People mock vegans because of the sanctimony you often hear as the justification, and because of perceived superficiality.<p>If you hear someone is vegan because of some religious reason, there's a long cultural tradition behind that and there's a degree to which people cannot escape their culture.<p>But the vegans that are mocked are typically the upper middle class urbanites who<p>- Have no idea what they are actually eating instead of not eating meat<p>- Would like to signal to the world how good they are<p>- Have no real time / money / convenience constraints on whatever ethical choice they decide to choose<p>- Seem sort of juvenile in that their deeply felt convictions may quickly change to some other deeply held position<p>This is not to say all vegans are like this, or that veganism itself is actually wrong, but the caricature is the stuff of comedy. Who doesn't have a friend that's dabbled in some ethical choices that only they could see the necessity of?
Why do people mock hippies ?<p>Why do people mock geeks ?<p>Why do people mock iron pumpers ?<p>Part of it is because it reflects something you know you could be doing.<p>Part of it is because anything that is not on the center of the Gauss curve tingles our brain.<p>Part of it is because they do weird sh<i></i><i></i>* and it's good sport to make fun of that.<p>As a veggie geek meditator that spends time in the gym, I certainly understand how goofy this stuff is. Better laugh at it.<p>I mean, come on...<p>This morning I ate spirulina, watched a Paul Stamets conf on psylo, took a Wim Hof style cold shower, stored away my vibrams five fingers and took 20 minutes of Vipassana meditation on a red dedicated cushion.<p>You could write a TV show episode with less material.
Not vegan but vegetarian, I recognize the anger and I regularly have people getting hostile and telling ‘last week I had a bbq and at 5 kilos of pork in one serving’ as if that would set me off or something. And it happens a lot (at least once a week in the summer). People are so crazy about their meat (I have seen people on HN say they would rather die than never eat bacon again...) and I guess they are afraid it will all end or something or that vegan or vegatarian-ism is contagious. The more educated of my meat eating friends raise their own animals (some slaughter them, some take them to the butcher), or, if they cannot afford that and cannot afford free range meat, when asked about animal suffering, say they just cannot care about that because they cannot live without meat. Same like people who smoke, drink, drive sportscars or gasguzzlers, eat sugar etc; they know it will kill them and/or the world, but they just cannot care about it. But personally (anecdotally) I do not see people so enranged as they are about meat eaters (in vegan circles: like I see in Berlin) or about vegan/vegetarians. I just see the reason vegans are angry about meat a lot more than the other way around.
It may be different in different parts of the world, but where I'm from vegans tend to be middle-class/upper-class people who are blissfully unaware of how class barriers dictate the way you eat. And instead of trying to engage with it meaningfully (i.e. understand and propose ways for poor people to live on a vegan lifestyle when $$$ is tight and calorie intake needs are bigger) they just believe that anyone can live the same way they can afford.<p>My personal pet peeves are that a) some of the arguments for veganism try to convince me that I should not eat animals because they're sentient beings and since the 70s we've started to see evidence that the concept of "sentience" is very very ephemeral and that plants also exhibit intelligent behaviour. I think this argument is incredibly homo-centric and I honestly find it a bit insulting to my own beliefs.<p>b) the concept of going vegan being environmentally friendly is fine to me, but it's not just about not eating cattle. It's also about reducing carbon footprints of industrialised food production (i.e. going back to eating seasonal veggies!). Most vegans just eat whatever has the "vegan" label (i.e. quinoa) regardless of the fact that for it to get to their hands it had to be transported in a non environmentally friendly way.<p>c) the biggest environmental offenders are companies. Instead of focusing on who's eating meat I'd rather start prosecuting companies with large carbon footprints.
Not a good article.<p>It slices across complex societal issues, like free speech and employment, hate, internet phenomena, social media amplifying, slaps some veganism elevator pitch on it and calls it a day. I don't think much of value can be extracted from it, since the length just doesn't do the complexity justice.<p>Also, this comment section is already mostly derailed and is degrading into anecdata and people discussing guessing what the article isn't about. Come on HN, you can do better!
In my bubble (Belgium) I've not experienced this actually. But I'm not an 'advocate' for a vegan lifestyle though. I just eat vegan most days and vegetarian on the other days. I don't really care what other people do or eat, I'm not bothered by going to a restaurant with non-vegetarian/vegan friends. I'm fine if we bbq together and I get a meat replacement.<p>I get that people might be upset if someone tells their choice of eating meat makes them a horrible person. I mean, you can replace "eating meat" with anything and you'd offend someone by calling them horrible :P
Ultimately, people don't like what is different, especially if it's proselyte. It creates a "us vs them" situation, the same type that creates xenophobia and racism.
