TE
TechEcho
Home24h TopNewestBestAskShowJobs
GitHubTwitter
Home

TechEcho

A tech news platform built with Next.js, providing global tech news and discussions.

GitHubTwitter

Home

HomeNewestBestAskShowJobs

Resources

HackerNews APIOriginal HackerNewsNext.js

© 2025 TechEcho. All rights reserved.

Airlines Face Acute Shortage of Pilots

35 pointsby skennedyover 12 years ago

14 comments

michael_millerover 12 years ago
I'm a student pilot, and based on conversations I've had with my CFI (certified flight instructor), this article seems accurate.<p>Basically, it's really expensive to learn to fly. Think $112/hr for an extremely basic 2 seat plane, and around $65/hr for the instructor, at least in the NY area. Even assuming you do all the bookwork on your own without an instructor, that's around $7-8k for a private license(40-50h). After that, you need to get an instrument rating(40h), for around the same price.<p>Then, at 250 hours, you can get a commercial rating which lets you fly people around for money (you can't solicit passengers though). At this point, pilots usually go for a CFI rating, which lets them teach students. Most flight schools are happy to have the cheap labor, and the pilots want to get more hours so they can apply to regional airlines. The pay is pretty horrible (maybe $20-$30/h when you start), but it's the only way to build hours for most pilots. After doing this for a while (could be up to 600-700h), pilots either manage to find a gig flying businesspeople around on a corporate jet, an odd job like ferrying cargo around on a small plane, or go to a regional carrier. Regional carriers pay even worse than being a CFI, around $20k-$30k starting, but the tradeoff is that you're building time in a "serious" turboprop/jet plane, which the big airlines require before even hiring you as a first officer.<p>You have to take on a massive amount of debt to become a pilot, then get paid terrible wages once you start. Even when you hit the top and become a captain at a major airline you're still only making around $100-$110k, and very few pilots achieve this.<p>Raising the number of hours required to be hired as a pilot will cause less people to become pilots. It means CFIs will be instructors for much longer, making it harder for newly minted CFIs to find a job to pay off their debt.<p>The fundamental problem is that avgas costs a ton (up to $6-$7 in NY). If it was free, or at least much cheaper, to fly a plane, the hour requirements would not be a problem - pilots could just train for longer. I think the solution is going to be electric trainer planes. I see the most promising company in this area as beyond aviation (<a href="http://www.beyond-aviation.com/" rel="nofollow">http://www.beyond-aviation.com/</a>). They're developing an electric version of the Cessna 172, the most popular plane produced to date(43k+). Their president was the COO at Cessna for 6 years, so I'm really hopeful they can achieve their goal.<p>An electric plane has three major benefits: no avgas needed, air inlets can be reduced significantly (no oxygen-hogging combustion reactions) for reduced drag, and significantly reduced TBO. Background: on piston engine planes, a mechanic needs to disassemble the engine every ~2k hours of flying, replace bad parts, and reassemble it. This costs around $15k, contributing a nontrivial amount of money to cost of flying. On an electric planes, the engines last much longer (think 20k-30k hours), so this cost all but vanishes.
评论 #4772136 未加载
评论 #4771884 未加载
评论 #4771860 未加载
danielschonfeldover 12 years ago
As a Captain myself with over 5000 hours, I can say every single word of the linked blog is true and accurate with no exaggeration.<p>The thing thats astounding in all of this, is how both the FAA and the airlines sat for 5 years since they mandated age 65 and did absolutely nothing. Now, everybody is begging for forgiveness and leeway.
评论 #4771686 未加载
mc32over 12 years ago
I imagine the effect on Junior pilot salary by senior pilots[1] could have some influence on the attractiveness of the profession.<p>From what I've read, people have mentioned that senior pilots who have great influence on union decisions, take a somewhat expectedly selfish attitude when it comes to negotiating salaries whereby junior pilots are left holding the bag. This gets repeated by junior pilots when they become senior pilots.<p>[1]<a href="http://philip.greenspun.com/flying/unions-and-airlines" rel="nofollow">http://philip.greenspun.com/flying/unions-and-airlines</a>
评论 #4771618 未加载
Datonomicsover 12 years ago
