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Diablo Pitch Document (1994) [pdf]

330 pointsby bpierrealmost 2 years ago

27 comments

bexsellaalmost 2 years ago
My favourite story of Diablo&#x27;s development (as relayed by David Brevik in the Diablo Postmortem - see below) is the part where Diablo was made real-time. He passionately championed that it should be more like Rogue or Moria purely turn-based and permadeath. That was until he implemented real-time movement in an afternoon and attacked a skeleton. This was a directive from Blizzard, and it effectively created the ARPG genre.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=VscdPA6sUkc">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=VscdPA6sUkc</a><p>and for those averse to Google: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.gdcvault.com&#x2F;play&#x2F;1023469&#x2F;Classic-Game-Postmortem" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.gdcvault.com&#x2F;play&#x2F;1023469&#x2F;Classic-Game-Postmorte...</a>
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koseialmost 2 years ago
It was a different time: “Condor plans to spend one year in the development of Diablo. Personnel will consist of: one designer, one chief programmer, 2 junior programmer, 2 art director&#x2F;artists, 1 illustrator&#x2F;sculptor, 3 pixel artists, and 1 sound FX person”<p>So, 11 people for a year for Diablo. Meanwhile Diablo 4 took 300+ people 6+ years. So over 150x the cost, not accounting for the fact that game developers are paid much more now as well. People pretend it’s the same industry but it’s evolved dramatically.
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meitrosalmost 2 years ago
An underrated choice of the original diablo is that it would only show you a subset of story quests and boss monsters in a single play-through. A few (like the butcher) would always show up, but for most others there&#x27;d be multiple options for which story quest would be in the game.<p>A lot of games since include every quest in every playthrough (or change it based on what choices you make), and games like the Witcher 3 nailed having really well written side quests that weren&#x27;t just filler. But enough players are completionists that it can feel exhausting to play those, and if you&#x27;re a completionist the game often becomes less challenging because you&#x27;re earning extra experience&#x2F;gold.
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jimbob45almost 2 years ago
Here’s the one for Planescape: Torment if anyone is interested.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;rpgwatch.com&#x2F;files&#x2F;Files&#x2F;00-0208&#x2F;Torment_Vision_Statement_1997.pdf" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;rpgwatch.com&#x2F;files&#x2F;Files&#x2F;00-0208&#x2F;Torment_Vision_Stat...</a>
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cpetersoalmost 2 years ago
To find out what happened next, check out Diablo developer David Brevik’s postmortem presentation at GDC 2016: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;youtu.be&#x2F;VscdPA6sUkc" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;youtu.be&#x2F;VscdPA6sUkc</a>
bobsoapalmost 2 years ago
&gt; If one of those arrows ends up killing the fighter, that character will be <i>erased completely from the hard-drive</i> and the player must start from scratch.<p>Love the choice of words here. This sounds so very retro today; it&#x27;s reminiscent of the early days of computing on several levels.<p>Before savegames, before checkpoints, before cloud... there was simply the hard-drive, and you <i>erased</i> stuff from it. Fascinating.
A_D_E_P_Talmost 2 years ago
The &quot;Marketing&quot; section practically describes modern DLC.<p>Fortunately, they weren&#x27;t able to implement any of it -- probably, among other reasons, because the logistics of physical disc distribution and merchandising were too complicated -- but perhaps it could be said that they were 15 years ahead of their time.
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jonhohlealmost 2 years ago
It’s always nice to see humble beginnings like this. It can be hard at the start of a greenfield project to get ideas out without feeling like it’s amateur hour having to explain basic concepts that may or may not be novel to the people who need to be convinced to let the project move forward.<p>Now Diablo is one of the biggest franchises in gaming, and its early pitch document looks quaint compared to what it’s become.<p>Also neat to see what made it in, what didn’t, and when things that seem essential to Diablo were being discussed that early.
