Why engage in a back-and-forth with these people? Configure the car you want on the manufacturer website, note the list price, then send the configuration you want to a few dealers in your area and ask them to quote for delivering you that car. Accept the best quote. If they want to debate you about it, ask them to either quote you or forget it. There are even apps which enforce this - they get to quote you but can't communicate otherwise.
I've been buying cars second-hand from private parties for my last three cars. It's been a great experience. Everyone's been honest so far, and I've never had unreasonable problems with any of the cars.<p>I'm not sure I'd ever go to a dealership again. They make things so painful, and wring as much money and stress out of you as possible. There seems to be zero benefit for the consumer.
Dealing with a dealership is all about psychology. They are playing a psychological mind game with you when they make you wait for so long while they're in the back doing "paperwork". They want you to get antsy so you make bad decisions.<p>The trick to making this interaction go your way is to not play their game. If they seat you at a table and make you wait, just get up and walk away. Go start looking at another car. This will freak them the F out. My last interaction with a car dealer was hilarious. When I started playing mind games with them (walking away while they made me wait, fake-scrolling through ads on my phone, wondering out loud about the dealer across the street) they literally bent over backwards. They lowered the price on the car I wanted significantly. They offered me more than KBB trade-in value for my old car. They even offered to buy my wife and I lunch because we acted like we were going to go think it over while we ate.<p>It's all mind games. Don't play theirs. The dealerships tactics are not very effective if you take control. They just get a lot of practice and they know that new-car-smell is addictive.
> To be fair to dealerships, they do provide important services. They offer a distribution and service network, which is vital to both manufacturers and car buyers.<p>Until they don't. Throwback to that time "the world's largest Chevrolet dealer"[0] went under like Jacques Cousteau[1].<p>[0] <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20070202025849/http://www.billheard.com/" rel="nofollow">https://web.archive.org/web/20070202025849/http://www.billhe...</a><p>[1] <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20170901203212/http://www.tbo.com/business/business/2008/sep/25/bill-heard-chevrolet-customers-freaking-out-ar-119159/" rel="nofollow">https://web.archive.org/web/20170901203212/http://www.tbo.co...</a>
Disclaimer; I run a popular youtube channel educating consumers on car buying.<p>Greg did a good job documenting the challenges of buying a car in today's market. Fortunately, we are starting to see a softening in consumer demand which has led to used car prices to begin to drop in some areas and for certain types of vehicles.<p>We expect that as automakers increase production we'll go away from markups. The timeline for that is tricky since Asian brands (Toyota and Honda especially) are struggling MUCH more than American automakers. MSRPs are rising fast too, so while dealer markups may disappear as demand weakens and supply increases, don't be surprised if you see MSRPs that are 5-10% higher year over year.<p>Wait times right now for hybrid vehicles are over a year. The push to PHEV and BEV will continue to be delayed due to ridiculous prices. The average transaction price for a new EV last month was north of $66,000. Not affordable.<p>Great insights in Greg's article. I wish we could have helped him before he embarked on the journey.
I hope the example of Tesla's successful direct sales model, and Ford and GM's current frustration with dealers marking up popular EVs, will result in the large auto companies lobbying to remove the protectionist laws that force the dealership model on consumers.
During my studies when I was overseas we had a seminar on how to buy a car in NZ. The guy was absolutely awesome, he told us about a lot of the tricks employed by dealers from subtle things like mirrors where you are supposed to park the car (you see yourself in the mirror) to things like working you with two people (it's much harder to resist 2 people arguing with you, also why you should never go by yourself). He also gave some good tips: go at certain days of the month when they are about to get new stock in, try to find the underperforming salesperson (they get away with worse deals, because the others feel sorry for them), give the impression you are planning to buy for much less than you really want, because they always try to get you over your budget.<p>I managed to use those tricks when I bought my first car. Managed to get it at about 40% of the sticker price (used car). Haven't been as successful since though.