Our wise leaders:<p>"Congress's 2010 vote to require 1,500 hours of experience in August 2013 came in the wake of several regional-airline accidents, although none had been due to pilots having fewer than 1,500 hours."
pinaceaeover 12 years ago
the era of pilots seated in the plane is coming to an end, as so often, the military (air force) leads the way. the f22/35 will be the last platform to deploy with cockpits.<p>air space all around the world is becoming open for drones. cargo planes will be the first to switch to drone operation. for the people pointing out that AI is not there yet - drones are piloted by humans on the ground. BUT: you can have multiple drones monitored by one person. only sticky situations need human attention. the flight time over the atlantic at 35000ft does not need humans on board, cause guess what, it is already being flown on auto.<p>think of the savings for DHL, UPS, FEDEX. no more pilots in the craft means more room (no cockpit, no life support, etc). pilots on the ground can follow different safety regulation for sleep periods. you can switch to <i>any</i> pilot during flight, not just the one in the plane. and liability is way cheaper, you can actually decide to crash the plane into the sea in case of a failure.<p>i would not invest in being a driver of any kind as a long term thing. trains, planes, automobiles - the writing is on the wall. subways already become automated, trains are next.
评论 #4771903 未加载
Spooky23over 12 years ago
Well, I suppose that after a decade or more of turning civil aviation into a awful career this was bound to happen. Airlines have successfully stripped pensions and frozen pilot wages for years.<p>At this point, a regional jet pilot is making less than a Starbucks barista or Apple Store salesman. ( <a href="http://blogs.wsj.com/middleseat/2009/06/16/pilot-pay-want-to-know-how-much-your-captain-earns/" rel="nofollow">http://blogs.wsj.com/middleseat/2009/06/16/pilot-pay-want-to...</a> )
评论 #4771842 未加载
saosebastiaoover 12 years ago
Shortages and surpluses only exist when prices are mismatched. Pay up.
评论 #4771857 未加载
评论 #4771858 未加载
juanjobegoover 12 years ago
Why are they so surprised? They've been kicking the pilot´s butts for years... "they are just drivers... my son plays better his gameboy... they don't deserve their salary..." But then, what about having to pay more than $100.000 for a title that only grants you a $1000 pay job? What about not having a single leave day when your family does? What about being so stressed that you can barely sleep? and if you are not stressed, what about long haul flights, where your sleep turns are so disturbed that you can't sleep back the way you should? Or having to be always fit to pass the medical? Or being observed and recorded on your activity to make you liable when you don't act as a robot? Would any surgeon accept it? And many other things. It is worth it for a while, but not forever. Do they thing pilost love to go the other side of the world to work for a Gulf Airline? Or a chinese? Nope. But then the salaries make it worth. When people loose their city connections, or when "inexplicable" accidents occur, then they will pay more for their tickets, and the balance will be back. Meanwhile, we still think that it makes sense "to pay more for the taxi to the airport than for an airline ticket to a town two hours away..." We got what we deserve.
malandrewover 12 years ago
Is there any chance that this shortage will prompt a more serious consideration of having planes take off and land totally via AI?
评论 #4771747 未加载
ernover 12 years ago
<i>Flying around in empty airspace or towing banners doesn't give you the training you need to fly a complex airplane.</i><p>I am no pilot, but two recent high profile crashes, the Colgan Air crash at Buffalo and Air France 447 were caused by pilots not handling stalls correctly.<p>Perhaps, there really <i>is</i> a need for more basic flying experience?
评论 #4772293 未加载
albumediaover 12 years ago
Yea right. They've been saying this for years.<p>How is this possible when there are so many qualified pilots looking for a job?
brownbatover 12 years ago
Here's to WSJ featuring labor shortage stories.
salemover 12 years ago
This sounds like a problem of the airlines own making, underpaying junior pilots for years.
marshallpover 12 years ago
Airplanes should be fully automated, they probably already have the technology to do this. They could start with cargo planes and then move to passenger once the public fears are quelled.
评论 #4771645 未加载
评论 #4771684 未加载