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fabiensanglardalmost 2 years ago
If you enjoy the topic, try to take the time to read &quot;Stay Awhile and Listen&quot; by David L. Craddock (<a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.amazon.com&#x2F;gp&#x2F;product&#x2F;B07ZQQRWS9?notRedirectToSDP=1&amp;ref_=dbs_mng_calw_1&amp;storeType=ebooks" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.amazon.com&#x2F;gp&#x2F;product&#x2F;B07ZQQRWS9?notRedirectToSD...</a>).<p>I was shocked to learn how little the dev team was financially rewarded (besides the owners).
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Semaphoralmost 2 years ago
2020, 6 comments: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=24844666">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=24844666</a><p>2018, 89 comments: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=16685795">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=16685795</a><p>2016, 112 comments: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=11322912">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=11322912</a>
pixel_tracingalmost 2 years ago
How things have deviated since Diablo 2, I’m so saddened by the lack of creativity in D4 compared to path of exile
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hnbadalmost 2 years ago
It&#x27;s interesting of course to see such outlandish features as the complex race&#x2F;sub-class system for character creation (which was replaced with a handful of predefined distinct archetypes) or the turn-based combat system.<p>But what strikes me most is the sales pitch: it&#x27;s not intended to simply be another game, it&#x27;s basically a game generator and players would be expected to buy expansion packs (what we would now call DLCs) which add a handful of things to the generator. The document even compares this to Magic The Gathering.<p>Considering the actual game only received one (rushed) expansion and that expansion was very different in scope (offering two additional, smaller, dungeons, one new character class (including two unfinished ones left in the source code) and a handful of new features and content) this seems honestly the most surprising to me.<p>This design document is pretty much built to sell the idea of content pack DLCs a decade ahead of their time. I wonder what finally caused the change of heart.
westoquealmost 2 years ago
As a software engineer, I wonder how accurate they stuck to their said schedule at the last page.
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deepsunalmost 2 years ago
&gt; to spend one year in the development<p>&gt; one chief programmer and two junior programmer<p>Way too modest by today standards. Also, I would say chief programmer will spend most of the time teaching juniors, unless then &quot;junior&quot; was what we call senior today.
Solvencyalmost 2 years ago
What always bemuses me is how, if I were evaluating this pitch in 1994 and had absolutely zero future knowledge, I could very easily have brushed this aside with a &quot;meh.&quot; And Diablo is one of my favorite franchises ever.<p>It really could have flopped or just barely breezed by as a passing game. You&#x27;d never really know for sure. Leap of faith.
cm2012almost 2 years ago
Aside: Diablo 4 is an <i>incredible</i> couch co-op game, the best made in ages. My wife and I are having a blast with it.
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Anders_Aalmost 2 years ago
Wow. This is extremely similar to what we actually got. I&#x27;m glad they ditched the turn based stuff though :).
anacrolixalmost 2 years ago
if you want the turn based experience like the document describes, try Castle of the Winds. Nailed it
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seabass-labraxalmost 2 years ago
From the document:<p>&gt; The world of <i>Diablo</i> will have a dark, evil tone. Initial levels will be set in an abandoned Gothic church. A marble mausoleum and progressively darker, dingier crypts and catacombs follow.<p>As someone who has been down in the crypt of an abandoned Victorian Gothic church, I can confirm that they definitely do <i>not</i> look like the level in Diablo does!
notbeulleralmost 2 years ago
I recalled that this made the rounds a while back - caused me to purchase the assets (again!) to play.<p>Diablo 1 for Web Browsers(<a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;d07RiV&#x2F;diabloweb">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;d07RiV&#x2F;diabloweb</a>) 449 points|nsoonhui|10 months ago|109 comments
bobmaxupalmost 2 years ago
Not loading for me, but I assume this is it?<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;archive.org&#x2F;details&#x2F;diablo_pitch&#x2F;page&#x2F;n7&#x2F;mode&#x2F;2up" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;archive.org&#x2F;details&#x2F;diablo_pitch&#x2F;page&#x2F;n7&#x2F;mode&#x2F;2up</a>
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Prunktonalmost 2 years ago
Imagine making a pitch on 8 pages contains 5 out of 7 pictures with random daemons&#x2F;monsters and being overly successful with it. Damn!
cris007almost 2 years ago
So, from the pitch document, it seems that the game was initially envisioned as a turn-based action-point based movement affair.
diogenescynicalmost 2 years ago
Are there any good books on Diablo series? I&#x27;d love to read more.
