There are ways that people talk about gentrification that always makes me slightly uncomfortable. As a non-white person, something always feels like gentrification is something that “good” white people like to blame “bad” white people for doing, when the real problem tends to be wider and more systemic.<p>In this particular instance I find myself asking why it matters that the Weaver residents were originally not from Austin. If you’re born in Chicago, shouldn’t you still have the same rights as someone who was born in Austin? That includes the right to complain. However it doesn’t mean anyone has to listen to you. As other users have pointed out, it’s not exactly a new situation for people to move to a neighborhood and immediately try and kick their neighbours out. It’s just that most of the time they’re told to kick rocks.<p>It seems to me the real crux of this issue is that rich white people are so much more prioritized by the law that a couple of irate Karens can overrule an entire neighbourhoods opinion. It has nothing to do with where they’re from or gentrification.<p>Not that gentrification doesn’t cause it’s own problems. But the way some people talk about it, as though existing residents are entitled to a higher set of rights, leads down some pretty dark paths, especially when newcomers are of a different nationality, or race than current residents. It reminds me of something that used to be said a lot in jest when I was younger in the 90’s and 00’s and working in fast food. Whenever people gave me extra work to do, they justified it by saying something like, “well, he should just be grateful he isn’t working in a rice paddy” (I’m from Singapore originally, but ok). There seemed to be this view that because my parents chose to move to Canada when I was young, I was somehow entitled to fewer rights, even as a citizen.
I live in this neighborhood, about three blocks north of where the car club meets. I’m white. I’m a homeowner. You get the picture.<p>Honestly, these people complaining in Weaver sound insane. They moved into a community and it’s their job to integrate with the community. We have a Brit who lives on my street that does community organizing and he’s been wonderful about building a sense of community that integrates the old and new residents. They should really be talking to him or Pio, mentioned in the article, instead of calling the police and accusing the car club of dealing drugs. Yeesh.<p>With that said, I think there are legitimate criticisms about the car club. For one, they absolutely trash the place every Sunday. When I walk down to the lake on Monday, there’s just tons of trash on the ground. I don’t know who picks it up but it’s certainly not the car club.<p>Also, doing burnouts and donuts on public streets sounds fun but it leaves the road covered in tire rubber and I imagine it smells awful while they’re doing it.<p>Those are basically the two things I’d like to see change, and in my humble, gentrifier opinion, they seem like reasonable issues to talk about with the community. Instead of having those conversations, we get white people leveraging their white privilege in the worst ways and anarchist groups like “Defend Our Hoodz” intimidating new businesses that open up. Fun times in my little corner of the world.
"The new arrivals have forced many Black residents to move out of the city: In 2000, about 10 percent of the Austin’s 656,000 residents were Black. By 2017, that percentage had dropped to around 7.5"<p>Well, article definitely commits a statistical fallacy there. Austin is one of the fastest growing cities, especially from 2000-2017 period. The fact that the percentage went down (from 9.5 to 7.5), while the city's population nearly tripled does not mean people were 'forced to move out'. In fact, it means that the black population nearly tripled while other races moved to the area in even greater numbers.
Real estate law has this concept of “Coming to the nuisance” where if you know that there is some kind of “nuisance” nearby and you move next to it anyway, you can’t complain about it later. I’m not a lawyer so I’m probably pedantically wrong about it in some way but that’s my understanding of it. People do this with small local airports all the time. They move in, knowing full well (or should know full well) that there is an airport there, then a year later they bitch and moan about the noise and try to shut it down.
At the general level, I doubt anyone is surprised to see this story, and there will likely be more to come as tech flocks to Austin (though it was already a notable tech hub with some of these pressures already before the billionaires decided to give it the seal of approval).<p>To me, the more interesting question here is how does Austin avoid what happened to SF, where tech hollowed out nearly all of its existing culture and then tech workers began to complain it was bland.<p>Real estate and zoning policy is going to be key here. I've seen a decent deal of discussion about "Yuppie Fishtanks" [0] recently and generally it seems to be supported that massively increasing the housing supply is one of the best ways to keep rents intact and avoid hollowing gentrification. For the existing Austin residents here, how is the city approaching it thusfar? Do people think this is another SF gentrification story in the making, or is something different?<p>[0] <a href="http://noahpinionblog.blogspot.com/2018/07/yimbyism-explained-without-supply-and.html" rel="nofollow">http://noahpinionblog.blogspot.com/2018/07/yimbyism-explaine...</a>
A variation of this rinsing out of any local culture is going on in Sacramento County California, where arguably gentrification has resulted in a 2019 autocratic edict that residents are not allowed to work on cars in their homes except fluid changes, with fines if you are found to have professional tools on the premises.<p><a href="https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/grm/it-is-illegal-to-work-on-your-car-in-your-garage-i/155378/page1/" rel="nofollow">https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/grm/it-is-illegal-to...</a><p>Since Sacramento County is approx 50% white, 50% hispanic/black, a case can be made this is a racist law given the relatively high number of hispanics and black who work on their cars, including car clubs such as the Austin tradition.<p>This is culturally very unhealthy given how fundamental freedom of movement is to the US zeitgeist, and how important car culture is as the core of US life.
