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Outbreak of Lung Illness Associated with Using E-Cigarette Products

56 pointsby colundover 5 years ago

16 comments

_Marak_over 5 years ago
I&#x27;ve been following this for months and New York State seems to be reporting the most accurate information.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.health.ny.gov&#x2F;press&#x2F;releases&#x2F;2019&#x2F;2019-09-05_vaping.htm" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.health.ny.gov&#x2F;press&#x2F;releases&#x2F;2019&#x2F;2019-09-05_vap...</a><p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.flickr.com&#x2F;photos&#x2F;nysdoh&#x2F;sets&#x2F;72157710703391248&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.flickr.com&#x2F;photos&#x2F;nysdoh&#x2F;sets&#x2F;72157710703391248&#x2F;</a><p>The sickness is suspected to be caused by blackmarket THC vape cartridges which have been cut with Vitamin E Acetate.<p>There is a huge problem with black market &#x2F; counterfeit THC vape products.<p>There are two communities tracking this on Reddit:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.reddit.com&#x2F;r&#x2F;fakecartridges&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.reddit.com&#x2F;r&#x2F;fakecartridges&#x2F;</a><p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.reddit.com&#x2F;r&#x2F;cleancarts&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.reddit.com&#x2F;r&#x2F;cleancarts&#x2F;</a>
kyriakosover 5 years ago
Is it worse than regular smoking? or how about the new IQOS type?<p>Obviously not smoking is the best option but assuming smokers will continue smoking even knowing the risks - which is the case unfortunately for a big majority, i believe the best thing to do is give them a way to get their fix that poses the smallest risk.
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tau255over 5 years ago
In Vienna, the shop I bought my supplies had all products tested by local TÜV NORD and they mixed liquids on site. Nowadays I buy and mix myself from standard 50&#x2F;50 PG&#x2F;VG mix from known source. I had mixed results with imported premixed liquids (off smell, not consistent viscosity - went to bin) and that promptly stopped me from buying more of premixed stuff (along with problematic regulations of container sizes).<p>Anything you add to the liqiud other than nicotine and PG&#x2F;VG may be problematic. You never really know what is in imported premixed liquid, what cutting agents were used, what purity of source material was.<p>It seems that CDC is seeing some results of cost cutting, using stuff that was not really meant to be vaped mixed to keep margins better.
thompoover 5 years ago
I have asthma and have lived in Denver since before legalization.<p>When vape pens first came out I never had any issues. In the last few years I very well could have easily been one of those statistics.<p>Vape pens make my lungs <i>hurt</i> and I have to use my rescue inhaler for days afterwards. It’s terrible. I don’t know if they changed how they make the oil but I completely gave up on vaping. I tried one with pineapple flavoring and man... it almost was the death of me.
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Barrin92over 5 years ago
i said right at the beginning when people were starting to recommend e-cigarettes as a replacement for cigarettes that they should keep the good old &#x27;unknown unknowns&#x27; in mind and that a recommendation without knowledge of long term risk is dangerous.<p>This should maybe be a general lesson when people advocate unproven replacements for unhealthy habits.
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h2odragonover 5 years ago
Pretty certain I&#x27;ve had lipid pneumonia through vaped bad oils; but the gastrointestinal involvement and elevated heart rate and white blood cell count sound like there might be something more specific happening? Please someone educate us further?
ohiovrover 5 years ago
I thc vaped for a little while. Everything seemed fine till the next batch which was a cough factory. It is unregulated and blackmarket. For all I know huffing paint is safer.
doktrinover 5 years ago
I&#x27;m another person who for whatever reason was never able to adjust to vaping. It quite literally hurts, even with modest inhales, despite trying numerous models (disposables, cartridges, expensive sub ohm systems, you name it). This applies both for nicotine and thc vaping. I just wrote it off as something that was a personal eccentricity.<p>Honestly it was for the best - I ended up using gum and eventually just quitting, and stopped using thc for other reasons.
merricksbover 5 years ago
Related discussion yesterday:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=20899523" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=20899523</a>
Havocover 5 years ago
Bit confused how they&#x27;ve got 450 cases but no certainty?<p>Surely 1 out of 450 has a sample left that can be tested thoroughly?
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newbrictover 5 years ago
Recommendation is to not use e cig until they finish investigating but I wonder if a real cig is a worse alternative still?
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todipaover 5 years ago
I&#x27;m not a doctor but are there any theories on how one might die from vaping?
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mistermannover 5 years ago