This is why when you buy a car, you go in with a person that knows cars. Or consult them whilst you browse online.<p>Be frugal with options/extras. Don't show excitement. If you're poor at negotiating, try the brute force approach of an exit. Doesn't matter what the offer is, just laugh, mumble something, and exit the venue. They'll normally stop you. Don't bite at the second offer either, they were already taking that into account. Hassle some more.<p>This assumes a market where the seller has a very strong incentive to sell, so not when there's lots of buyers.<p>Have bullet proof facts ready, like prices for the same car elsewhere. In short, come prepared.
I recently went through a car buying process and it was extremely brutal. You signup paying for Doc fee ($600), even gas, other hidden fees, and outrageous charges. Another issue I noticed was you are forced into buying overprized accessories like first aid kit ($150), car mats and even cargo nets. After all this we ended up buying from craigslist as to my surprise some of these charges cannot be even waved, you don't stand a chance as people are willing to pay for these things and dealership just move to next customer.
I won't speak to this Covid period, as it is an exception. Not sure if it will go on for a long time or not, but right now I look at it as an exception.<p>But, first thing I did a long, long time ago was read all I could about dealerships, dealarship tactics, dearler salesperson tactics, info on how to lower the price, and everything I could get my hands on. This was before the internet and I'm positive there's a ton of stuff on this on youtube and elsewhere.<p>Homes and vehicles are the biggest ticket items that people purchase. Not to learn everything you can about buying a car is idiotic, with all the resources available out there.<p>I've known the trick about "trade ins" for a long time, this has always been known. So you don't even talk about trading in your car. You sell it privately. You will never get the same value from a dealer, it's impossible, why you even trying to do the trade in?<p>Never fall in love with a car and let them know, always seem like you don't care. Go to multiple dealers. Never do the whole "let me take your drivers license and credit card" trick so that they can keep you there waiting for the financial office to "finish processing" or whatever bullshit they spout. Then they have a second salesperson take a crack at you if you're not buying.<p>Anyways, read up. Watch up.<p><a href="https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=how+to+get+best+deal+at+car+dealership" rel="nofollow">https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=how+to+get+best...</a><p><a href="https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=car+sales+tricks" rel="nofollow">https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=car+sales+trick...</a>
Dealerships make it unbelievably painful as a matter of course. I bought my most recent car coming off lease. Even though I arranged all this online and arrived with a certified check, it still took me 3 hours to get the paperwork done when I showed up there - talk about captured. It was ridiculous.
I couldn’t agree more with the author. It’s my exact experience.<p>I’m in the market to get a car for my 16 year old daughter. Found a car she wanted online, made an appointment (after they confirmed the inventory with the dealership) - we drove 2 hours only to be told the car we wanted just got moved to sister dealership a few miles away… asked them if we could go see or buy it only to be told it sold (after a minute of “checking”) and by the way all cars are marked $10k above MSRP in the name of market adjustment!<p>I guess technically it’s not false advertising since the advertised car we wanted “sold”. What infuriated me is not even time wasted - with confirmation I started financing process!! Now I have an inquiry on my credit report for nothing.<p>It’s such an outdated sales model based on trickery and I hope dealerships go by way of malls in my lifetime!
I purchased my current vehicle through an auto broker - for a fee, a description of the model/trim level, and the name of the dealership I want to pick the car up at (anywhere in Canada), they would negotiate on my behalf. Once they have a final price I sign off on it, and would be told the date to pick it up and make payment.<p>It was a stress-free experience and I would definitely recommend you look into that if you really hate the idea of buying a car.
Who goes to a dealership to buy a car anymore? In 1991 I bought my Miata online (I think. Maybe it was over the phone), and they delivered it to a dealer near me, where I just picked it up. Alternatives to dealers have been around forever.
