TE
TechEcho
Home24h TopNewestBestAskShowJobs
GitHubTwitter
Home

TechEcho

A tech news platform built with Next.js, providing global tech news and discussions.

GitHubTwitter

Home

HomeNewestBestAskShowJobs

Resources

HackerNews APIOriginal HackerNewsNext.js

© 2025 TechEcho. All rights reserved.

E-Prime – English without the verb “to be”

108 pointsby isomorphalmost 4 years ago

18 comments

ravila4almost 4 years ago
In Spanish, we have two different versions of "to be": 'ser' is for defining what something is (I am a human), and 'estar' is for temporary states of being (I am sad). I do find it strange that English assigns the two meanings to one word.
评论 #27292121 未加载
评论 #27292010 未加载
评论 #27292002 未加载
评论 #27295035 未加载
评论 #27293850 未加载
评论 #27294831 未加载
评论 #27291948 未加载
no-dr-onboardalmost 4 years ago
From the Wikipedia article:<p>&quot;These authors observed that a communication under the copula ban can remain extremely unclear and imply prejudice, while losing important speech patterns, such as identities and identification . . .Bourland sees specifically the &quot;identity&quot; and &quot;predication&quot; functions as pernicious, but advocates eliminating all forms for the sake of simplicity. In the case of the &quot;existence&quot; form (and less idiomatically, the &quot;location&quot; form), one might (for example) simply substitute the verb &#x27;exists&#x27; &quot;<p>From the Appendix of 1984:<p>&quot;So did the fact of having very few words to choose from. Relative to our own, the Newspeak vocabulary was tiny, and new ways of reducing it were constantly being devised. Newspeak, indeed, differed from most all other languages in that its vocabulary grew smaller instead of larger every year. Each reduction was a gain, since the smaller the area of choice, the smaller the temptation to take thought. . . Like various other words in the B vocabulary, duckspeak was ambivalent in meaning. Provided that the opinions which were quacked out were orthodox ones, it implied nothing but praise, and when The Times referred to one of the orators of the Party as a doubleplusgood duckspeaker it was paying a warm and valued compliment.&quot;
评论 #27292238 未加载
评论 #27304971 未加载
_kst_almost 4 years ago
I&#x27;ve heard that when Marc Okrand invented the Klingon language, he deliberately omitted the verb &quot;to be&quot;.<p>So of course for Star Trek VI, they asked him to translate &quot;To be or not to be&quot;.<p>Chancellor Gorkon: You have not experienced Shakespeare until you have read him in the original Klingon.<p>General Chang: &quot;taH pagh, taH be?&quot;<p>Reference: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.imdb.com&#x2F;title&#x2F;tt0102975&#x2F;trivia?item=tr1350638" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.imdb.com&#x2F;title&#x2F;tt0102975&#x2F;trivia?item=tr1350638</a>
评论 #27295112 未加载
goodellsalmost 4 years ago
I like how the Wikipedia article about English Prime also _uses_ English Prime for the most part in its prose - not sure if the contributors or editors did that intentionally.
pontifieralmost 4 years ago
I have just realized the magnitude of my dependence on the copula.<p>I seem to think using links of equivalence between ideas, yet often these links contain unvoiced and thus hidden ambiguity.
评论 #27293689 未加载
sfblahalmost 4 years ago
I thought it was going to be like Russian, where the &quot;to be&quot; verb is almost always just omitted. That would probably work in English as well, though in Russian, they also use noun cases to help with making the sentences meaningful.
评论 #27292590 未加载
jonnycomputeralmost 4 years ago
As a reader of undergraduate papers, I&#x27;m all for exercises like this, if only to push them to try harder, and unmuddy their thinking. But as some kind of political consciousness programme? lol. no.
评论 #27294636 未加载
bigbillheckalmost 4 years ago
My 9th grade English teacher required all work to be done in this style. I can&#x27;t say that I enjoyed it but in retrospect I probably benefitted from the experience.
marcus_holmesalmost 4 years ago
First time that I&#x27;ve heard of this. I love this kind of writing hack - I used the Hemingway app for years when writing an opinion column to keep my sentences short, and my readers seemed to appreciate it.<p>Of course, the art lies in knowing when to break the rules for maximum effect. That&#x27;s always fun :)
sedekialmost 4 years ago
The Russian language does not have the present tense of &quot;to be&quot;, i.e. &quot;is&quot;, &quot;am&quot;, or &quot;are&quot;. It is simply omitted, which can be confusing at first for some learners (like myself). The infinitive &quot;to be&quot; exists though.
Tade0almost 4 years ago
