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Senior engineers are living in the future

324 pointsby pierreprinettiover 2 years ago

23 comments

_ktx2over 2 years ago
Being a senior engineer is weird when looking retrospectively. I remember being a junior and experiencing what the author is talking about with respect to puzzlingly staring at my seniors when they could answer obscure questions.<p>Now I do it and do the same things they did with me: facilitate my thought and troubleshooting process rather than give me answers. I think the people that are successful in Senior+ engineering are that way because of certain technical and character traits they&#x27;ve developed.<p>One is a willingness to be <i>right</i> in the long run. When I was a young engineer I would make my cases hard with data. As a senior engineer I sit back and let the machine mull for a while because I <i>know</i> that&#x27;s what the engineering machine will do regardless of how technically right I may be. Another is knowing that <i>right</i> isn&#x27;t always right. Sometimes the right answer is technically wrong, or the learnings of wrong need to be made before we collectively can be right. Another is a lot of patience; patience for myself, patience for others. I recently admitted I was behind on work because my power was out for three straight days. Young me would&#x27;ve found a coffee shop and worked those days with a single monitor down to the bone. Senior me took my dog to the park.<p>Not everyone makes it to senior, had I not forked my path in certain places I don&#x27;t think I would have. My advice, relish your time as non-senior and ask lots of non-technical questions. The technical stuff comes over time and by necessity.
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sp332over 2 years ago
One of my classmates in college couldn&#x27;t handle this. I&#x27;d glance at some awful Visual Studio compiler error and then point out a missing semicolon. He ended up feeling stupid, but I was trying to be encouraging because his code was pretty good aside from some missing punctuation, which will come with practice. He ended up switching majors.
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triyambakamover 2 years ago
Where I am often hung up in comparison is due to age. I dropped out of college and spent my early 20s learning agriculture and construction. Now I work in software engineering and my current manager is younger than me. Not only is he younger than me, but he&#x27;s been able to climb up to an engineering manager in a shorter amount of time than I&#x27;ve been working as a SWE. So I feel really lame - wasted so much time early in my life and still seem to be wasting time.
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skrtskrtover 2 years ago
Often as I&#x27;ve grown in engineering I&#x27;ve wished there was just a series of books that I could study backwards and forwards in order to just <i>become</i> a highly knowledgeable engineer.<p>Instead it turns out that I&#x27;m just piling little pebbles of knowledge and experience on top of other ones, and I couldn&#x27;t look back and design a book or a course or a curriculum to bring my old self to where I currently am. There are some pebbles just sitting on the side that haven&#x27;t had an opportunity to be integrated into the pile yet, and some never will. It&#x27;s all so... random
revskillover 2 years ago
Senior means two things:<p>- Have experience<p>- Self learning though above experience.<p>I met many experienced developers, but most of them failed at step 2. To me, they&#x27;re still junior.
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w10-1over 2 years ago
The article&#x27;s perspective is that the superiority of senior engineers lies mainly in the access they have to other people. I.e., they&#x27;re not better, and it&#x27;s not because of their experience; it&#x27;s because of their position.<p>I.e., the politics of resentment have reached even here. Do junior engineers prioritize avoiding embarrassment over learning?<p>This is a really, really tough nut to crack. And let&#x27;s not always hand-wave about safe cultures.<p>When in senior roles, I try to model learning from failure and sharing everything, from short script tips and fantastic books to leads and gossip. Also sit together.<p>But still: juniors have literally complained that it doesn&#x27;t matter when I fail, because I&#x27;m already &quot;made&quot;. Their sense that they have to prove themselves, and advance on some ladder, hangs over them always. Even, or especially, at leading companies, where <i>everyone</i> there is good.<p>Part of it may be style: if after a while you drop all the &quot;please&quot; and &quot;maybe&quot;, you risk people confusing assertiveness with authority (triggers).<p>Feed them achievable projects where they can hide failures and show success. And give them their say. Doing this adds a new dimension of complexity to meetings and work factoring, but they eventually chill.<p>If it&#x27;s better to teach someone to fish, think of it as producing fishermen instead of fish.
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lifeisstillgoodover 2 years ago
Oh God. No.<p>&quot;Ensure that you are fulfilling the expectations of your manager&quot;<p>Please please do not assume your manager is any good at their job. Talk to your users. Find a way to identify them and get feedback from them. Keep your manager in the loop sure. But don&#x27;t wait for requirements to come down from on high.<p>&quot;Every step up in job title is equivalent to living perhaps 1–2 days further into the future.&quot; No. If an organisation passes information down through the hierarchy then by the time it reaches you (it&#x27;s more like 1-2 weeks if not months into the future) then it&#x27;s already moved on.<p>The US military tries hard to put decision making at the front line where it is most up to date. At the Battle of Jutland the British ships in the fleet had to radio its positions and sightings back to London, so London could update its &quot;board&quot; and radio to the Admiral in the fleet. This Admiral was this working on data that ships a mile or two away from him had had hours ago, but he was only just getting. This lead to an inconclusive battle.<p>Anyway.<p>Open information is way important.
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kradeelavover 2 years ago
Not an engineer, but I find this translates well over to design.<p>Seniority in a lot of ways feels like the acknowledgement of being able to utilize people&#x2F;soft skills in order to build things. I find at least 1&#x2F;3 to 1&#x2F;2 of my time, a roadblock in the project is caused by accidental miscommunication from top down, and the faster you can debug those, the happier everyone will be.<p>Personally I rather enjoy that hybrid of people and &quot;hard&quot; design, but it&#x27;s definitely not for everyone.
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giantg2over 2 years ago
&quot;The first—and most important—thing is to stop comparing yourself with others. Ensure that you are fulfilling the expectations of your manager and team for your development contributions.&quot;<p>I have yet to see a manager or organization that doesn&#x27;t compare on some level, even if it&#x27;s just implicit biases.
