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Forming an Edge

74 pointsby visvivaover 1 year ago

11 comments

mjbover 1 year ago
I don&#x27;t think we need to descend to this level of mysticism when discussing knives.<p>If you want a knife that is a carefully crafted beautiful object, hand-made by a craftsman with a long legacy and great skill, then feel free to buy a Japanese or handmade American (or whatever) knife. It&#x27;ll be beautiful. You&#x27;ll likely love using it, and think about the story often when you do. It&#x27;s a great thing.<p>But if you want a knife that&#x27;s going to be sharp, durable, safe, and efficient, don&#x27;t feel like you need to believe the hype about steel, or the hype about craftsmanship. Especially don&#x27;t believe that you need to accept either a knife that is going to require careful maintenance, or a knife that&#x27;s &quot;soft&quot; or &quot;gummy&quot;.<p>On nearly any objective measure - edge retention, hardness, toughness, wear resistance, corrosion resistance, etc - there are modern steels that significantly outperform low-alloy carbon steel. More specifically, there are modern steels that are significantly closer to any reasonable Pareto frontier of knife steel than low-allow carbon steel (Japanese or not). Many of these steels are corrosion resistant, if not outright stainless. Particle metallurgy steels like S35VN or Magnacut or S30V, while expensive, have incredible properties for kitchen knives of many styles. There are even modern steels like S90V that are so wear resistant that sharpening them without machines can lead to madness.<p>Low-allow carbon steel (like the mythologized Japanese steels) are significantly easier to work with traditional techniques, and therefore frequently chosen by the people who practice those techniques. That workability comes to come with significant tradeoffs (including corrosion resistance, which is important for both edge retention and every day usefulness).<p>This article also isn&#x27;t super clear about sharpness. There&#x27;s a lot more to edge geometry than is presented here. In fact, edge and bevel geometry is easily more important than steel. Depending what they are cutting through the thickness of the edge may matter, but often the thickness just behind the edge matters just as much.<p>If you&#x27;re interested in getting into knives and want to avoid the mythology, I highly recommend Larrin Thomas&#x27; book &quot;Knife Engineering&quot;. It&#x27;s a great read on the things that matter, and the tradeoffs in the space.<p>A while ago I started making my own knives. Now every kitchen knife I own is one I made myself, including heat treating and other possibly mythological processes. On that journey, I&#x27;ve learned a huge amount of respect for the incredible craft that is knifemaking, but also a lot of skepticism for the assertions that connect knife craft techniques to knife performance.<p>These days I sharpen on a Tormek wet grinder, and touch up with a 1000 grit &quot;splash and go&quot; stone. Sharpening can be an entire hobby of its own, but again you don&#x27;t need to buy into the mythology to get a knife that&#x27;s extremely sharp.
dekhnover 1 year ago
When I worked in food service the knives were rotated weekly and came back super sharp. It was really nice- a really sharp knife, properly handled, is a real pleasure to use.<p>At home, I&#x27;m lazy and never have my knives sharpened- yet my one high quality knife is still pretty good after 5+ years of not being sharpened (it no longer cuts skin when drawn across it lightly). I did learn a trick- for most situations, a scalloped knife with with light serrations slices through tomatoes and never needs sharpening.
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Scene_Cast2over 1 year ago
To anyone considering getting into knife sharpening:<p>Usability matters more than perfection. If you&#x27;re the type of person that would only sharpen knives once a year because it takes half hour to set up your sharpening rig and sharpen your knife, get an electric sharpener instead - takes about 15 seconds. Yes, it&#x27;s not glorious or Instagram-pretty, but it gets the job done well.<p>For hand sharpening - look up micro-bevels. They speed up sharpening time considerably (still not as fast as electric sharpeners though).
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OldGuyInTheClubover 1 year ago
