I'm surprised Jon Callas hadn't realized Dropbox is able to decrypt your files. It always seemed obvious to me given several of Dropbox's advertised features necessitate it (in particular accessing your files over the web interface, and probably their sharing features). Most users wouldn't understand this, but the <i>founder and CTO of PGP Corp</i> should.<p>That said, this article is incorrect on at least one point: de-duplication does <i>not</i> require Dropbox be able to decrypt your files. tzs came up with this clever scheme in a previous comment: <a href="http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2461713" rel="nofollow">http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2461713</a><p>Of course even if Dropbox didn't have the keys to decrypt your files you're still trusting them (or SpiderOak or Wuala or most of Dropbox's competitors) by running their proprietary software. But I suppose people are more concerned about subpoenas and compromised servers than malicious actions by Dropbox themselves.
I feel like I should point out that this article isn't about the FTC doing something, but about a private individual filing a complaint with the FTC, which anyone can do.<p>I like Ryan Singel. He was the first reporter to write about YC. So I can't really begrudge him the pageviews he knew he'd get from HN over this. But 'taint really news.
<i>Callas tweeted on April 19: “I deleted my Dropbox account. It turns out that they lied and don’t actually encrypt your files and will hand them over to anyone who asks.”</i><p>That's actually a lie too. Dropbox does encrypt your files, it's just that, naturally, they hold the key. If I ask Dropbox for another users files, guess what? They don't hand them over.<p>If your info is really that sensitive then for heavens sake don't outsource encryption and key management to a third party you have no supervision over. Encrypt your super sensitive files with Truecrypt and then share/sync them with Dropbox.
just so everyone knows, this complaint raises old issues that we addressed in our public blog post a few weeks ago: <a href="http://blog.dropbox.com/?p=735" rel="nofollow">http://blog.dropbox.com/?p=735</a>
"President Obama Personally Executed Bin Laden, HN Comment to CIA Alleges."<p>Seriously, who cares where the "complaint" was sent? Either it's a valid argument or it's not. Where it was sent should have no bearing.<p>The argument that Dropbox did this to save money is transparently bogus too. That's in there to make it seem like the FTC has grounds for getting involved.
Dropbox clearly chose to store keys themselves so they could offer core features like web/pubic sharing.
A lot of this does not make sense to me. Dropbox allows you to view your files via a web browser interface. Obviously that means they can access the unencrypted files. Perhaps people would prefer not to have the web access features.<p>But even then, if Dropbox never stored the decryption keys on their servers anywhere, and the decryption key was stored only on a client PC, and I lost my computer, I would not be able to access the backed-up data from Dropbox on a new computer. That would kind of defeat the purpose of Dropbox for me. As many others have pointed out (including Lifehacker) you can always use Truecrypt to put some stuff in your Dropbox that no one but you can decrypt.<p>As far as the "feds" getting my data, if they are after me, they can get a search warrant from a judge and come into my house and confiscate all of my computers, which would allow them to access any data on my harddrives not encrypted with Truecrypt...
The guy who filed this complaint is quite the troublemaker:<p><a href="http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2010/1206/technology-chris-soghoian-federal-trade-commission-agent-provocateur.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2010/1206/technology-chris-sogh...</a>
Gah. I just told our corporate counsel that it was ok to use Dropbox because everything was secured "even the app" and all the files were encrypted on Dropbox's site.
What really worries me about de-duping is what if it fucks up your files. What if one file just happens to have the same hash as another completely different file uploaded by a different person? Then all of a sudden, this really important contract that you think you have stored online and in the dropbox folders of your four different computers gets automatically deleted and replaced with a completely different file everywhere. And if you have set up automatic backups like a good boy, it may even be automatically replaced in all your backups before you figure out the problem.<p>I know you will say that the hashes are long enough so this should not happen until dropbox has trillions of files, etc. But those calculations are all based on assumption of random data in the files. We all know that various computer files may have structured and patterned data. It is possible for the data in certain types of files to be structured in such a way as to produce a much narrower range of possible hashes than generally assumed.<p>And with 25 million users and hundreds of millions of files, God knows what may happen.
I've never been a Dropbox user, and this sort of behavior doesn't surprise me. It puzzles me why folks are prepared to spend substantial amounts of money renting tiny amounts of insecure web storage when they could spend a modest amount on a plug computer and have a large amount of fairly secure storage, and without the indefinite rental fees.
Dropbox must have actual figures on how much storage space they save by having de-duplication. Would be nice if they published them.<p>Personally, every file in my Dropbox is unique... I wonder how many people use it for storing deduplicatable content like mp3s and videos etc.
OK, so I am a fan of dropbox and I use it across many machines, (better than those on Richess) -- and, as I understand the overall issue to be, the concern is that DropBox may at some point "hand over your files" to (I assume) The Feds -- should they come knocking?<p>Now, I expect that for all intents and purposes the encryption/security employed by Dropbox is 'good-enough' that I dont have to worry about random-internet-user gaining access to my docs, yet I have absolutely <i></i><i>NO</i><i></i> illusions that ANY company will refuse to hand over my data to the feds should the feds be seeking it.<p>Further, I would suggest that anyone with anything they dont want the feds to know about/get their mitts on not be stupid enough to store said sensitive secrets IN THE FUCKING CLOUD<p>Additionally, I can understand that Drew may not be the most savvy in navigating such issues given him being a young CEO and all - and I can understand that he would want all the DropBoxians to feel comfortable with the safety and security of their data in his hands - but I would like to see a frank, real-world answer to any security claims which delineate in no-uncertain-terms exactly what level of data safety, security and encryption one may expect.<p>Drew may even do well as to explicitly say "We shall not refuse to hand over any of your data (and its revision history) to the Feds should they come seeking it with legal merit."<p>If, after such a statement people are concerned about their data going anywhere -- they should get off dropbox / implement truecrypt as stated.<p>Finally, a question for Drew: given this craptastic event; would Drop Box be open to much more robust file encryption tools being developed as an addon to DropBox; e.g. a third party wrapper application that allows end-to-end encryption while still allowing the web UI etc to work?<p>(If I misread the circumstances of the whole issue - forgive my little rant)