My life was ruined by badly done, and even worse ultimately unneeded surgery. That privilege initially cost me many thousands, along with career and insurance going away, and the subsequent struggle to survive since has cost multiples of that. My entire future billed away. For a time I was able to avoid collectors because of a significant savings a frugal life had left me, but as time goes on you have to choose between medical care and other basic needs unless you want to go into a deep financial hole at a time you have MORE financial need like the people in this article. As a former provider, as a patient advocate and activist, and now as a person on the edge, I never saw anyone get out of that hole and it terrifies me every single day.<p>I am constantly getting third and fourth party bills for huge amounts re things I did not consent to be sent away or billed externally. That's AFTER asking up front AND paying huge amounts for the primary service up front. These things come many months later and I can see one easily getting lost or not sent properly and me ending up in a massive legal battle over debt and summary judgements behind my back. Even with paranoid checking of old accounts and services they continue to mess it up and debts show up later. I was ruined by this country's medical business and ultimately it's going to be the cause of my death as I am at the limit of what I can handle in all regards. I tried to get out of the country for good to places I have lived and can get better healthcare, and have at least some quality of life with my remaining health and years, but ironically since I am so broken because of this experience it severely limits my options. I feel trapped and hopeless.
> His friend bailed him out the next morning, but at the bond hearing, the judge granted the $500, minus court fees, to the hospital.<p>I know it's not the subject of this, but this sounds like it's probably illegal? He's seizing money that was supposed to be returned to someone other than the defendant.
This is happening in Kansas. Everyone feels bad, but not enough to actually vote based on the issue. That suggests it isn't really a major issue for them.<p>Not only do they suffer, but numerous people in progressive states also suffer because right-leaning states like Kansas vote the country towards these types of repressive laws.
> Hassenplug replied, “Well, this will end when one of us dies.”<p>So he's going to continue to waste:<p>1) his own time.
2) the other guy's time.
3) a judge's time (and therefore taxpayer money).<p>Aside from the moral implications of the method of debt collection itself (harassing the most helpless), this is basically a crime against everyone. Such a waste.
I think this condition is the result of knowingly doing wrong things, in the general sense. The right thing to do now is to start a campaign, attract attention and make an initiative to reform healthcare. You have nothing to lose.
I have strong feelings on how much medical reform needs to happen, and some ideas on how it can be done without socializing the system as a whole.<p>That said, I don't understand why nobody has tried to organize protests outside the courthouse or hospital over this. 90 people in one session are plenty to leverage a pretty big protest. The black eye to the court or hospital in question could definitely lead to some changes. If there are other counties in OK facing the same issues, they could protest at the state level and probably get better protective legislation in place.<p>I fail to understand how apathy has lead to such passive lack of any kind of action for reform.
Highest prison population in the world by both per capita and total number, and people get thrown in jail because they can't pay their medical bills. How much more corrupt can this country get?<p>What do we do when voting doesn't make a difference?
wow, didn't know this happens over medical debt. I always thought just tons of letters and harassing phone calls. I know we don't have debtor prisons but if you are fined (say a guilty on a traffic ticket) and you don't pay, it can be considered contempt if you don't pay it and can then be jailed. I wonder if they are doing this for student loan debts, which some can't even be discharged in bankruptcy, and few states are suspending driver licenses over student loan debts similar to how they punish people who are behind on child support.<p>Also crazy you can be a judge without a law degree, even if you want to a be a lawyer there's a long process without going to law school, like years of a apprenticeship. Feel like that opens up the judge to being manipulated by lawyers. Just seems like more evidence that the so called justice system isn't really just. Then the whole private prisons and prisons not really focused on rehabilitation, people get released and don't know what to do on the outside so they reoffend and get comfortable with prison. I guess in prison at least you get food and probably warmer than being cold on the streets homeless. There's some books I've been wanting to read on these topics, but haven't got around to it yet. Apparently people unknowingly commits three felonies a day, and of course being ignorant is a excuse either as you must memorize and understand thousands of pages of legal gibberish.<p>Feel like our nation has veered so far off course than our original principles and ideals, and then if you watch the news... Very disturbing stuff happening all over the place. Really saddening. Plus I feel like our education system is dumbing people down, but that's an entire other topic. But not sure if any other countries are that much better, seems like everywhere has it's problems.