I’m familiar with the gathering they are writing about. It’s really not a disturbance whatsoever anymore. It’s a shame there are people being so up tight about it. In years past it definitely got out of control sometimes and the bass was so loud it would rattle houses a quarter mile away. I definitely wouldn’t have felt comfortable having an infant exposed to that noise level during those times. But it’s been fine for at least a couple years and it doesn’t go too late.
According to the article, this event has been happening almost weekly for years<p>1) Does this mean the developers did not take this into consideration and have a plan on how to deal with this or handle it?<p>2) Does it mean the folks buying the apartments (or renting) did not do their due diligence and find out this is a weekly event?<p>Takeaways here (for all of us reading this story) - do you research before you move to a place (rent or buy). Go there on a weekday and a weekend. Ask current residents about the place or other folks who live nearby about the place. It will save you a ton of hassle later on.
This isn't the first time that newcomers have complained about Austin traditions. First there were the people who admitted they moved to the downtown for the vibe. But then complained about the loud music from the bars along Rainey Street. So.. you moved to the Live Music Capital of the World, only to complain about the live music?<p>The city adopted a noise ordnance that kicks in at 10pm, and enforces it with SPL meters.<p>Later, they started complaining about the smoke from the BBQ restaurants. Daily batches of BBQ get started around 3am, and to be good BBQ, are made from beef brisket smoked over a wood fire (not gas, not electric, and certainly not with "liquid smoke"). So .. you moved to a state where brisket BBQ is a second religion for people, only to complain about the smell.<p>I believe the city figured out there was no pleasing these people, and told them to keep their windows closed if they didn't like it.
When places are full of white people, minorities are brought in in the name of diversity and it's to be celebrated. When places are full of minorities and whites move in, it's gentrification and we need to write articles lamenting it.<p>Cultural mixing happens both ways. Sometimes inclusion means changing long standing traditions.
I moved to Austin 20 years ago from Palo Alto. Fiesta Gardens isn’t all churros and mariachis. The car meet ups can legit be a bit rough. <a href="https://www.reddit.com/r/Austin/comments/6pocmw/brawls_at_fiesta_gardens_not_unheard_of_witnesses/" rel="nofollow">https://www.reddit.com/r/Austin/comments/6pocmw/brawls_at_fi...</a><p>So I understand where the gentrifying scum are coming from. But jeez, do they not know how to search Reddit?? Everyone knows about Fiesta Gardens and its craziness. I’m sorry they failed to do their due diligence. Now perhaps they’ll understand why it’s cheaper than Tarrytown.
This article paints a very clear picture of who is making the complaints without specifically saying it.<p>[quote]
'One particularly vocal tenant, a non-Hispanic white woman with short blond hair who appeared to be in her fifties, claimed that smoke from the tires was killing nearby trees and that traffic from the gathering would make it impossible for an ambulance to reach her in the event of a medical emergency (though two other roads to the apartment building remain accessible at all times). Another Weaver resident voiced more generalized criticism, calling the event a “display of toxic masculinity.”'<p>[/quote]<p>I think they only stopped short of saying her name starts with a K and rhymes with "Aaron". My knee jerk reaction is why do people move somewhere and immediately try to change a place to their set of values? Are they just fundamentally unhappy people?<p>Despite what seems like an over-reaction from this person this sort of struggle with cars is nothing new especially in Texas. The Cars And Coffee thing is pretty big down here, and while I do love cars I have mixed feelings about C&C for a few reasons. Typically you have a subset of the group that does engage in very dangerous maneuvers on public roads. There are enough youtube videos of people doing dumb things in cars going badly that Im sure most of you are aware of it. Typically its more of an age related than race related problem as young kids and cars with 3-800 horsepower are a recipe for trouble. I dont really go to C&C events for this reason.
EDIT TO MAKE MORE CLEAR-
This seems to be aimed more at the the people complaining about slab/lowrider/people of color car culture. Those folks should be called out (the Karens for the sake of bevity). That should not be conflated, however, with people doing burnouts and other dumb things with cars. This is anti social behavior and should be policed if it is out of control. Of course the archetype that is discussed in this article is known for blowing things out of proportion, so without actually having been there who knows. I personally love how Texas can be such a melting pot with rich culture from all walks of life and there is very real concern about how the great migration from California will pan out.
