restore their machines instead of buying new ones.
Main point:<p>"The judge said he disregarded Weadock’s testimony. 'I don’t think anybody in that courtroom understood what a restore disk was,' Lundgren said."
what makes it legal for an ISP (on behalf of an end-user) to request a microsoft server for the recovery disc download and then send this stream of bits to the end-user,<p>but then illegal for Lundgren (also on behalf of an end-user) to request a microsoft server for the recovery disc download and then send a disc of those bts to the end-user?<p>Is it because Lundgren is no ISP, or is it because the disc is considered a medium of exchange?
> Randall Newman, Lundgren’s lawyer on the appeal, said there was no basis to seek a rehearing from the full 11th Circuit. Lundgren said an appeal to the Supreme Court would be a costly long shot.<p>The tech community should band together and fund Lundgren taking this to the Supreme Court. It's worth trying to stop this precedent.
> despite the software being freely available online and only compatible with valid Windows licenses<p>I don't see why someone needs to go to jail for 15-months over this - especially given his reasonings.<p>If you thought microsoft had turned a new page - think again. Different tactics, same morals.
Aside from the legal technicalities and motivations of the parties in this case, the goal of prolonging the usable life of computers is incredibly laudable.<p>The continuing process by which otherwise functional hardware is made into trash simply because the market incentives don’t motivate the manufacturers to prioritize this is (borderline) tragic.<p>The way updates of operating systems require ever more powerful hardware drives me crazy. If prolonging the use of hardware was an explicit goal of the companies that make the operating systems, not only could a huge amount of waste be kept out of landfills, we could have devices whose performance increases over time.
This is horrifying, and sounds like something out of a story warning about government overreach.<p>1 YEAR and three months in federal prison? That's not a short amount of time for something that this guy had a reasonable expectation wasn't illegal.
Controversial opinion: mr. Lundgren could tamper with disc content and ship any kind of malware with the OS to intercept sensible data. I'd never trust that kind of 'OEM' CD.
As a CEO, you can have a business model that is ethically and morally wrong without getting into jail.<p>As a CEO, you can ignore obvious security flaws leading to 100 million social security numbers getting leaked without getting into jail.<p>As a CEO, you can sexually harass your employees without getting into jail.<p>Try and save the world by repurpose old computers, causing one of the biggest companies in the world to maybe lose 0.0000001% of their revenue and you're fucked.<p>Shame on you, Microsoft.
Fuck you US Government is more like it.<p>Oh, and the assholes that vote these idiots into office over and over again. I don't care if it's Pelosi/Boxer or Inhofe/Cruz, they all are pieces of shit.
No paywall: <a href="https://outline.com/zcZGaN" rel="nofollow">https://outline.com/zcZGaN</a><p>It’s unfortunate when people get punished because other people don’t understand how technology works.<p>“Senator, we don’t sell data!” - Plato
Is there anything we can do? Can he appeal? EFF? This can't be the end.<p>I guess pressuring MS to drop the charges is too late. We can't have good man in jail over this.