From reading the biographies of famous entrepreneurs (Gates, Ellison, Jobs, Woz, Clark) it seems like:<p>(<i>) those who marry in young 20s end up with divorce
(</i>) the successful marriage ends up one in the late 30s or early 40s<p>Can HN shed light on this? Do most entrepreneurs end up with this problem, or are these just especially high profile founders, and as a result, they needed balls of steel to bring the revolutions they did (thus probably resulting in slightly intolerable personalties).<p>Thanks!<p>[Curious about this myself via the whole: marriage or startup first question; marriage first results in the question of -- crap, I have responsibilities; startup first results in the issue of -- crap, gold diggers]
<i>startup first results in the issue of -- crap, gold diggers</i><p>This statement is funny. You seem to think you will make money of your first startup :)<p>For most people entering the startup world today... find a girl with a comfy couch that you can sleep on when you're broke.<p>In all seriousness, you need to assess where you really think you want to end up.<p>I got married fairly young. Started a couple of companies and have participated in many more. My wife is (mostly) understanding, and more importantly intelligent and a good reality check for most of my schemes and ideas. I couldn't imaging getting through some of the situations I've been in without having someone who is knowledgeable and unbiased to discuss these things with.<p>Figure out what you want to be when you grow up, and screen for a person who fits those criteria.
If you think of marriage as duty, responsibility, time commitment and compromise then it probably isn't compatible with doing a startup.<p>But if you and your spouse love each other for being motivated, self-actualized, driven, and passionate, then a startup and marriage can be wonderfully complimentary.<p>I actually really liked the movie Revolutionary Road for this reason -- it showed what happens when a guy who should be doing a startup ends up taking a safe job because he thinks it's what his marriage demands of him. In reality his wife was attracted to him because of his passion and his vision and she only came to loathe the soft, mushy, 9 to 5er that he became. Not a perfect parallel with the startup world but a great exploration of what it means to be "a man" outside of the narrow confines of man as simple uninspired breadwinner or corporate yes-man.<p>Bottom line: If your relationship thrives on the creative life-energy of passion, work and drive, then go for it. If not, why would you want to marry such a person?
My plan was to start a startup at 22 or 23 and cash out at 30 and then find that perfect woman and marry her then and not have to work much because I made my money and blah blah blah.<p>Guess what, I found the perfect girl a year before I started the startup life and she totally supports it. I'm not sure if I could have done what I do without leaning on her and vice versa.<p>It is about the right person, not the right time or order. You can't plan when or how you are going to meet the right person.
50% of all US marriages end in divorce. I would say it's partly the poor judgment of youth; mine wasn't so good. Maybe it has always been true, but now it is easier to get out. Romance is a pretty poor basis for a marriage. With mutual respect comes love and a more lasting relationship. Consider all the other qualities needed for success.<p>Starting companies is a huge commitment and raising children is an unbelievable stress load. The combination is a marriage killer.<p>With all that said, a good mate is a good thing to have.
I don't get why everyone pushes themselves so hard in a startup. I'm in a fairly profitable startup right now (my first one, never had a job), and I still have more time for my gf than she does for me.<p>If you have a good idea, solid team, you can execute on great ideas with 40-60 hrs a week. If you're spending more, you're not managing your resources properly.<p>I really appreciate my gf, she helps me relax and take my mind off of work, so that when I am working, I can be twice as productive.
If you're in the USA, and you're male, don't do it. In the US, she can leave you at any time and by default get the kids, house, child support, and alimony. For a variety of reasons, the deck is obscenely stacked against you.<p>Regarding the kids, you have no idea how much you'll love your kids when you have them. But if she decides to go, she won't care one bit about that.<p>And I know what you're thinking. You're thinking, "Ah, but you don't know <i>her</i>. <i>She's</i> different. She'd never do that." I'll tell you what: people change -- in unexpected ways. Especially after the kids come.<p>Do some research. Google for "dads", "divorce", "custody", etc.
Well thanks for the laugh, I needed that today.<p>Folks, finding the person you want to spend the rest of your life with - you know, the person that is going to stick around to wipe your... okay I'll say drool... when you are 80 and have Alzheimers - that is a much more unpredictable proposition than what you chose to do with your professional life. If you are trying to time the former to the latter, you are taking a big risk that the right person won't be around when you decide you are ready for them.<p>Date. If you are still dating after 1-2 years and like it, move in, or else break up and try again. If you are still living together and like it after 3 years get hitched, or break up and try again. By all means do not be hasty - but please do not overplan this.
Don't marry if you are a guy. At present, marriage is a contract with no upside for you. You gain nothing from marriage that you can't get from a committed non-marital relationship, and stand to lose a lot.
Attracting gold diggers is a problem of success.<p>More likely, you should be more concerned that doing your startup first and neglecting relationships means you will burn through your younger years (and younger looks) and won't be able to leverage them when it comes to finding a mate. Then, if your startup fails... oops, no leverage at all.