It keeps striking me. Really have no idea how this crap could be happening. Is that a consequence of democracy? But none of the other rich and democratic countries has any of that shit. Here is Cyprus we have same life expectancy as in the U.S. (ok 3 months shorter) and the healthcare is paid for by a tax of 2.65% of income (but it is charged on any and all income including those kinds of it exempt from any other taxes, except there is a cap of taxable income of 180,000 EUR per person per year). On top of that there are purely symbolical charges (say a doctor visit is usually 1 euro) probably only to keep track of these visits. Seems to be enough. And no it's not Soviet-style healthcare, and doctors are not poor - they all drive new BMWs, have good houses and stuff, and appear to be doing just as well as their American colleagues. What's going on there in the U.S. people?!
A quick suggestion.<p>If things are really this dire sign up for platinum coverage under a total in-network HMO like Kaiser. Platinum 90 0/10 as an example.<p>If you have serious medical costs these plans are MAJORLY subsidized because they don't discriminate on pre-existing conditions.<p>You CANNOT go out of network.
I'm reminded of some lines from "A Christmas Carol." "Are there no workhouses? Are there no prisons?" ... It's wild how many changes to embolden debt collections happens in so many places, often snuck in by a few legislators that just don't think they'll get called out and generally don't. I'm lucky to live in a state that to my knowledge has a lot of protections in place and makes it harder to charge interest or sue over medical debt.<p>I would like to see some billing revisions take place and make the majority of collections susceptible to review. Also, limit the rates that a facility can charge limited to no more than a 20% variance. Of course now that insurance companies don't act with a fiduciary responsibility, this also needs to change. Obamacare, as well intended as it is/was, has introduced some fierce unintended consequences.<p>As someone who was saddled with a $138k set of bills (after insurance, before Obamacare), it's rough. I make decent money and still had to spend the better part of a decade working 60-70 hour weeks with a day job and side work to pay it off. If they made medical debt a tax credit, it isn't even a deduction most of the time, I'd bet there'd be more interest in actually adjusting the course.<p>I would like to see the collective coverage for Medicare, Medicaid, VA Medical, and Federal Employee coverage combined into a non-profit medical insurance anyone can get a policy from with a single policy that can and does negotiate with fiduciary responsibility. Of course, then the congress would handcuff such an organization and make it unable to wield its' negotiating ability.
“ More than half of the debt in collections stems from medical care, which, unlike most other debt, is often taken on without a choice or an understanding of the costs. Since the Affordable Care Act of 2010, prices for medical services have ballooned; insurers have nearly tripled deductibles — the amount a person pays before their coverage kicks in — and raised premiums and copays, as well. As a result, tens of millions of people without adequate coverage are expected to pay larger portions of their rising bills.”<p>ACA has been yet another screwup on top of the cluster-Fsck that is the US health care healthcare system. Medicare can’t even force payment restrIctions or transparency. It’s not in politicians interest to fix it - they raise all their money by either running on medical reform(fixing it would take that issue and revenue stream off the money) or protecting it. Why else do you think that a supermajority under Obama made the problem worse?<p>It’s time to form a separate states controlled mechanism for doing this. The federal government has proven to be either completely and totally inept, or corrupt beyond all imagination.
Obviously it goes without saying, shop around. Fly to another country if you have to. Canadian/Mexican doctors are more than happy to take cash and will often charge less than half what they charge here. Obviously there's medical problems you can't travel for but more often than not you can.<p>Also note that hospitals is one of the very few businesses that you have to get permission from other hospitals to open. It's a cartel.
> Another woman said she watched, a decade ago, as a deputy came to the door for her diabetic aunt and took her to jail in her final years of life.<p>Another horror storie from america. This rare gem mix otherwise common issues of debt, failling healthcare and jailing.<p>It's 3 year and half I take interest of the inner working of american society, since Trump declared he didn't understand why the US didn't use its nuke more often.<p>I think at every article I have reached the bottom... Yet everytime I learn something worse from another story.<p>America is on the decline. Corruption, greed and madness is literaly ruining the country from the inside.<p>No country will defeat you ; you will defeat yourself.
Government funded healthcare on some level would help to alleviate a modicum of this catastrophe. I doubt it would be a magic bullet but medical debt damages society by incentivizing disaster health care instead of preventive care.
It’s almost like parts of the U.S. never made it to the 20th century...<p>www.nytimes.com/2018/05/22/opinion/alabama-poverty-sewers.amp.html
Healthcare here is so f-ed up, I can't believe we don't produce more medical refugees to other countries. All this shit show makes Mexico look like an advanced country.
I'm gonna echo here what I heard on a podcast the other day:<p>somehow "socialism" is a dirty word in the US, even though the US citizens absolutely love their socialism when they get it.