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Riot is now Element

550 pointsby J_ttalmost 5 years ago

51 comments

badrabbitalmost 5 years ago
No!!! Of all the names in the world why this. &quot;Hey bro, let&#x27;s chat on Element&quot; ,not quite a ring to it.<p>The hardest problem in computer science strikes again!<p>Matrix,Riot and Libolm are epic projects, I wish them all the success but man, even Riot was a hard sell as a brand. I would seriously be dissapointed if it loses popularity over this. I don&#x27;t think the project maintainers understand that their core users&#x2F;fans are waiting for a product they can sell to friends,family and coworkers.<p>People who don&#x27;t know tech rely on branding&#x2F;brand reputation and word of mouth reputation to decide if they are intetested in even trying out a product to begin with.<p>Which of these is unlike the others?<p>1) Signal<p>2) Telegram<p>3) Element<p>4) Whatsapp<p>Hint: The theme is messaging and communication.
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easytigeralmost 5 years ago
Press release pro tip: sidle in what the company or app does very early in. Verging on all of the releases I read on HN don&#x27;t do this but are for companies I&#x27;ve not heard of. So you leave knowing almost nothing about the company
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usbfingersalmost 5 years ago
If you dislike the new name, branding, or user experience, instead of arguing over why or why not it is a good decision, I&#x27;d encourage you to get yourself involved and be that change.<p>Before the rebrand, or even any talk user experience and design from Element (Riot), I didn&#x27;t want to wait and started working on a privacy centric matrix client that focused on branding and user experience. I managed to get E2EE working by myself within a month using the Matrix provided encryption library.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;syphon.org" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;syphon.org</a><p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;syphon-org&#x2F;syphon" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;syphon-org&#x2F;syphon</a><p>For the record, I don&#x27;t think Element is a bad name. Regardless of the name itself, this is a massive leap forward for their branding. The user experience seems to have been cleaned up dramatically in the new versions of their iOS and Android apps.
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dividedbyzeroalmost 5 years ago
That&#x27;s been long overdue and will hopefully help Matrix make inroads into more conservative organizations; I believe the tech is really promising. It&#x27;s a definite liability, trying to introduce people to Matrix, when the de-facto default client&#x27;s name evokes all kinds of unhelpful associations – it doesn&#x27;t sound like work at all and it does sound like gamers, toys, apparently even like a far-left political organisation. Element should be fine for everyone.
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iziettoalmost 5 years ago
I don&#x27;t like the new name, is too generic. I think an original alternative would have been better, like Trello, Slack, ...
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totetsualmost 5 years ago
Previous thread <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=23611863" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=23611863</a> and blog post about why <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;element.io&#x2F;blog&#x2F;the-world-is-changing&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;element.io&#x2F;blog&#x2F;the-world-is-changing&#x2F;</a> and the blog post about the new name <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;element.io&#x2F;blog&#x2F;welcome-to-element&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;element.io&#x2F;blog&#x2F;welcome-to-element&#x2F;</a>
varbhatalmost 5 years ago
Main reason is that they couldn&#x27;t trademark the &quot;Riot&quot; name due to &quot;Riot Games&quot; company.<p>Edit: They have mentioned this in the blog. Please read that before downvoting.
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C4storalmost 5 years ago
After various HN threads about this company, and taking a tour on the element.io website, I&#x27;m still not sure what this is about to be honest.<p>I understand it&#x27;s a chat app, but<p>- The pricing is really confusing (seems like the app is free, but having an account is paying ?). - Is this a professional thing, like slack, or more of a whatsapp-like thing ? Trying to do both ? The whole differentation point seems to be based on the Matrix thing, but it&#x27;s not really clear why is that important ? (I don&#x27;t typically care about the backend of the app I use).<p>I mean, the front page says : &quot;All-in-one secure chat app for teams, friends and organisations. Keeps conversations in your control, safe from data-mining and ads. Talk to everyone through the open global Matrix network, protected by proper end-to-end encryption.&quot;<p>So, the starter is what everyone says. &quot;Safe from data mining and ads&quot; is good, it makes me curious about what is the pricing then, and I wouldn&#x27;t mind paying a cheap price for a correct messaging app. And then there&#x27;s this Matrix bit, and I don&#x27;t even know if it&#x27;s good or bad. So I went to the pricing page (which doesn&#x27;t exist, but there are &quot;plans&quot;) and here, well the app is free, and I can get my account hosted either somewhere free, or either on the Element Matrix servers, where it should be safe from eavesdropping ? But with proper end to end encryption, it should be safe everywhere ? Or is the app by default not end to end encrypted, but hosting it somewhere makes it so ? It sounds really weird to be honest.<p>So really, good for you for renaming, but I don&#x27;t think it&#x27;s what will make me change (even though since whatsapp is facebook owned, I&#x27;m ready to migrate myself and my whole family on something else once the ads are there).