> One particularly vocal tenant, a non-Hispanic white woman with short blond hair who appeared to be in her fifties, claimed that smoke from the tires was killing nearby trees and that traffic from the gathering would make it impossible for an ambulance to reach her in the event of a medical emergency<p>Why is this woman so uniquely and thickly qualified<p>“A non-white black man with a thick black curly hair who appeared to be in his early 20s claimed he didn’t like the non-hispanic white woman with short blonde hair who appeared in her early 50s who claimed the smoke killed trees “
Damn near everybody who thought about the way things were going foretold this kind of thing.<p>First the California (or NYC, or DC, or Boston) money shows up kicking out most of the people who aren't at least a white collar level of moneyed.<p>Then with nobody to stand in their way they Karens and Kevins (not necessarily from CA, just rich enough to still stick around after the CA money jacks everything up) swing their political weight around doing their best to turn the place into a sterile and conformist hellscape.<p>We've seen this pattern in cities and suburbs across the county.
A lot of the Austinites like to say "Welcome to Austin, don't move here" or some such silliness. The "funny" thing is the ones that say this the most are the ones not originally from Austin but feel they have been there "long" enough to call it home.
It is not bad to move from one city to another. And every citizen have such basic right. Traditions are also not something good by itself. The title tries to incite a negative emotional response, but if you think about it, there is nothing wrong per se with moving from one city to another and wanting to end a certain practice you don’t like. Of course it may or may not be reasonable, but the title presents as if this information is enough to blame someone.
The article makes the residents appear petty and ridiculous, but to be fair these gatherings really are obnoxiously noisy and extremely annoying. I'd be surprised if many non-transplants didn't find them tiresome as well.
No class of argument is more malleable than who was there “first”. Sometimes it means you’re right and you’re entitled. Sometimes it means you’re wrong and you’re exclusionary. All depending on the perspective of the person using it for leverage.<p>Compare this article with any article about the need for denser housing in California, which is often opposed by the people who were there first.
Ask any farmer when folks move into the area expecting some Disney version of farm country and get the reality of it. Its amazing how many complaints can be generated.
Yeah, the burning tire smell from cars doing donuts is very unpleasant. They can do this in the middle of nowhere if they want (easy enough to get there with a car).
Just like the people that move in next to even famous auto racing circuits, and then complain about the noise -- it's your job to check out the situation before moving in.<p>The best proper adaptation that I've seen was reading about a developer that took some deteriorating apartments under an airport runway and refurbished them specifically for the deaf community (doorbells that flash instead of ring, etc.). It was apparently a big success.<p>I'd consider that car meet regularly held nextdoor to be a wonderful benefit.
What's the issue with gentrification?<p>We are living in a fast paced world so one needs to adapt to the changes. It could be my neighbor, skill sets, policies, etc.
> <i>One particularly vocal tenant, a non-Hispanic white woman with short blond hair who appeared to be in her fifties, claimed that smoke from the tires was killing nearby trees and that traffic from the gathering would make it impossible for an ambulance to reach her in the event of a medical emergency (though two other roads to the apartment building remain accessible at all times). </i><p>Karen? Is that you??
alas, these Austin locals did not learn the SF lesson, real estate lesson 101<p>As soon as foreigners invade your shores (er, real estate spaces) move to grandfather a cap property tax that is particularly beneficial for long time real property owners.<p>I understand that at first, this would do nothing to alleviate the attack on the local culture. The same foreigners would still call the cops.<p>Yet, with enough time, the latino locals would have been rich latino locals, from simply holding onto property, and renting it out to new arrival..s making a killing.<p>Then those rich latinos would have had some dollars to contribute to local pols. That could be a group happy to push on repeals of noise or public assembly ordinances.<p>Rinse,repeat.<p>You would have a full-fiesta by now. There goes the neighborhood!<p>Opportunity lost.
There are three car tracks in the Austin area - surely they can come to an agreement with one of them to have their burnouts , barbecue's and social gatherings there ???.<p>Public parks are not the place for this , nothing to do with culture.
Note that ownership is supplanted by rentership.<p>I like urban density, but renting is extraction of wealth rather than a one-time transfer. I wish more of these developments were condos/ownership/co-op/what have you.
I grew up in Austin and had to move due to some family obligations. Every time I get back, I recognize less and less of my city and its culture. I used to want to move back, but now I'm not sure what I'd be returning to.<p>Oh, and for the unnamed woman worried about drug distribution, it's not local Black or Latino gangs that run drug distribution in Austin.