It may look simple in the diagrams and videos but sharpening is a tough skill to learn and then to master. One thing I learned through multiple woodworking classes is to avoid Japanese waterstones. They are beyond fiddly requiring regular reflattening in swarfy water every couple of dozen strokes of the tool. I spent more time doinking with the stones than actually sharpening. My diamond stones at least let me focus on developing the skill vs. fettling the tool AND then developing the skill. Maybe someday I&#x27;ll shave the hair on my arms.<p>As with so many things, Paul Sellers makes it look Bob Ross easy.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=GN4yr7vp4I4">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=GN4yr7vp4I4</a><p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=Ki8tt-VjwqI">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=Ki8tt-VjwqI</a><p>Edits for clarity and links.
parenthesesover 1 year ago
Funny anecdote: My mom prefers dull serrated knives. This is because she cuts ingredients over the stove and in her hands - she literally holds the tomatoes and diced them over the pot. A sharper knife doesn&#x27;t enable this technique so she hates chefs knives.
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bufferoutover 1 year ago
For those who like sharp knives, but don&#x27;t want to persue a doctorate in the matter, may I humbly suggest the Catraphone: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.catra.org&#x2F;sharpening-products&#x2F;catrahone-domestic-sharpener&#x2F;" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.catra.org&#x2F;sharpening-products&#x2F;catrahone-domestic...</a>
Pomfersover 1 year ago
The rabbit hole of knife sharpening goes incredibly deep. But if you&#x27;re just looking to cut food in your own kitchen, the vast majority of it is overkill. Professionals seem to make a bit deal out of knives, but many professionals use their knife as much in one day as a home cook does in one year.<p>Most expensive knives are made out of difficult to work with metals. They keep their edge for longer, but:<p>1 They&#x27;re harder to sharpen. The longer the knife can hold its edge, the longer it takes to grind out that edge. Higher end knives typically require diamond to sharpen at a reasonable pace, or at all.<p>2 They chip easier. Just like like glass used for smartphone screens, the better it resists scratches, the easier it shatters. High end knives, if they&#x27;re not thick, need to be carefully handled, or you&#x27;ll get a surprising number of nicks and chips in the edge. A sign someone doesn&#x27;t handle their expensive knives properly is if the pointy tips are chipped off.<p>3 They rust easier. High end knives often use metals with higher carbon and&#x2F;or lower chromium content. I learned this the hard way, as I air dry all my dishes, and knives with even 440C will rust if you don&#x27;t towel dry them after washing. Ultra hard knives that use non-stainless steel need to be kept covered in oil to prevent rust.<p>If you&#x27;re just getting into cooking, you don&#x27;t need much. Mercer Culinary is the go to brand for culinary school students. Their Millennia line comes sharper, harder, and more durable than any grocery store knife, while still being highly rust resistant.<p>If you want to use a whetstone, avoid the soft &quot;beginner friendly&quot; stones. They need to be soaked in water for like half an hour before you can use them, and they wear out very quickly. The only reason they exist is because they provide more feel or feedback. Instead, I&#x27;d recommend a Shapton basic 1000 grit. It&#x27;s a hard and durable stone that cuts fast, only needs a splash of water, and leaves you a very usable edge. Lower grits are for re-profiling the blade, such as if you&#x27;ve got nicks or chips. Higher grits are for polishing the edge, if you want to shave with it or something.<p>If using a whetstone seems too difficult, and you want an easier to use, but slower option, look into a Spydero Sharp Maker. I run my knife one pass through this thing before I use it, and it keeps the edge consistently sharp. I use my Shapton whetstones for when I&#x27;m sharpening my friends&#x27; knives.<p>Learn to slice instead of just ramming your knife straight down into the cutting board. Of course, some things require a chopping motion, but slicing is safer, and your knife edge will last longer.
pnathanover 1 year ago
Nothing about this article really has to do with a knife. :)<p>thanks for submitting it.
m3kw9over 1 year ago
Off topic, honing keeps the edge from needing to be reformed often
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Nzenover 1 year ago
tl;dr A meditation on how people achieve knife sharpness by (former? chef) TW Lim. This touches on steel heat treatment and grinding angles. Poetic language. Hosted on ghost (mentioning this in case you are allergic to subscription websites).
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wormhauskrarover 1 year ago
forbidden
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