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Designing a New Old Home: Part 1

304 pointsby stepstopalmost 5 years ago

27 comments

WalterBrightalmost 5 years ago
My house is a custom one. It&#x27;s substantially different from the usual pacific northwest home design. For example, the eaves are about 2 feet deep. This keeps the walls dry &amp; clean, keeps water from getting in the basement, and shades the house in summer.<p>Almost no houses have substantial eaves.<p>Also, I have too much experience with rotted wood decks, this one is concrete :-) and it ever so slightly slopes away from the house. All in an effort to keep the house naturally dry. A damp house is a terrible thing in the PNW.<p>Don&#x27;t ever buy a house where the driveway slopes towards the garage. You&#x27;ll get a flooded garage&#x2F;basement at some point guaranteed. Make sure your garage floor has a slight slope towards the door. It&#x27;s the little things like this that count. (You can&#x27;t even tell there is a slope on mine, except it&#x27;s much easier to push the car out of the garage than in.)<p>Houses around here on the north slope of a hill are cheaper than on the south slope. There&#x27;s a good reason for that. Hello mildew!
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brendoelfrendoalmost 5 years ago
&gt; They seem designed primarily to maximize one thing: the square-footage number that will be on the listing when it’s sold.<p>Say it again for the people in the back! This is probably my biggest complaint with modern suburban housing&#x2F;McMansions. You can see it in the exterior design of the house; you see all kinds of horrendous roof lines, mismatched windows of all shapes and sizes, odd material choices, etc. The houses suffer because they&#x27;re trying to build the most square footage on the smallest possible lot. I know density is the way to go in urban development, but... I feel like developers have lost the plot.
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yklalmost 5 years ago
Last year my wife and I bought out first house. Given our budget, we had the option of either buying a new big McMansion type home further out from the city, or buying a smaller older home closer to the city. We wound up buying a smaller house built in the 1940s and gutting&#x2F;renovating&#x2F;modernizing the interior, and on a whole I&#x27;m really happy with the result.<p>The house itself feels like when it was originally built, more careful thought was put into where windows are, how rooms are lit, how rooms are ventilated, how spaces flow into each other, and so on and so forth. After our renovation work, we now also have all of the modern niceties like ethernet running through all of the walls and a shiny kitchen and shiny bathrooms and modern hardwood flooring and whatnot. Every part of the house now feels like it&#x27;s the way it is specifically because we wanted it to be that way, and relatively speaking, it cost less than it would have to get a new cookie-cutter McMansion type monstrosity around here. As a bonus, the neighborhood feels cozier and friendlier and less empty compared to newer cookie-cutter type development tracts too.<p>The only downside is that the square footage is considerably smaller, but I have no idea what people are supposed to do with all of the empty space in a giant house anyway. Oh, I guess another minor downside was discovering that no two doors in the entire house are exactly the same size, so we wound up having to get custom doors made.<p>Of course, your mileage will vary depending on where you are, budget, contractors, etc; we lucked out and managed to find contractors that cared about their craft and put a lot of thought into things.
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war1025almost 5 years ago
I don&#x27;t really have anything to contribute to this, but I found the article super interesting.<p>Perhaps a thing I could add is that Part 2 [1] is available, which wasn&#x27;t immediately obvious to me.<p>[1] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;medium.com&#x2F;@simon.sarris&#x2F;designing-a-new-old-home-part-2-2a5ea1a1b2b3" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;medium.com&#x2F;@simon.sarris&#x2F;designing-a-new-old-home-pa...</a>
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everybodyknowsalmost 5 years ago
&gt; (or linoleum) has replaced the rest<p>We wish. Linoleum is a natural, renewable product, made from linseed oil and plant fiber. Linoleum was replaced decades ago in commodity construction by vinyl tile, which is much cheaper to manufacture.
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CalRobertalmost 5 years ago
Thanks for sharing this - for people who like pictures, the instagram feed (linked at the bottom of the article) is well worth adding.<p>&quot;Homes are not built by people intending to live in them.&quot; - this really gets to the issue, I think. Somewhere along the line we took away most people&#x27;s ability to construct their own home (or they just lost it), and of course if houses are viewed primarily as holding value for equity, you need to consider resale instead of your own preferences when making decisions.
