The reason we can still run Linux on our desktops and laptops today, is that Linux was already popular enough back when Secure Boot was specified, so that Microsoft could be convinced to allow Secure Boot to be disabled and/or user-specified keys to be enrolled (and also to sign the bootloader for Linux distributions which follow a specific set of criteria when Secure Boot is enabled). Had desktop Linux not been popular enough, Microsoft would have required all OEMs to not allow disabling Secure Boot or enrolling user-specified keys (as they later tried to do with ARM laptops).<p>In the present day, are alternative browsers popular enough that we can avoid the worst-case scenario? Do enough people compile these alternative browsers from source code (meaning each binary is slightly different) to make a difference?
The first use case they mention is restricting ad fraud (and, presumably, ad blocking):<p>> Users like visiting websites that are expensive to create and maintain, but they often want or need to do it without paying directly. These websites fund themselves with ads, but the advertisers can only afford to pay for humans to see the ads, rather than robots. This creates a need for human users to prove to websites that they're human, sometimes through tasks like challenges or logins.<p>So if this goes forward, websites will be able to call the web environment integrity API to check you are a proper ad-watching human before serving content.
I would love to know the personal motivations and moral feelings of those who work on features like this. Are they naive about how these features will be used? Do they not care? Do they not have a personal sense of responsibility for contributing to the end of open, free computing? It's been a while since I took a Big Tech paycheck, but I don't remember being this willing to go build nightmare tech when I was getting one.
This topic was posted earlier today but was seemingly killed..<p><a href="https://hnrankings.info/36778999/" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https://hnrankings.info/36778999/</a>
Google marketing exec: "We need to lock down web browsers so we can make more money by showing ads."<p>"Ad blockers need to be prevented. The new WEIE APIs will ensure that ad blockers aren't running and that no DRM is being compromised."<p>"We also want to prevent ad fraud. With WEIE we can ensure that ad clicks are legit and that people are watching the ads we show. If we can't control the operating system like we can on Chromebooks and Android phones, then we need to control the web browser with cryptographic certainty."
Will anybody be able to do anything about it? This is not API for you and me. This is API for the big tech, for corporations, for Banks. They will use it, they will honour it. You may not use it, but because corporations will use it, it will become a standard. Three is no leeway. You have no control over big business. You will scream, they will do what they want.
So, in short: Google and other companies shamelessly polluted the web with ads and personalized ad driven content, and since regular folks use ad blockers, and ad manipulating people abuse the very system those companies fostered, there is now a supposed need to get the house in order... ...by force feeding us ads and trackers, bypassing whatever still allows people to browse sanely.
What if I tell my browser to not respond to these attestation requests?<p>What about all the people who have an outdated browser and don't know how to update it?<p>edit:
One of the goals addresses this[0]:<p><i>Continue to allow web browsers to browse the Web without attestation</i>
Absolute worst spec I've ever seen. Google needs to be loaded into a cannon and fired into the sun.<p>> How does this affect browser modifications and extensions?<p>> Web Environment Integrity attests the legitimacy of the underlying hardware and software stack, it does not restrict the indicated application’s functionality: E.g. if the browser allows extensions, the user may use extensions; if a browser is modified, the modified browser can still request Web Environment Integrity attestation.<p>Then what's the point? I can make modified bot browser that commits ad fraud as long as I don't use a rooted Android phone?<p>I don't believe they're being honest with how this will be used. We need to legally regulate remote attestation.<p>> As new browsers are introduced, they would need to demonstrate to attesters (a relatively small group) that they pass the bar, but they wouldn't need to convince all the websites in the world.<p>It speaks for itself. Horrid.