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natural219almost 5 years ago
I gotta say; I haven&#x27;t paid attention to Matrix for years, but I downloaded the Riot client again last week and HOLY COW. Everything is <i>so</i> smooth, beautiful, performant, and feature-filled.<p>They have Slack&#x2F;Discord-like communities, awesome easy E2E verification, and almost every feature I want out of Discord, including video&#x2F;voice chat powered by WebRTC out of the box.<p>Really incredible work the Matrix team has done on this. I was a decentralization reseracher for years, and I&#x27;d never imagined things would get this polished from a UI perspective. I think Matrix is the best current bet for decentralization services (Urbit following up in a close second), and will plan on digging in to hosting my own server at some point.<p>If you haven&#x27;t used Riot &#x2F; Element in a while, I highly recommend you give it a try. Smooth as butter.<p>[edit: the bikeshedding here is infuriating. &quot;Element chat&quot; is a perfectly fine Google query. users being entitled primadonnas (sorry, I know that&#x27;s hostile, but I think it&#x27;s warranted) and expecting every software release to have Google&#x2F;Facebook tier marketing effort behind them is the #1 problem in the adoption of decentralized platforms, and should be eradicated from civil discourse about internet infrastructure. just my two cents.]
beemanalmost 5 years ago
Great name I&#x27;d say! If I would consider converting people like my parents to a new app, I&#x27;m sure Element has a bigger chance than Riot because of the connotations with the name of the latter.
sixhobbitsalmost 5 years ago
Even as someone who has kind of been following along with Matrix development and this renaming thing, this post is really confusing.<p>If you go through a major rebrand, you&#x27;ve probably spent something like 1000 hours thinking about names and what they mean.<p>Your users haven&#x27;t.<p>Get someone else to write the explanation of the rebrand. You can&#x27;t do it yourself when you&#x27;re too involved.
deckar01almost 5 years ago
&gt; We’re obviously aware that Element is (once again) both a dictionary word and a mathematical term.<p>and a ~30 year old, mainstream skateboard brand owned by the billion dollar, international Quiksilver company.
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pteraspidomorphalmost 5 years ago
I don&#x27;t care about SEO, but as an infrequent user I always liked that Riot was a snappy, two syllable, memorable name (I never forgot it). Synapse and Matrix are also easy for me to remember, I must add. I suspect I may forget Element--too close to a word I use every day (HTML elements, chemical elements, etc.) We&#x27;ll see. Either way I expect I can get there by looking up &quot;matrix client,&quot; of course.<p>EDIT: one -&gt; two
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troymcalmost 5 years ago
One problem with &quot;Element&quot; is its potential for confusion with other, similarly-named tech products, such as:<p>- Adobe Photoshop Elements<p>- Adobe Premiere Elements<p>- Elementor, one of the more popular WordPress plugins<p>- Element UI, a Vue 2.0 based component library<p>- Elements XS, GIS-centric asset management software<p>There&#x27;s even an IT company named Element Technologies: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.ele-ment.com&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.ele-ment.com&#x2F;</a> (no affiliation).
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LarvaFXalmost 5 years ago
I don&#x27;t like the name because it is so generic and for me the word invokes no association with communication whatsoever.
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surroundalmost 5 years ago
On the thread 3 months ago for <i>Launch HN: Riot (YC W20) - Phishing training for your team</i><p>&gt; Hi Ben - cool product! Speaking as the lead for Riot.im, I would recommend picking another name asap, if nothing else because Riot Games has an awful lot of lawyers (as we know first hand, unfortunately).<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=22677841" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=22677841</a><p>Then, 22 days ago, <i>We’ve decided to rename riot</i><p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=23611863" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=23611863</a>
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rvzalmost 5 years ago
While a name change was a sensible move, I had very high hopes for them to choose a saner non-technical one with a more user-friendly focus, but this name sounds very generic and is more cryptic that &quot;Signal&quot;.<p>They now have to do some serious SEO to be the first result on a Google search of &quot;Element&quot;.