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strikelaserclawover 2 years ago
a great article, we software engineers are impatient and we tend to job hop often. Being an effective engineer is about more than knowing how to build systems and code, it also requires deep domain knowledge into your company&#x27;s business and existing systems and this knowledge takes years to cultivate at the same company. All the superstars at my current company have been here for a while.
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manv1over 2 years ago
Senior engineer = experience. For example, when building an HA system with embedded devices the devices shouldn&#x27;t use the DNS cache and should ignore the TTL. They also shouldn&#x27;t validate expiration dates on TLS certificates.<p>Why not? Because stuff will fuck up if you don&#x27;t do that.<p>Also, you have to deal with the &quot;regional power failure&quot; situation, where every one of your devices will call home at the same time. Do devices need provisioning before they work? Because if they do, you need to handle that load fast.<p>Do you believe a MAC address is unique and universal? It isn&#x27;t as unique as you think, and not everything on the internet has a MAC address.<p>Essentially, someone who&#x27;s been around for a while realizes there&#x27;s a difference between the spec (correctness) and what needs to happen to get shit to keep working (customers).
Invictus0over 2 years ago
HN headline tomorrow: Senior engineers are literally gods
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ChrisMarshallNYover 2 years ago
<i>&gt; The first—and most important—thing is to stop comparing yourself with others.</i><p>I&#x27;m &quot;yes and no&quot; on this. The reason is that I often look at the work&#x2F;process&#x2F;product of others, as inspiration. There&#x27;s a lot of folks that are better than I am, and it is a good idea for me to keep an eye on what they do, and how they do it.<p>What I <i>don&#x27;t</i> do, is compete with others. I am not competitive, and I&#x27;m fine with that.<p>Unfortunately, that seems to be a bit of an aberration. I am <i>constantly</i> having others take a competitive stance with me, and it can add a lot of friction; when they refuse to share information, make a point of being &quot;snooty&quot; with me, or assume that, when I talk about my work, I&#x27;m trying to cast their work in a negative light.<p>That&#x27;s not usually the case. I have very high standards, and I hold myself to them. If I will be incorporating the work of others, in mine, then I&#x27;ll hold them to high standards.<p>Otherwise, I&#x27;ve actually found a lot of gems in things like sloppy StackOverflow examples. Their lashup code may solve my problem, and I can take their solution, and refactor it into one that meets my own bar. I don&#x27;t waste any time, thinking negatively about the other person. In fact, I&#x27;m usually fairly effusive, in my thanks. The person is often coming from an academic point of view, and are not concerned about the practicalities of shipping software.<p>There&#x27;s so damn much negativity, these days; often driven directly by competitiveness, that I feel I need to reduce my contribution to it.
unconedover 2 years ago
I&#x27;ve been told on one contract that my style was off-putting and making others on the team feel like nothing was ever good enough... at the _same time_ as a team on a second, parallel contract couldn&#x27;t get enough of my time and thanked me profusely for helping them out of the hole they dug and teaching them to get better.<p>It&#x27;s all about attitude and egos. There are devs who call themselves senior who are theoretically proficient coders, but who lack the &quot;street smarts&quot; of how to develop a useful product, and how to architect it well.<p>The person with 10y+ more experience is going to run circles around them. Not because they can crank out code faster, or with fewer bugs, but simply because they can do a lot more with a lot less, and they can contextualize what they code in terms of what the business is going to need 3-6-12 months down the line.<p>As a junior you can either be resentful and try to compete from afar (job A), or you can realize you had access to a wealth of knowledge and experience that can give you a multi-year headstart on your peers (job B). Choose wisely.
drummerover 2 years ago
Seniors are overrated. Principles is where it&#x27;s at now.
javier_e06over 2 years ago
The operative word is value: Many conventions and activities have value, some don&#x27;t. I once met a senior developer who created in c++ the Class Byte for our codebase to tackle portability with it. I was a noob and I really thought that learning that had value. Years later I realized that there was really no value to the solution and it was more of a gold-plating activity. Yet, there was value on learning to recognize superfluous code. As a code developer their is that is that ironic and somewhat painful enlightenment along pacing along many dead end trails. What about those activities that truly not only do not have value but chip away the value of other valuable efforts. That is the time to dust off your resume.
ZephyrBluover 2 years ago
&gt; <i>For those with the structural advantage of frontrunning the flow of information to the team, it is literally effortless to accidentally cultivate the impression of being some kind of wizard</i><p>As someone more junior, I&#x27;ve already seen this and realized what was up and I absolutely hate it.<p>In many cases there is literally no reason other than seniority that people can&#x27;t do things. If you gave the same information access to a capable junior or mid level eng they would be able to solve these problems, write the document, etc but that doesn&#x27;t happen because it&#x27;s not explicitly part of your role.
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onion2kover 2 years ago
This explains why I&#x27;m so tired.
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lasermike026over 2 years ago
Get your ego out of the game. Great teams work together, support each other, live and die with each other and share the victory. There are no straight paths. Just blood, sweat, tears and laughs. I&#x27;ve done too many startups. I should know.
pojzonover 2 years ago
Based on the job title only - Ive met seniors that would not be even called juniors in other companies.<p>So yea.. it all depends where you stand.<p>Ps. You dont have to compare yourself to others. Ppl will do it for you. During interviews or internal reviews. You wont run away from that.
dbttdftover 2 years ago
Weird how they used as an example debugging character encoding bugs instead of solving real problems as the typical thing software engineers do.
arwhateverover 2 years ago
Senior Engineers can also give the impression of wizardry by writing shitty code that only they understand.
makzover 2 years ago
I’ve heard that the literal translation for Sensei is “the one that was here before” or something like that.