The way this is being reported, I feel quite confident that this is some sort of a <i>deliberate</i> propaganda campaign.<p>The two biggest red flags for me:<p>1) Language used in official press releases, weasel wording like:<p>a) &quot;over 450 possible cases of lung illness <i>associated with</i> the use of e-cigarette products&quot;<p>b) &quot;The investigation has not identified any [single - my addition] <i>specific</i> substance or e-cigarette product that is linked to all cases. <i>Many</i> [how many? do you have no statistics on that? why?] patients report using e-cigarette products with liquids that contain cannabinoid products, such as tetrahydrocannabinol (THC)&quot;.<p>It seems written in a manner to maximize plausible deniability, hinting at one thing strongly [but not saying it <i>outright</i>], and making an <i>extremely</i> subtle acknowledgement of alternative causes [in the spirit of professionalism and &quot;full disclosure&quot;], but not reporting the magnitude of the &quot;many&quot;, which could very well be 100%.<p>That&#x27;s the beauty (and shortcoming) of written language for communication - when something is written in a <i>seemingly</i> deceitful style like this, there&#x27;s no way for sure of knowing whether it is accidental or not. Unnecessary vagueness from a facts based organization like the CDC and #2 (below) make me lean strongly towards the deliberately deceitful interpretation.<p>2) Vaping has been <i>extremely</i> widespread for years, with few reports like these. And then out of the blue, 450 cases (5 deaths) occur <i>in one country</i>. No curiosity whatsoever about why everything is fine for years and then a massive spike in a very short period of time, in one country.<p>I could very well be wrong, but I will make a prediction: this will play <i>heavily</i> in the media for a few more weeks and then subtly degrade to a &quot;gee, we don&#x27;t really know what the real issue was, but our research is ongoing&quot;, and we won&#x27;t hear about it again.<p>EDIT: From another HN comment:<p>--------------------------------------------------<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.health.ny.gov&#x2F;press&#x2F;releases&#x2F;2019&#x2F;2019-09-05_vaping.htm" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.health.ny.gov&#x2F;press&#x2F;releases&#x2F;2019&#x2F;2019-09-05_vap...</a><p>New York State Department of Health Announces Update on Investigation into Vaping-Associated Pulmonary Illnesses<p>Department Warns Against Use of Black Market Vaping Products<p>Lab Test Results Show High Levels of Vitamin E Acetate, Now Focus of Investigation<p>The Department issued a health advisory in August, alerting health care providers of this emerging health threat and listing symptoms they should look for in patients. As of September 5, 2019, the Department has received 34 reports from New York State physicians of severe pulmonary illness among patients ranging from 15 to 46 years of age who were using at least one cannabis-containing vape product before they became ill. However, all patients reported recent use of various vape products.<p>Laboratory test results showed very high levels of vitamin E acetate in nearly all cannabis-containing samples analyzed by the Wadsworth Center as part of this investigation. At least one vitamin E acetate containing vape product has been linked to each patient who submitted a product for testing. Vitamin E acetate is not an approved additive for New York State Medical Marijuana Program-authorized vape products and was not seen in the nicotine-based products that were tested.<p>As a result, vitamin E acetate is now a key focus of the Department&#x27;s investigation of potential causes of vaping-associated pulmonary illnesses. Vitamin E acetate is a commonly available nutritional supplement that is not known to cause harm when ingested as a vitamin supplement or applied to the skin. However, the Department continues to investigate its health effects when inhaled because its oil-like properties could be associated with the observed symptoms.<p>The Wadsworth Center is testing both cannabis and nicotine-containing vape products as part of this investigation and continues testing the purity of New York&#x27;s approved medical marijuana products. More than a dozen product samples, in some cases multiple samples from a single product, from patients reporting symptoms have been tested. These samples have been tested for a range of substances, including THC and other cannabis-derived cannabinoids, nicotine, synthetic cannabinoids, opioids and pesticides. Products tested include a variety of labels and packaging. Many are suspected to be counterfeits of recreational cannabis-containing vape products available in other states.<p>--------------------------------------------------<p>It&#x27;s rather interesting that absolutely none of these extra details, which have been available for quite some time now, appear in any official CDC reports.
algaeontoastover 5 years ago
Lungs were made for air, not smoke or atomized vapor (aside from drugs meant to be administered as a vapor).<p>Is this really that hard for people to figure out?
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golemotronover 5 years ago
I am not surprised at all, and I&#x27;m surprised that anyone is surprised. The idea that one can breathe particulate or droplet matter into their lungs without causing problems seems absurd on its face given everything we&#x27;ve known about the effects of air pollution for decades. Tobacco is not special.
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aclimattover 5 years ago
Let&#x27;s fast forward a few years from now to the point where we determine that e-cigarettes contain some sort of cancer or lung disease-causing product &#x2F; additive, just like we figured out with cigarettes decades ago.<p>What I don&#x27;t understand is why the FDA will not outright ban them immediately. (Well I probably do, and the answer is lobbying.)<p>Regardless of your stance on whether or not the FDA _should_ ban ingredients that pose health risks (government intervention on liberties et cetera), the fact is that this is the FDA&#x27;s policy. It bans harmful ingredients (usually).<p>So with that policy in place, what&#x27;s the deal here? If and when e-cigarettes are found to contain a chemical that is directly linked to cancer or lung disease, will the FDA ban it? Or will it conspicuously let it slide, and just slap a warning on it, like it did cigarettes?<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.fda.gov&#x2F;cosmetics&#x2F;cosmetics-laws-regulations&#x2F;prohibited-restricted-ingredients-cosmetics" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.fda.gov&#x2F;cosmetics&#x2F;cosmetics-laws-regulations&#x2F;pro...</a><p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.fda.gov&#x2F;food&#x2F;food-additives-petitions&#x2F;food-additive-status-list" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.fda.gov&#x2F;food&#x2F;food-additives-petitions&#x2F;food-addit...</a>
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