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x87678ralmost 5 years ago
I still dont understand why Slack is popular when there is a free open source solution matrix&#x2F;riot&#x2F;element that works just as well.
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gaddersalmost 5 years ago
I like what people are doing with Riot&#x2F;Element&#x2F;Matrix but it&#x27;s still a bit janky. Half the chats I join are filled with messages about missing session keys.
lvturneralmost 5 years ago
So many of these comments just feel like bikeshedding.<p>By most arguments here basecamp is an awful name for a company and hey is a terrible name for an email application - it doesn&#x27;t seem to be holding them back though.<p>For those not familiar with bikeshedding please see: <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;bikeshed.com&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;bikeshed.com&#x2F;</a>
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dfeealmost 5 years ago
I speak English, but I can’t follow what this means:<p>&gt; In fact we have simplified all our naming: Element is also the name for New Vector (the company behind Riot) while Modular, our flagship Matrix hosting service, has become Element Matrix Services.<p>Is New Vector now names Element, too? Or is this some sort of nickname? A doing business as name?
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shash7almost 5 years ago
Do these people care about search results? With a name like that, most people will have a difficult time searching for element related stuff.
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40fouralmost 5 years ago
I was never really aware of these products before, and I’m very interested! So I browsed over to the main site, found the pricing page and got this.<p><i>” We&#x27;re busy building our pricing table &amp; purchasing experience on mobile, for now please visit this page on your desktop.”</i><p>Um, what? I mean, I’m honestly more interested in self hosting, but this really seems like a good way to miss out on a lot of sales.<p>Won’t something simple suffice as a placeholder, until the larger ‘experience’ is finished? How many people have seen this when they aren’t near a desktop, only to never return?
olah_1almost 5 years ago
Awesome! And now that RiotX is out of beta, please divert those resources to Element iOS because it _desperately_ needs some UX love.
teekertalmost 5 years ago
The post references their new website [0] and talks about RiotX, their new website [1] however links to Riot.im [2], not RiotX [3], what to get?<p>Also, I have to set a password, but also a recovery password which should not be the same... Yet, I store them together in my KeepassXC db. Why would that be? Oh, now I run into a message key, the third to store in the same db entry :)<p>[0] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;element.io&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;element.io&#x2F;</a><p>[1] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;element.io&#x2F;get-started" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;element.io&#x2F;get-started</a><p>[2] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;play.google.com&#x2F;store&#x2F;apps&#x2F;details?id=im.vector.app" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;play.google.com&#x2F;store&#x2F;apps&#x2F;details?id=im.vector.app</a><p>[3] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;play.google.com&#x2F;store&#x2F;apps&#x2F;details?id=im.vector.riotx" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;play.google.com&#x2F;store&#x2F;apps&#x2F;details?id=im.vector.riot...</a>
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lrvickalmost 5 years ago
Love the name. Simple, and is going to be pretty hard for society to attach negative connotations to it.<p>Elements are the flexible foundation of everything and in turn Element can be a flexible foundation for communication.<p>At the end of the day it boils down to getting control of a namespace and then owning it over time.<p>Slack and Apple have clearly shown this works just fine.
asimopsalmost 5 years ago
What I don&#x27;t understand: &#x27;Riot is now Element&#x27;, yet when you click on &#x27;Get Element&#x27; on the website and select the android app &gt; &#x27;Riot.im&#x27; by &#x27;Vector Creations Limited&#x27; package name &#x27;im.vector.app&#x27; IMHO if you rebrand it, everything should be in place.
abrownealmost 5 years ago
Another post on the homepage now: &quot;Element wins deal to supply half a million licences for German education system&quot;. I was going to point out that it&#x27;s a pretty generic name being used by other groups, but when I read that linked article I see it&#x27;s the same Element :-D
cpetersoalmost 5 years ago
Just for fun: here&#x27;s the City Barge pub in London mentioned in the blog post&#x27;s UI screenshot. :)<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.timeout.com&#x2F;london&#x2F;bars-and-pubs&#x2F;city-barge" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.timeout.com&#x2F;london&#x2F;bars-and-pubs&#x2F;city-barge</a>
justajalmost 5 years ago
PSA for all Riot&#x2F;Element Android users: RiotX came out of beta too soon. Voice and video calls don&#x27;t seem to be implemented in non-DM encrypted rooms. So if you created an e2e room and invited someone there, you can no longer call them.
greatgibalmost 5 years ago
It will be impossible to find on Google. Also, I&#x27;m wondering if it a good choice for such a project to use the hipster &#x27;.io&#x27; domain regarding the risk in a near future with this domain name.
