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YouTube channel owners: Is your content directed to children?

95 pointsby yskchuover 5 years ago

19 comments

PeterStuerover 5 years ago
The ftc acts as if the content creator is in control: He can <i>choose</i> to monetize his <i>website</i> through YouTube or not. In practice YouTube is a defacto monopoly for these kinds of <i>websites</i>.<p>Now the creators ask YouTube: please give us an option to have channels that are free of under 13 viewers. It is not my target demographic, and while your own analytics tell me there are a few of those watching, I do not want them here. Either block them or if they show up just comply with COPA and don&#x27;t track them, OK?<p>But then YouTube goes: no can do. We either track everyone or no-one, your choice, and BTW n the latter case, we will decimate your revenue. But you are as always free to leave for some other <i>webhost</i>. LOL! Hey, and BTW, if you do indicate that your channel is not directed at kids, you are hereby informed that it is 100% you that is on the line, not us, if the FTC decides otherwise as we do nothing with all that analytics we have to turn away the kids from your doorstep.<p>So content creators are left up shit creeck without a paddle.
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robbrown451over 5 years ago
I&#x27;m really not fond of rules that force you to make black and white decisions on things that are inherently in shades of gray.<p>I watch a lot of stuff with my 5 year old daughter -- whether on YouTube or elsewhere -- than we both seem to equally enjoy. Recent ones include Star Wars Resistance, The Mandalorian, Spirited Away, From Up on Poppy Hill, The Incredibles 2.<p>On YouTube we watch &quot;how it&#x27;s made&quot; videos, as well as a lot of music videos, such as Taylor Swift and Billish Eilish. A lot of stuff probably has a median age of viewers that is right around the cutoff age, 13. But lots of over-18 adults like them too and would watch them completely in the absence of kids.<p>Are these things &quot;for kids&quot;? I don&#x27;t see how you would make that determination.
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jacobwilliamroyover 5 years ago
How did youtube manage to convince the ftc that their practice of illegally surveilling minors is somehow the fault of youtube users? Doesn&#x27;t every youtube user provide their age when they make an account? Shouldn&#x27;t youtube have some kind of predicate like &quot;if child doNotTrack&quot;?<p>I think google might be committing libel here. Claiming their users violate coppa when their users can&#x27;t even control who google does or does not spy on.
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hstreetover 5 years ago
I haven&#x27;t done much research on this topic yet. But it&#x27;s my understanding that, to sum up:<p>1. It&#x27;s easier not to target children.<p>2. This is more of a nuisance for established channels, as they have to edit every video and mark whether it&#x27;s directed to children or not.<p>That&#x27;s if I&#x27;m not wrong. I mean, I&#x27;ve mainly gotten my information from this one video so far: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=3GwDrHOe43E" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=3GwDrHOe43E</a><p>I&#x27;m only a new creator so it&#x27;s not really going to be much for me to worry about, and I can&#x27;t think of a single reason why anyone under the age of 13 would want to watch my content anyway. It&#x27;s about as boring adult topic stuff (building a business and corporate life rantings) as you can get.
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manigandhamover 5 years ago
How Youtube is handling this is a major failure. Even if creators say their videos aren&#x27;t for kids, they can still be contested, overruled and fined.<p>A proper solution is to create an age-gate for videos with categories of kids only, older-only, and general audience (which is allowed by the FTC). Also stop tracking tracking anonymous users.<p>This would allow creators to categorize content without losing all monetization and features, or risking legal action. That would be more expensive to implement though so it&#x27;s not happening.
hackerbabzover 5 years ago
Can borderline channels just say “fuck” at some point in the middle of the video.
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WrtCdEvrydyover 5 years ago
&gt; The Rule allows for civil penalties of up to $42,530 per violation<p>&gt; FTC considers a number of factors in determining the appropriate amount<p>&gt; the operator paid a total civil penalty of $35,000<p>I&#x27;ll take &#x27;Captured Agency for $100, Alex&#x27;
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droithommeover 5 years ago
This is totally insane! If children like to watch your youtube channel (perhaps it is Algebra tips or information about dinosaurs or black holes) you&#x27;re required to obtain parental consent? The problem with designating the channel host as the person responsible is <i>they are not the one collecting the information nor do they even have access to most of it</i>. YouTube is the one collecting and using the info.<p>No where on my YouTube channels am I allowed to see the ip address of anyone who views it. Nor can I track individuals. But YouTube themselves can and do do this.<p>Also collecting legally binding consent from parents for their kids to watch channels is going to be way more of a breech of personally identifying information than not having that rule. For legally binding consent I&#x27;m going to have to verify their actual identity and that they are the legal guardian of the minor watching the channel. And from a practical standpoint I don&#x27;t even see there is any way at all that doing so is even technically possible given the current YouTube design.<p>The only way to comply with this is to kill all videos and channels that have any content that might be of interest to children. Die all you homework help and approachable science channels!
jacobwilliamroyover 5 years ago
&gt; channel owners<p>Do youtube users actually &quot;own&quot; their channels or is this just an incorrect wording? What is meant by &quot;own&quot; here?
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aplacelikethisover 5 years ago