3m4ralmost 2 years ago
What&#x27;s astounding to me is how well the Diablo and Diablo II team took the design decisions that Angband made (and Brevik based Diablo on Angband, not Moria) and were able to fix almost all of them.<p>It&#x27;s actually kind of sad, that Brevik effectively stole the basic design of a FOSS game and commercialized it, but the end result is very much a better game for it.<p>To wit, Angband is supposedly the fortress of Morgoth, but it&#x27;s an empty mine where the enemies are blobs and ants for any n levels. Diablo fixed this by actually gradating the dungeon as strata rather than the same level type over and over again. They likewise reduced the monster types to thematically fit. In Angband you can still encounter level 1 monsters on the 100th dungeon level<p>Angband had one set of artifacts (random artifact sets came later). There were and are very few that actually appear before well into mid-game. Diablo I did this, discovered that it was pretty boring and added in rares and sets in Diablo II that were accessible immediately.<p>Angband decided to have big loot that was dropped by unique monsters, but because the drop rate was too low and the unique list too small, made &quot;vaults&quot; of rooms that are loaded with artifacts. Diablo II just allowed you to grind uniques with decaying drop rates, as well as adding in super monsters and chests.<p>Angband is 100 levels of sameness. Diablo I cut it down to 16, if I remember correctly, whereas Diablo II took the 100 level formula and broke it up into three difficulties and made it a linear adventure rather than only a descent. And even though you repeat it three times, there&#x27;s enough time between repetition that it <i>feels</i> fresh.<p>Diablo II did the exact same thing with base items as well. In Angband, there&#x27;s a dagger (1d4). From dungeon level 1 to 100, a dagger will only be 1d4. Diablo II gave you three tiers of base items that actually made using them feasible.<p>In Angband, gold becomes useless because the stuff you can buy in town is pegged to level 1 beginner gear. Diablo I had level scaled gear gambling and Diablo II made tiers of cities with scaled equipment and also included gambling.<p>In Angband, you can haul around 99 potions of various tiers of healing. In Diablo I&#x2F;II, you are capped to what can reasonably fit into your inventory, with rapid access limited to belt size.<p>There are dozens if not hundreds of other decisions that were the right ones to make that Diablo I&#x2F;II made that Angband didn&#x27;t that makes Angband look like an archaic dinosaur that deserved to have its lunch eaten.<p>Now, Angband is still being updated, but instead of making the type of choices that Diablo made, they&#x27;ve been just &quot;streamlining&quot; it and bugfixing. The ID game is almost completely gone, you no longer sell gear in town by default, and the majority of players skip the middle 70 levels of the game.<p>I recently added in needed quality of life improvements to a fork of Angband like DCSS-style autoexplore and tab-combat (no one seemed to actually <i>try</i> it) but the game needs a drastic overhaul to coopt all the improvements that Diablo I&#x2F;II made on the town-dungeon-sell-loop game so that the game&#x27;s player base doesn&#x27;t die off completely. Currently, the only two *band games with sizable player bases are Sil-Q (a tightly designed &quot;modern&quot; and Tolkien-faithful Angband) and FrogComPosBand (a kitchen-sink variant), but Angband&#x27;s is all but dead.<p>Unfortunately, the current maintainer and grognard player base want to keep the design fixed roughly at the norms of 1992 with a cleaner code base. So it goes I guess.<p>Angband: The game that invented epic loot: <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;homebrewhomunculus.blogspot.com&#x2F;2021&#x2F;05&#x2F;the-game-that-invented-epic-loot.html?m=1" rel="nofollow noreferrer">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;homebrewhomunculus.blogspot.com&#x2F;2021&#x2F;05&#x2F;the-game-that...</a><p>My fork: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;3m4r&#x2F;angbandv">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;3m4r&#x2F;angbandv</a>
winddudealmost 2 years ago
one of the greatest games.
29athrowawayalmost 2 years ago
[removed]
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