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reilly3000almost 5 years ago
Anybody who is questioning the need for the a name change in the first place should read up on the story of Piwik, Piwik Pro, and Matomo. Hostile forks are real, and they are fantastic messes.
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nix23almost 5 years ago
Bravo i have to say. Riot was a really good name for a project in the post NSA&#x2F;Snowden time, but since we already forgot that, Element is much more Acceptable for the big wash ;)
shmerlalmost 5 years ago
Can&#x27;t connect to Element after logging in. Even old Riot.im stopped working properly. A pretty bumpy switch I suppose.
aaaaarghZombiesalmost 5 years ago
OK serious question perhaps someone connected to matrix &#x2F; element will see this.<p>The name change from riot coincided with the murder of George Floyd and following surge unrest under the banner of Black Lives Matter. What&#x27;s the teams position this, are they trying to distance themselves from the protests, if so why? If not, why?
Twisellalmost 5 years ago
Dunno elsewhere but in France pretty solid fist results on both Google and DDG referring to element hardware from matrix audio (founded 2009). Look like once a legal team enjoyed the fun of legal dispute they always ask for more...<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.matrix-digi.com" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.matrix-digi.com</a>
jakubnarebskialmost 5 years ago
It looks like Riot.im accounts got forcible password change - at least I cannot login with my saved riot.im password to element.io<p>There is nothing of note there in my case, but resetting&#x2F;changing password supposedly means loosing conversation history. Not good!
dharma1almost 5 years ago
Nice, look forward to the web&#x2F;desktop version! I think the name is fine, people will routinely use the new name in a few months time. Better to change the name now than 10 million users later.<p>The new site looks great, but the pricing page is a bit confusing.<p>Godspeed!
paride5745almost 5 years ago
Now I wish Mattermost would become a Matrix client!
arkanoalmost 5 years ago
Not to be confused with element.ai
louskenalmost 5 years ago
any plans to fix riot.imX beta on older android versions (5.X)? my friend can&#x27;t even send messages (they are all just red) since some 0.9X version (not sure which exactly)
cyberbanjoalmost 5 years ago
Didn&#x27;t they just rename it from something else?
adultSwimalmost 5 years ago
Riot, Slack, Discord, ... those names sound bad
andersonrktonalmost 5 years ago
So the game developer is now the Linux distro.
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subroutinealmost 5 years ago
Discord is next.
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tantaloralmost 5 years ago
Is this not Riot Games?
bzb3almost 5 years ago
Sometimes it feels like riot is being sabotaged from the inside.
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sherri-mealmost 5 years ago
I like it
J_ttalmost 5 years ago
Blog post: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;element.io&#x2F;blog&#x2F;welcome-to-element&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;element.io&#x2F;blog&#x2F;welcome-to-element&#x2F;</a><p>I couldn&#x27;t find it when I initially posted this.<p>While I understand the change, it was definitely awkward timing given that I was championing a transition to Matrix. I&#x27;ve been encouraging my coworkers to download the client, and next thing I know the website has completely changed and they&#x27;ve removed the link to download the desktop client.
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numeromanceralmost 5 years ago
Maybe they should have called it &quot;Protest&quot;.
echelonalmost 5 years ago
Speaking of names, I&#x27;m upset that the username I go by is taken. I&#x27;m echelon @ { gmail, HN, Twitter, Github, Gitlab, Square Cash, etc }, but found Riot &#x2F; Matrix just a few months too late to get my username.<p>I&#x27;m not satisfied with the &quot;just stand up your own server&quot; response as an alternative.<p>I know it&#x27;s cutting off my nose, but I&#x27;ve avoided using it because of this. I&#x27;m OCD about stupid usernames.<p>I wish unused usernames got garbage collected.<p>I really like how Discord handles usernames.
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