Here’s my Stealership experience:<p>I bought a car from Shift.com and it was an absolute nightmare.<p>Originally I had decided on a Tesla that was in Oakland and put down my deposit. The rates Shift gave me were laughable so I contacted my credit union. Shift put every roadblock up trying to convince me to go with their financing and refinance at a later date. I declined and shortly after my car was sold to someone else. If I remember correctly it was within like 24hrs. They apologized profusely and told me that it shouldn’t have been possible for that to happen, but it did.<p>I found another car in San Diego and put down another deposit. I was contacted about shipping and told if I did it by a certain time they would ship the next day. I did. It took something like a week to arrive in Oakland and sat for a few days before they could inspect and schedule a delivery.<p>The delivery was a parking spot on a major street with a rushed employee. I mention that because I didn’t notice anything major with cars flying past me.<p>I immediately drive to a parking lot and start examining the car. The trunk alignment seems off and there was no mention of damage so I take some photographs. Maybe it happened in shipping? I take it to a car wash because it was filthy. The trunk has a leak. It’s gross and musky in there.<p>Shift blew me off so I emailed their CEO, legal, PR, etc until someone reached out to me. They paid for an inspection and I choose the Toyota dealership. Dealership was shocked that the damage wasn’t spotted during Shift’s initial inspection. There was a huge hit in the rear and the repair work was subpar at best. The body panel was leaking water and the advanced sensors weren’t working because the rear left one was broken. The initial quote was ~$10k.<p>Shift was provided the report and after some time they scheduled a pickup to have their team preform their own inspection.<p>Fast forward 8 weeks of very little communication I am informed they have fixed the car. I pressed for more info and they said they sent my car to a DETAILER. Not a mechanic. Not a body shop. Their detailer said the Toyota dealership was wrong. No leak. Sensors work.<p>Somehow they decided that my front bumper was the problem and “painted it”, or at least that’s what Shift told me. Turns out they lied about that too. Original paint that they buffed, but left compound everywhere and fucked up my headlights and Toyota badge.<p>When confronted with all of this, with photo evidence, Shift offered me $250.<p>That’s it. $250 after keeping my car for nearly 10 weeks and then not fixing it. During the time they had it the avg MPG dropped to 21 mpg (typically 40) and managed to break a bunch of fasteners in the trunk.<p>Now my car has a major accident on the carfax and I’ll be out at least $10k to fix it. Fuck Shift.com
Every one I know hates car dealerships. Yet 90% of them refuse to buy a used car from a private party.<p>While it's true they have a lobby and have twisted the arms of legislators, it's also true that people prefer buying from them. And when they don't buy from them, they buy from CarMax which, for used cars, is even worse than buying from a dealer (pre-pandemic).<p>What keeps people from buying from private parties?<p>Unwillingness to plan and save money (i.e. refuse to buy car without financing). Even for under $10K<p>Being scared of getting a lemon because they lack knowledge about cars. I too lack that knowledge, which is why I get a trusted mechanic to check out any car I buy. Hasn't failed me in 20 years. Used car warranties are useless - they don't last long. And the last time I went car shopping, <i>every</i> used car from the dealer that seemed like a good price had serious problems when I took it to the mechanic. Never get a used car from a dealer if they don't let you take it to a mechanic.<p>Quicker process: It may take a while finding a good used car via Private Party. OTOH, there are plenty of dealers one can walk into. However, once you find a car you like, the process is much smoother with private party. You either agree on a price or you don't. No hidden fees. You know exactly what you're getting.<p><i>Edit</i>: I just want to be clear: I'm not trying to convince anyone to buy private party. If you're happy with avoiding the "hassle", that's fine. My point is that for all the complaints about dealers, the reality is people prefer them.
Why do people get all worked up over a difference ± a few hundred dollars on a very expensive purchase? When I want to buy a car, which I admit rarely happens, I look at the advertised price and if I'm willing to pay that price then I call the dealer and if I'm not, I don't. If the paperwork shows up with a different number on it then I tell them to leave, and it's their time, not mine, that was wasted.<p>I just really don't get the whole haggling thing. If you want a lower price, wait until one is being advertised, or substitute a different model, or get a bicycle.