... so now every YouTube video aimed at the general public has to open with some violence, drug use or sexual content? Just to make it abundantly clear that it&#x27;s not for children?
jcriddle4over 5 years ago
The proposed new rules might mean an over 50% cut in revenue to a channel possibly driving the smaller players out. Very interesting side effects of regulations.
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ropiwqefjnpoaover 5 years ago
I subscribe to a video game channel that primarily covers only racing games and hardly swears. Is that considered directed to children? This is such a mess.
csoursover 5 years ago
Dan Olson&#x2F;Folding Ideas: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=LuScIN4emyo" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=LuScIN4emyo</a><p>Upshot is that YouTube is pretending that they can&#x27;t make good segmenting tools.
throw7over 5 years ago
Nice to know that the actual parents of children are the channel owners of youtube and google.<p>cool.
killjoywashereover 5 years ago
99% of channel owners producing content for children know their market includes children; the other 1% are lying. This gives Youtube&#x27;s army of annotators better basis to flag the liars. Not just that the content is directed to children, but that they are liars.
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ClaudioHGover 5 years ago
I think this mess (because it is a mess) is two fold. On one side FTC mistakenly deems content creators as &quot;operators&quot; of &quot;websites&quot; or &quot;online services&quot;. This terminology is very important as it is the legal basis upon which the FTC may go after content creators. On the other side YouTube have managed to deal their penalty by accepting to &quot;police&quot; their content creators (as it can be clearly understood by carefully hearing what the FTC representative said in the press conference) by adding this new &quot;made for kids&quot; checkbox, and at the same time refuses to implement a gate age that would solve this whole mess at the root.<p>Also, the word &quot;kids&quot; do not exist in the legal parlance of the code nor the Rule set by FTC, they only mention &quot;children&quot; and they provide a definition for them: every person in the 0-12 ages. This is also to clarify some confusion that may arises from the concept of &quot;minor age&quot; and &quot;children&quot; as defined by this law.<p>So let&#x27;s first address the FTC assumption that content creators are &quot;websites&quot; or &quot;online services&quot;, remembering that what is relevant here is the collection of personal information from children <i>without prior verifiable parent&#x27;s consent</i>.<p>So let&#x27;s make just one rethoric question: do content creators really own their &quot;channels&quot;? Do they are able to verify parent&#x27;s authorization and provide them the information about the use of the collected information? Do they can even access the collected data? Do they have the ability to make any change on their &quot;website&quot; apart what YouTube allows them to do? Of course no, no, no.<p>Here the FTC have attempted to charge a responsibility on the content creators&#x27; shoulders assuming something they are not. With the pretext content creators benefit bt earning a small, SMALL, share from what YouTube&#x2F;Google earn exploiting their creativity, art and skills, FTC is mistakenly assuming they are &quot;websites&quot; or &quot;online services&quot; when they actually lack all the relevant power required to do things that could make them compliant (or non-compliant) with the law.<p>Content creators are just users, or at most suppliers as a storyteller authors would be for a publisher, while YouTube have the ultimate control of how, where, when, and at whom to serve <i>its</i> content (yeah, because you give to YT a worldwide unlimited non-exclusive license of your content when you upload on their platform, so as long as you do not remove your content they hold it in full control).<p>YouTube already have broken the law by tracking children without parent&#x27;s consent, as we learned from the Civil Judgment and the attached Exhibits; so let&#x27;s now suppose you label your content as &quot;for kids&quot;, well, what tells you they won&#x27;t break the law again? They say they turn off many features to avoid to track children, but is that for real? Are you in control to check that through your &quot;website&quot; they won&#x27;t really collect data from children? Where is your power in doing so?<p>There is none. And remember the law is about collecting data from children without parental consent, not labeling your videos to be &quot;made for kids&quot;. Under the current FTC&#x27;s assumption you would be deemed liable even if you labeled your videos as &quot;made for kids&quot; if, despite this, YT would collect data from children.<p>Into this swamp YouTube is swimming to make business as usual by placing persistent identifiers (AKA cookies) to track users while handing over the liability to the content creators, with the complicity of the FTC it seems.<p>Now, let&#x27;s have a moment to think about GDPR, is YT compliant with that Regulation too? If you are an EU resident, did you ever seen a notice that inform you what cookies are used, what data are collected, where, and the exact address of who is in charge to ask about your data and to exercise your rights under the provisions of the GDPR?<p>(It is a genuine question, I did not check.)
acollins1331over 5 years ago
Spiderman and Elsa videos just got the vanned
ferongrover 5 years ago
The Mouse strikes again.
oceanghostover 5 years ago
I&#x27;d like to make a point here that isn&#x27;t coming up enough in this conversation.<p><i>GOOGLE</i> knowingly tracked children, marketed towards them, but somehow the FTC allowed them to transfer liability to their creators.<p>No creator has <i>ever</i> tracked children, and yet, they are liable for Google&#x27;s actions?<p>What options am I left here? I can&#x27;t make content for children of even talk about anything that might appeal to a child; I can&#x27;t make adult content or swear, or be dark because advertisers don&#x27;t like that.
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