Lots of good comments here, many of them all true at the same time.<p>A marriage is a such a big commitment (10 times bigger if there are kids), that if there is something in your life more important than your marriage, it (probably) won't last.<p>Some people seem to make this kind of thing work, but I think it's quite rare.<p>My philosophy is that companies come and go (especially startups), but a loving family will last you a lifetime, and have a much bigger impact on your happiness and wellbeing than success and work.
From talking to a lot of married couples it seems as if marriage takes a lot of work and a lot of self-sacrifice. Perhaps the maturity of age has something to do with the successful marriages being those that where entered into later.
I think it has to do with the work load. When you are young, you pretty much focus 100% on your business and neglect your relationships...so you work 60-80 hours a week trying to get it off the ground and make something of yourself.<p>In your 30s/40s, you are already more or less successful and can have a lot more free time, so you can switch to the basic 9 to 5. And have time for family and kids.<p>As far as gold diggers etc, just stop showing off your wealth and you'll be fine. Even if you saw Steve Jobs or Bill Gates on the street, chances are you'd never think it was them. But put them in a Ferrari and you'll probably connect the dots. Worst case scenario, you can go James Bond on this issue. Have your mansion and the Ferrari in one town. And a rented apartment and a Honda in the next one.
When you look at the entire human population, you will see very different statistics for marriage and divorce. Now many people who marry young will get divorced (at least in the United States), but then so will many who wait until later in life to marry. Your sample there is too small to draw any meaningful conclusions.<p>As marriage relates to a startup or any entrepreneurship, the fact is that you only have so many hours in a day. Most spouses like their mate enough to want to spend some nontrivial amount of time with them. When this time commitment cannot be fulfilled due to wanting to the entrepreneur working insane hours in the basement or whatever else, it will put strain on that relationship. In short, having good personal relationships requires a major time commitment. Any startup or other entrepreneurial project also requires a significant time commitment. Depending on how these are managed or not, it can lead to a successful startup and failed relationship or vice versa. If you take greater care, then you can make both work but that won't be easy. After all, nothing worthwhile is particularly easy.
Whatever you do, when it comes to marriage, don't rush into it. Don't do it because it seems like the next logical step, don't do it because it brings a partner health benefits, don't do it because either family is pushing you.<p>You can take your time, give the r'ship loads of time to be tested (by travel, financial compromises, living together, sexual compatibility, etc) - if and when you do it, only do it for absolutely the right reasons.<p>It's harder to undo than it is to do.<p>(Personally: Married and divorced before 25. Now engaged to someone after 6-7 years together including living together for much of that, and travelling the world for 12 months.)
I used to believe that you could pick any two of the following three items:<p>1) A job you like and are good at
2) A body you like and take care of
3) A marriage & family you invest in and enjoy<p>I've found that you can have all three, but it requires a lot of flexibility, discipline, and willingness to say no to everything else (which is really just a manifestation of being disciplined).<p>I don't think marriage and a start-up are always mutually exclusive. In some cases they are, either due to the spouse or the start-up (or yourself, possibly), but if you're willing to be disciplined and set boundaries it's definitely possible.
I think the biggest problem is that both a marriage and a successful company require a lot of work. And when push comes to shove you sometimes have to let one suffer inorder to help the other.<p>The guys you mention above all fit into the work is their life mold where they throw themselves into what ever they were doing. This won't surprise anyone but that doesn't really endear yourself to your partner.<p>I know a very successful entrepreneur who has been married 4 times now. Each one of his wives couldn't stand coming second to work and I'll bet that each one went into the marriage thinking that this time it would be different, that they could change him.
If you get married, there's a good chance that your wife will want you to quit and get a stable job with reasonable hours. Even if she doesn't now, that's likely to change if you have children. It's also likely that her patience will wear thin eventually, especially if your first startup fails and you want to try another one.
frankly, i think its a commentary on marriage, not just entrepreneurial or techie marriages.<p>divorce rates are higher with younger couples. the younger, the higher.
I cannot find the statistic, but I am sure I read once that statistically marriages started between 23-27 have the lowest rates of divorce (if you only count first marriages, then I think the lowest rates come at a bit older age). Anyway, it's marrying before 23 that has the much, much higher rates of divorce. After that, I wouldn't worry about statistics.
Marriage increases your responsibilities and, consequently, reduces your risk tolerance. Maybe it wasn't a choice, just so happened that it was because of the higher risk tolerance that those unmarried individuals could be so risky.
OK, putting aside that this is clearly not the best place to ask for marriage advice...<p>Have you compared the "statistics" you gathered about (male) (hugely rich) founders marriage success ages to the general pool of marriages?<p>I'm pretty sure I read that more marriages <25 end up in divorce than >25.