I have an infant child and I&#x27;ve discovered that I developed a, for lack of a better word, verbal tick when referring to her:<p>It doesn&#x27;t translate to English well, but instead of asking e.g. &quot;are you eating?&quot; or &quot;is she eating&quot; I say &quot;is it eaten?&quot;(note the lack of the word &quot;being&quot; - I&#x27;m not asking here if she is currently being devoured).<p>It&#x27;s a lot like &quot;it is known&quot; in Game of Thrones.<p>I wonder if the origins of E-Prime were in any way similar.
runawaybottlealmost 4 years ago
This seems like a good psychological strategy to rehabilitate self centered people.
motohagiographyalmost 4 years ago
If one&#x27;s objective were to unmoor the perspective of the speaker from shared truth and their sense of identity, this seems like the tool. I think they used to call it &quot;brainwashing.&quot; I&#x27;m still trying to source it, but I remember knowing some people who went on these language trips that were very political and there was a trend in leaning Spanish that was a vehicle for social justice groups. They were all a bit wooly.<p>It seemed to be an example of something like this: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Social_constructionism" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Social_constructionism</a>
评论 #27292036 未加载
评论 #27295539 未加载
baybal2almost 4 years ago
To be, or not to be?
评论 #27291726 未加载
评论 #27291522 未加载
ineptechalmost 4 years ago
I read about E-prime in my late teens, and while I don&#x27;t actually use it in everyday language, thinking about the implications has deeply changed the way I think about things.<p>The basic idea for me is that all instances of &#x27;is&#x27; are technically false statements[0]. &quot;That chair is red&quot; is false, not just in the boring sense that the chair probably has some non-red bits, but more fundamentally in the sense that redness is a result of you looking at it, not an intrinsic quality of the chair.<p>The E-prime version of that would be, &quot;That chair looks red to me.&quot; A pedantic and unimportant difference in that example, but consider the difference between &#x27;Bob is dishonest&#x27; and &#x27;Bob lied to me.&#x27; The latter may or may not be true, but it is clearly a subjective observation and can be argued with on those terms. The former phrasing, taken literally, implies the existence of a hypothetical quality called &#x27;honesty&#x27; and asserts that Bob doesn&#x27;t have it, which is both literally false (because there is no such quality, at least not that we can measure) and less useful (because we assume the speaker has some reason to think Bob is dishonest, but don&#x27;t know what it is).<p>The point is that it&#x27;s a bug of our language (inherited from Aristotle, according to Korzybski) that we commonly phrase opinions as if they were facts, and that we describe things by assigning them imaginary intrinsic qualities and then talking about them as if they were observable. Once this meme infects you, you see it everywhere. The chair &#x27;is&#x27; red, Bob &#x27;is&#x27; dishonest, [politician] &#x27;is&#x27; crazy, a photon &#x27;is&#x27; a wave. In every case, rephrasing those in e-prime would be clearer and more accurate.<p>Some might still say this is just semantic nitpicking. In some contexts, sure. But I&#x27;ve found it to be very helpful, mostly in sciences but also in philosophy, art, and life generally. And it is particularly relevant to internet arguing. Not in the sense that you get to say, &quot;Hah, you used &#x27;is&#x27; so you&#x27;re wrong!&quot; but in the sense that you can more easily see when someone has said something you disagree with, but can&#x27;t argue against because it is not arguable. Consider e.g. &quot;vim is better than emacs&quot;. There&#x27;s no point in debating that until you find out why they think that. That may seem obvious in the abstract, but in practice I find that most people would rather just guess, as in &quot;I&#x27;ll bet he means X, so I will now write 8 paragraphs angrily explaining why that&#x27;s not true...&quot; than ask.<p>0: &quot;You just said is!&quot; I hear you cry. Okay you got me. More precisely, it&#x27;s all instances of the &#x27;is of identity&#x27;, as distinct from uses like &quot;That <i>is</i> what I said&quot; or &quot;What <i>is</i> your drink preference.&quot; What E-prime tries to avoid is not specific words, it&#x27;s phrasing a subjective statement about an observation in the form of an objective statement about an intrinsic quality of a thing.
jccalhounalmost 4 years ago
I remember seeing ads for this in Popular Science or something when I was a kid. I thought it would be fun to try.
rezmasonalmost 4 years ago
Is it a coincidence that the lyrics to Beck&#x27;s song &quot;E-Pro&quot; are in E-Prime, except for the bridge?
Random_BSD_Geekalmost 4 years ago
&quot;Or not.&quot; --Hamlet