TYPE_FASTERalmost 5 years ago
Downside in having an old (1890s for us) home: nothing is the same size, and none of them are the same.<p>Upside in having an old home: you get to go to a restoration&#x2F;recycling center, wander through the vast sections of hanging doors until you find the section that fits what you need, and find an interesting one you like.<p>Our home was a hobby for a while. Now I have different priorities for time. But that was an awesome learning experience, and I feel lucky I went through it.<p>My dad drafted a house at night at work (he was a mechanical engineer prior to retirement). Then he built it, subcontracting out parts like some of the framing, drywall, etc. My parents ended up with exactly the house they wanted. It was really cool to see happen, made anything seem possible.
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MilesTegalmost 5 years ago
I just bought an old house(1920s) and so have been doing a lot of thinking about how much better the layout of surviving old houses are.<p>1. Natural lighting. I generally do not need artificial lights in the daytime in any room and it is amazing.<p>2. Ceiling height. Modern constructions have insanely high ceilings. Why? In my old apartment I had cabinetr y I couldn&#x27;t reach even with my step ladder.<p>3. Old neighborhoods are much more pleasant to live in and are more much walk-able than post-war cul-de-sac filled developments.<p>4. House sizes were smaller back then. Since family sizes have been getting smaller I think this would be a good thing to return to. I am quite happy that I don&#x27;t have to spend a lot extra on furniture just to fill the space. Or pay more to climate control the extra volume.<p>5. A matter of personal preference but I think the older houses are just prettier.<p>I think it would be great if developers took a look at the older house designs and tweaked them for the modern world.
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iramilleralmost 5 years ago
In all this discussion of the art of design in old houses I am surprised to see no one has mentioned “A Pattern Language” [1] yet. This is truly a must read book for anyone considering the design and building of their own house.<p>Interesting topics such as the design of a front door viewed from a street have stuck with me and is something I reflect on when walking through an old neighborhood. Infallibly the most appealing houses match up well to the principals outlined in the book.<p>[1] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;A_Pattern_Language" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;A_Pattern_Language</a>
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hoorayimhelpingalmost 5 years ago
For the folks who check the comments first, this is worth reading:<p>&gt;<i>But then something happened: the average knob with a lock has a fair amount of internal complexity, but the beauty has been completely stripped out. We no longer think of knobs, hinges, latches, or locks as things worth making beautiful, and we think this at a time when it should be easier and cheaper than ever to make such things beautiful. When they were difficult to make, iron latches and handles resembled hands, lions, flowers, gargoyles, etc. Now that a latch is easy to make, they look like nothing. It is worth carefully pondering this, I think, beyond the words of this article and well beyond door knobs.</i><p>This is from part 2 <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;medium.com&#x2F;@simon.sarris&#x2F;designing-a-new-old-home-part-2-2a5ea1a1b2b3" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;medium.com&#x2F;@simon.sarris&#x2F;designing-a-new-old-home-pa...</a>, linked here: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=23901248" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=23901248</a>
everybodyknowsalmost 5 years ago
&gt;you should read two books. The first is Get Your House Right: Architectural Elements to Use &amp; Avoid<p>I own and have read a copy, excellent. Note however that it&#x27;s entirely oriented toward traditional design: Deco, Streamline Moderne, and Mid-Mod are terra incognita. Eichler fans, you have been warned.
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contingenciesalmost 5 years ago
For anyone embarking on a similar project, check out <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;osarch.org&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;osarch.org&#x2F;</a><p>I was amazed to come from no background in architecture to getting a land survey converted in to Blender 3D model and having accurate sun simulations running on architectural concepts within a week or two. Seems like Sketchup dying has gifted a lot of momentum to the open source space. Use it! It&#x27;s pretty capable stuff.<p>Also, plant trees. Trees last a long time (longer than many houses), cost nearly nothing and provide excellent psychological and physical features which built environment cannot match.
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yingw787almost 5 years ago
...do you have a GitHub repo for checklisting items for building a custom house like this? I&#x27;m nowhere near financially secure enough to even begin planning for something like this. But it&#x27;d be cool to look through the checklist and have people contribute things you might forget, and it might be useful for others.