I don't think that it is something that can be overcome without it coming from a central authority (religious or political). Something would have to be done on the same level as demonizing cigarettes to make people reduce / stop their meat consumption. (Lot's of advertisement explaining the moral issue, possible taxation on meat based on origin etc.).
On top of that, traditional cuisine is one of the most fundamental identity concepts. Asking people to stop eating like their ancestors is a hard thing to do, without the value of it being better tasting. Overall, in a country that would have the political will to do so, the following solutions might work:
- Heavy advertisement, like the one against cigarette
- Taxes on meat, based on origin
- Don't try to force people to eat healthily at the same time. While a ceasar salad without real chicken should exist, so should fat hamburgers and pizzas.
- Invest on meat / cheese alternatives so that they become cheaper. Invest on marketing for kids as well for those.
- Don't try to go all in at once. If all of the population reduce their meat based product consumption by 40%, it is a way bigger success than the current vegan movement.<p>But without doing that, and just by having vegan as a proselyte community, you force people to choose a camp, either vegan or not. They'll chose that based on their relationship with the overall community and own internal moral compass, which is not very efficient and creates a lot of conflict.
I believe by now that there is something like "childhood wisdom". Things we learn as kids that is explained to us as natural: owning cars, eating carcases, drinking the fluid that is originally intended for babies of another species, breakfast as the most important meal of the day, sitting with wet hair in a breeze gives you the cold, ...<p>as soon as you question these you have a discussion with their inner 6 year old (using the logic of 6 year old) instead of an rational thinking adult.
H. G. Wells:<p>> New and stirring things are belittled because if they are not belittled the humiliating question arises "Why then are you not taking part in them?"
The problem with vegans is that there is a small but extremely vocal minority that absolutely, positively just HAS to incessantly preach about it and try to belittle everyone else. As a consequence whenever someone who has heard about militant vegans immediately associates veganism in general with them exclusively simply because non-insane vegans (which I believe are the very large majority of vegans, though I have no data about it) are woefully underrepresented in the public consciousness of veganism.
People feel as thought it’s a moral judgement when someone just exists and is a vegan. They feel as though they are being judged, a finger is pointed at them.<p>That is, of course, bonkers.
I went to a comedy show where the comedian ruthlessly mocked vegans. It was very funny.<p>There's not many targets of mocking these days that are acceptable maybe vegans are one.
Here (in Turkey), the distinction between being a vegan, vegeterian, having a gluten free diet or just trying to lose some weight is sometimes so blurry that even some restaurants sometimes make crucial mistakes in their menus or marketing campaigns. So when everyday Jane/Joe mocks a person with a special diet, she often thinks that person is trying to lose some weight without succeeding ever for years.
I personally find the mockery puzzling. In Singapore and other asian countries, plenty of people are vegetarians (out of choice or for religious reasons).
On the contrary, In India, there's been a recent surge of mocking @ Non-Vegans (or) Should I say regular dieters?<p>This trend is not only on Rise but also gaining a cult-status that declaring "I'm a Vegan" seems to be a social status. I don't disagree the Veggies have got all sorts of Nutrients that Humans need but not sure it has to be a thingy of shame if someone eats Meat.
Veganism unavoidably implies a moral superiority where vegetarianism doesn't.<p>That's pretty irritating.<p>It also just doesn't mesh with most people's understanding of simple animals as simple and food-driven, not in any way equal to the long existential agonies and traumas of humans.<p>Their implied moral high-ground, in the face of rampant predator killings in the natural world, adds up to too much Disney and too little sense.<p>...and lions eat their own young let alone warthogs.
People should just mind their own business, that's why.
Eat what you want, sleep with who you want, believe what you want - I don't care.
The moment you start teaching me how to live my live - I have to ask you to fuck off.
This is a general principle: applies to vegans, religion, politics, sex, etc.
A lot of hate towards Vegetarians and Vegans was also started by the food and meat industry. Watch "Fed Up" and "Cowspiracy" how the food industry felt threatened by people reporting its actions. The food industry is very powerful and created various stereotypes on purpose to protect its images and brands.
Maybe due to the fact that on the internet at least, vegans tend to be the preachy moralistic types that call you a monster for eating meat.<p>I don't know about IRL, as I haven't met many people that I know to be vegan, as with most groups on the internet, the worst squeaky wheels are over-represented and their brand of squeakiness really gets under many people's skin.
I, and the people around me, mock vegans because 50% of vegans I've encountered are hypocritical.<p>They don't eat meat or animal products, because of the "environment", but then eat fruit and vegetables that were imported from thousands of miles away by air. On a weekend, they drop pills, the trafficking and cultivation of which costs lives every single day. And never mind their flights halfway around the world for vacation twice a year, which do more to harm the environment than a year of not eating animal products.<p>Vegans make an earnest attempt who practice what they preach, across their entire lifestyle, have my utmost respect.