There seems to be a contradiction in this article - they’re complaining about the property values staying low for a long time and are simultaneously complaining about property values increasing in recent times. Also, the article criticises the creation of multi storey homes, but isn’t high density housing better compared to single home lots?
Some bad habits deserve to die but anyone wanting to snuff this is bonkers - this is legit, creative, authentic culture. It's the most rare and valuable thing. They should be encouraging it.
We have weaponized identity politics to get what we want: toxic masculinity vs white supremacist thinking. The clear trend in this arms race is to tick off more and more boxes.
Doesn’t matter who came first, you can’t generate a bunch of smoke and noise. I’m sure Austin has a noise ordinance. Easy solution is to move the event to a better location.
Well, if you are at home putting a baby to sleep and suddenly some guy blasts some music from their car and wakes up your baby, what would you do? it's not a hard decision.<p>There's a hierarchy of needs. Being able to be at peace in your own property ranks higher than someone else's need to blast music from their car.<p>I do not have anything against the guy or his music, there are just some things that are more important than others.
"a non-Hispanic white woman with short blond hair who appeared to be in her fifties, claimed that smoke from the tires was killing nearby trees and that traffic from the gathering would make it impossible for an ambulance to reach her in the event of a medical emergency".<p>Did she demand to speak to the manager?
> A car club member spins his back tires—a practice known as a “burnout”—at a car club meet-up on Sunday, unleashing a cloud of white smoke<p>Is that really something worth calling a tradition?
If it were to happen where I live, I would definitely call the police.
This is a really abnormal article to see on hackernews. I generally don't expect to see the politics of a random city in the U.S. here. Maybe because Austin is becoming more of a tech hub? So now the politics of the city seem more relevant to the tech community?
To be fair, I'm a middle-aged white engineer raised in San Jose, CA relocated to ATX in Dec 2020.<p>I live at the corner of I-35 east-side frontage and 5th in a mega apartment complex. I've tried meeting many of my neighbors and most are asocial/antisocial. There are 2 women roommates and an African-American kid who are legit cool that I've met so far. Also, I don't even know the people across the hall. My conclusion from many interactions is my neighbors are mostly phony, little life experience, selfish, corporate clones who steal shopping carts and leave them blocking the hallways, let their dogs pee everywhere in the hallways and don't clean it up, throw garbage on the floor, don't wear masks, don't talk to one another, sit by the pool on their phones, and act phony cool like they're still in high-school. Heck, my upstairs neighbor complained about my music on the weekend during the day without introducing themselves and not diplomatically. Point being: gentrifiers tend to be mostly uncool and don't care about anything other than forcing their own bubbles on everyone else.<p>More power to Austin car clubs. Let the gentrifiers pound salt.<p>Edit: I would like to move somewhere near cooler people, but I'm probably going to have to grow a social circle to find that. Also, I wonder if more upscale or cheaper housing tends to attract or repel cool peeps.
What a hot garbage. What does race of people have to do with every point? Just because "most of them are hispanic and black" it suddenly invalidates "white non-hispanic" woman's point?
Oh yeah. Big tough gangsters. Got shut down by the neighbors and realtors and now cry to the press. Boo hoo hoo. Bother me and I'll spike your lemon juice with elephant tranquilizer.<p>Look everyone. Look how these tough guys cry when they wet their diapers. These wannabes are nothing. Drive them out. Drive them to the gutter, to the wild, to the sea. Just drive them out.<p>Why didn't the car show buy up the real estate? They had the same opportunity as their neighbors? Oh yeah. They're illiterate junkie diseased bums. F** 'em.
So basically Austin is experiencing today what we San Franciscans have been suffering through since the web 2.0 boom began in 2008. I remember when they built yuppy condos next to the DNA lounge and the new tenants immediately joined the “War on Fun” and began trying to get the DNA shut down.<p>Before you know it, everyone here on HN will be labeling austinites as “greedy nimby’s”, complaining about being made to feel uncomfortable by acknowledging the homeless problem, and complaining that Austin isn’t exactly like whatever place it is they moved away from to go to Austin while seeking their startup millions.
Californians fleeing the the things they voted for, then voting for the very same things again. Is there a legal way Texas residents can block them coming?
What’s annoying is that instead of switching to whataburger, their bringing the in’n’outs. The transplants are failing to assimilate here and it really shows.<p>If I land a remote job I’m selling my place and moving to San Antonio.
Good. If one of these mechanophiliacs moved next-door to you, you'd better believe that they would start working on cars and complain loudly if you tried to stop them. In other words, they would move into a peaceful and quiet neighborhood and change things for themselves too. I have lived through this, it's not pleasant and I'm the one who eventually had to move out of my own neighborhood.