sarcheralmost 5 years ago
As someone who works in residential construction, this is one of the better looks at what a &#x27;good&#x27; process looks like from the homeowner side of the equation. The only places where my advice would differ:<p>- They finished the floors instead of having a subcontractor do it. Everyone&#x27;s comfort for various home improvements tasks differs, but this is one that I typically see farmed out. The people who do it everyday are very fast and competent - as a first timer it&#x27;s hard to avoid making mistakes. I also advise people to avoid floor stains. One advantage to a real wood floor is it&#x27;s easy to repair and refinish in the future, but this gets a lot harder when you start needing to stain match. Floor stain also kind of violates the tenants of &#x27;honest materials&#x27; that the author discusses.<p>- To build on their point about veneer plaster walls, cost really comes down to subcontractor comfort with that detail. It&#x27;s only &#x27;slightly more expensive&#x27; if you have a contractor that does it all the time. If you live in an area with a lot of plaster homes, you&#x27;ll have more luck finding someone who can do this work affordably. For example, I once had an architect specify a particular plaster finish (&#x27;venetian plaster&#x27;) where we could not find someone comfortable doing the work within a two hour drive.<p>- They discuss the slow drying of the floor finish they used as a negative (true). A good place to use slow-drying finishing techniques is the exterior, as you can leave it alone for a lot longer as compared to a floor you want to walk on immediately. For example, pine tar exterior finishing materials take weeks to dry, but you don&#x27;t NEED to touch the siding during that period.<p>- In the second part they show a north and south elevation of the finished home. The north elevation really doesn&#x27;t reflect the historic character they succeeded so hard to emulate and&#x2F;or build from in other aspects of their home. Comparing these two elevations is very instructive.<p>I hope their next published section addresses energy efficiency and adjacent topics (like window selection). It&#x27;s a huge part of building a modern home that doesn&#x27;t always get the attention it should. I did appreciate the time spent discussing air flow in part 2.<p>Building on their reading list, if you like older&#x2F;vernacular homes start with:<p>&quot;House&quot; by Tracy Kidder<p>&quot;A Field Guide to American Houses&quot; by Virginia Savage McAlester<p>&quot;American Shelter&quot; by Lester Walker<p>&quot;The American House&quot; by Mary Mix Foley<p>And maybe move on to:<p>&quot;A Concise History of American Architecture&quot; by Leland Roth<p>&quot;American Vernacular: Buildings and Interiors, 1870-1960&quot; by Herbert Gottfried<p>&quot;Norwegian Wood: The Thoughtful Architecture of Wenche Selmer&quot; by Elisabeth Tostrup<p>&quot;Big House, Little House, Back House, Barn&quot; by Thomas Hubka<p>And then maybe:<p>&quot;The Well-Built House&quot; by Jim Locke<p>&quot;The colonial House Then and Now&quot; by Francis Underwood<p>&quot;Little House on a Small Planet&quot; by Shay Salomon
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rhaps0dyalmost 5 years ago
Isn&#x27;t this a <i>lot</i> of work? I suppose it&#x27;s perhaps worth it if you plan to live in a place for a long time, but surely there are specialists that do this for a living? Like, can&#x27;t you just pay an architect to design the thing?
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MH15almost 5 years ago
A lot of commenters are suffering from the bias we suffer from every time we discuss issues of the past: the &quot;old homes&quot; are good in party because they have passed the test of generations. The bad designs from those generations have largely been torn down. Just because something is old does not make it good.<p>It is another question entirely why we continue to fall for the same poor designs.
evandevalmost 5 years ago
Another great book is &quot;How to Build in the Country: Good Advice from the Past on how to Choose a Site, Plan, Design, Build, Decorate &amp; Landscape Your Country Home&quot;[0]<p>0: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;smile.amazon.com&#x2F;dp&#x2F;0966307518&#x2F;ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_U_ImGfFb8DE7Z2S" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;smile.amazon.com&#x2F;dp&#x2F;0966307518&#x2F;ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_...</a>
zrailalmost 5 years ago
We just bought a mid-century modern house originally built in 1955 and completely redone in 2009. Some of the choices are extremely questionable and some of them are obviously dated, but in general I like living here much more than our 2004-vintage tract house. The light and layout are just so much better.
j_m_balmost 5 years ago
Living in the Chicago area suburbs (think John Hughes), I developed a fondness for the Frank Lloyd Wright prairie style homes. Is it possible to get blueprints for actual FLW homes that you could give to a builder... even perhaps yourself?
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everybodyknowsalmost 5 years ago
My go-to technical encyclopedia for getting a house right:<p>www.finehomebuilding.com&#x2F;
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vmurthyalmost 5 years ago
Love the amount of details that has gone into this. Truly is a work of passion. I am waiting for a part-3 which should hopefully cover some of the &quot;techy&quot; stuff that can be built into the home. For e.g., Ethernet cables all over? USB ports in the wall itself in addition to switches? Speaking of which, what tech stuff would <i>you</i> build into your homes?
aimoralmost 5 years ago
&gt; With some careful choices and by doing some of the finishing ourselves, we thought we could make it relatively inexpensively, too.<p>What was the cost?
DanCarvajalalmost 5 years ago
We just bought out first house, it&#x27;s a super basic 1930s &quot;Traditional Minimal&quot;. Funny enough this home is actually the youngest of the twenty or so homes we looked at. We only passed on some 1880s homes because of location issues.
867-5309almost 5 years ago
you should add &quot;in America&quot; to the title
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StillBoredalmost 5 years ago
I agree with much of the general take of this article, but having remodeled, or helped remodel houses, or just plain lived in&#x2F;repaired over the past couple decades I&#x27;ve got my own set of opinions about this.<p>Starting with, never mistake style for long lasting quality. For example, wood floors are very poor flooring material unless you don&#x27;t mind living in a house where the floors look like a barn after a decade or two. Tile, concrete, will unless abused, out last just about every other flooring choice while generally remaining quite nice if installed well. There is a reason the mosaics in high end roman houses are still in place two thousand years after they were built.<p>Also, to add to the general take of the article. Nothing you buy from the big box home improvement stores will last more than 10 years. I would qualify this with their lumber&#x2F;etc is fine, but I&#x27;ve seen cases where the lumber was incorrectly pressure treated(!) and they replaced it after it rotted in 5 years. Which is great, except for the fact that the lumber was like 1&#x2F;100th of the job cost. Frankly, its not even the big box suppliers, its just about everything they sell seems to have declined in quality. Until a couple years ago, I had never seen a light switch fail, my current house (built in the early 2000&#x27;s) has had about 1&#x2F;2 of the light switches literally fall apart in the walls.<p>So, while somethings are probably acceptable quality (indoor door handles&#x2F;locks) for the most part, the exterior ones with their faux aged finishes and the like will despite their 30 year guarantees break, or the finishes will crack in the sun, or rust. And on and on...<p>My general take is some of it might be ok, but keep the receipt for that $300 facet somewhere you will be able to find it in 8 years, because its quite likely something will go wrong. Pay the extra for the one from the plumbing&#x2F;etc supply house, because the worthwhile plumbers&#x2F;etc will offer matching labor guarantees and they don&#x27;t like coming back to fix something under warantee.<p>I could write a book about this... but one last thing. Ive spoken to a lot of people in the know, and the general take on appliances is that a good high end one from the mid 1990&#x27;s will likely outlast anything built in the last 20 years. If you have an old fridge&#x2F;dishwasher&#x2F;etc take care of it, polish it up, treasure it. Most importantly, buy a part off ebay when it fails and fix it. Enjoy it for what it is, a quality piece of machinery that probably uses a bit more electricity, or water, but actually cleans your cloths&#x2F;dishes&#x2F;etc or the ice maker doesn&#x27;t jam or clog, or need DRM&#x27;ed water filters. And if you really want filtered Ice buy a inline water filter and plug it into the ice line and enjoy the $5 filters and think about the fact that your saving $30+ dollars each time you change it.
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justicezyxalmost 5 years ago
That door knob is well crafted. A modern production with similar quality probably will take upwards to $400 based on my recent research on front door locks...
cactus2093almost 5 years ago
This is wild to me, I can&#x27;t follow the author&#x27;s logic here really at all. It reads like a borderline-satirical example of nostalgia for nostalgia&#x27;s sake. They make such obnoxious claims like &quot;I think most people have an intuitive sense that older homes are often special, and newer ones are often not&quot;.<p>Then they go on to list things that I associate much more with modern homes - not wasting floor space, and paying attention to the elements and light. A modern, open-concept design is optimizing much better for this than an old farmhouse where, for instance, the kitchen and formal dining room and living room are all closed off from each other. Modern homes often have floor to ceiling windows and sliding glass doors, old homes have tiny closed off windows. And old homes like the author uses as an example here are often just simple rectangles, so all the design decisions are constrained to be small square rooms. At least the &quot;mcmansion&quot; example in this post of a terrible new home has more interesting, non-perpendicular details and layout.<p>Maybe I just have an anti-nostalgia for this type of home, and maybe that makes me just as biased as the author in the opposite direction. I&#x27;ve never lived in a home like this but have been inside of a few of them, and they&#x27;re often dark and closed in and kind of creepy. But I don&#x27;t think I&#x27;m completely alone in feeling this way, there must be a reason so many horror movies are set in old farmhouses. To each their own, I guess.<p>(And on top of all this, I would argue that this kind of permeating attitude about new homes just not being special like old homes are plays a huge part in the current housing shortage crisis that much of the US faces, but I won&#x27;t even go into that).
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