>overpriced every other basic commodity of human existence.<p>I'm a starving grad student who lives a block from the mentioned, The Mill. I can't afford anything of quality traditionally associated with prosperity (car, house, family, etc.). But I can afford quality of the quotidian - headphones, breakfast, coffee, shoes, beer. And so I spend on those things instead - because there's no way I will ever be able to even afford a crappy car in this city.<p>And the quality <i>is</i> better in SF. It's true, there is always someone willing to sell you a $10x priced version of what you just bought if you want to be the sucker. But SF actually does a pretty good job at giving you what you pay for. You do pay a lot - but you get the best damned toast and coffee in the country. If you just wanted 'some toast and coffee' you should have gone across the street to Eddies - because that exists too.<p>The result is you get fantastic experimentation at the very cutting edge of <i>even</i> the quotidian. Not only does the bay area churn out Musks & Jobs', but we also churn out the Bakers & the Mas - who can make us the best bread and clothes the world has seen, at a price I can afford, blocks from my home. And such places exist because the community is willing to support them. The art of breadmaking has died in the rest of the country because of the race to the supermarkets' bottom. I think it's extraordinary that the SF population supports the common arts even at personal cost.<p>I think this particular (non-)problem is distinct from the expulsion of culture happening because of the commute/rent issues facing the city.
I'm Italian and I think I know something about good food: trust me, there are only exceptions in San Francisco. Most food is crap, or just average. And ALWAYS overpriced.<p>Take the "trendy" places: Flour + Water, Farina, Cocina, etc.
If you go there, you will hear Americans shouting "Sooo good! Delicious! Amazing! Soo tasty!", etc.<p>Reality is that if you take any random restaurant or trattoria in Rome, chances are you will eat something AMAZINGLY superior, for 1/3 or 1/4 of the cost.
(then there are some tourist traps, and they don't count, of course. They're just a scam).<p>My 0.02.
Just because you can buy a $6 breakfast (consisting of a cup of coffee and a slice of toast and jam), $300 jeans or $200 yoga pants in SF doesn't mean you have to. For every The Mill, Blue Bottle, LuluLemon or whatever hip-jeans store there is in SF, there's a McDonald's, Denny's, Marshall's, Burlington Coat Factory and Payless Shoes counterpart (and god knows how many pop-up import shops). That's the great thing about SF -- you can spend as much or as little as you like on material goods.<p>The rent situation is, of course, out of hand, but that's mainly a supply constraint problem that's not easily solved due to our unique brand of NIMBYism.
I submitted the following article yesterday:<p><a href="http://www.salon.com/1999/10/28/internet_2/" rel="nofollow">http://www.salon.com/1999/10/28/internet_2/</a><p>It's basically the same thing, except from 1999. The more things change...
This one really confused me: "Rarely are these goods and services truly accessible and affordable."<p>What do goods/services aimed at wealthier segments of the population have to do with accessibility and affordability?<p>I presently cannot afford a Ferrari, should I be up in arms about the lack of affordability/accessibility to the said Ferrari?<p>If we are talking housing, one could make a case for the need for affordability/some form of social protection. Although, I'm not entirely sold that people have a "right" to live in a prestigious neighborhood that they cannot afford, but when an entire city gets priced out, it's much easier to argue.
Newsflash, large cities have luxury stores that sell fancy things for lots of money. You'll find all the the examples also exist in any other large city.
Well that's sure not what I thought it was going to be.<p>Also, most of the these illustrations are just bad:<p>> Someone creates a business for consumers with too much money... like black-car, chauffeured rides.<p>Regardless of what you think of Uber as a company, it's a great idea, and there's not really anything luxurious about it. It costs a little more than a taxi and is definitely on par with other car services. When I'm in LA, I use it all the time. Beats having me drive around between clubs, right? What I use it to get to is much more pretentious that the car itself.<p>> See: Blue Bottle coffee.<p>Does the author know anything about coffee? The real stuff is going to be expensive.<p>> bourgie businesses...buzzwords like “organic” and “fair trade” and “artisanal,”<p>These things have specific meanings. This statement smacks of anti-intellectualism (and coming from right-wing me, that sounds a little funny.) Are you really going hate on fair trade? How can you begin rationalize that with *bourgie"?
Overpriced food and other "staple" items is a reality everywhere, not just SF.<p>For instance, for $4 you can get a regular cookie ($1.99) and fountain drink ($1.90) at multiple midwestern city locations of Panera. I pay more at my locally-owned coffee shops, but the cookies are bigger and hand-made.<p>Another example is a lunch meal I've grabbed on occasion since 2000 at a local cafe in mid-sized midwestern city. Back in the day, it was $4.25. It's now $6.75. Same food, same portion size, higher price.<p>The problem is two-fold. On one hand, inflation and costs are driving up costs. On the other, everyone wants to be seen as "upscale" and--in proving PT Barnum correct--will pay dearly for that appearance.
I recently moved from New York to Philadelphia. There is a lot less money here, especially at the top end. New York County (Manhattan) has a per capita income of $59k, versus $21k for Philadelphia County. In a way, it's kind of refreshing. Much less glam, more "well-maintained 1980's construction." Nobody walking down the streets with $200 yoga pants, and I don't even know what would be the equivalent here of 5th Ave. in NYC or Michigan Ave. in Chicago. And even if there was something equivalent, I don't know who would go there. New York has bankers, Chicago has traders, San Francisco has internet millionaires and VCs, but Philadelphia is missing that large class of high-spending "working rich."
I just ate at Kronenburger for the first time. I JUST moved here from Chicago. We were a party of four, all got burgers and a bunch of starters. Total cost: $60. This would have easily been upwards of 80-100 at Kuma's in Chicago.<p>It really depends on where you go. I've found that overall, dining out is much cheaper here. I just got lunch the other day at St. Francis Fountain. With drinks, the total cost was about $20. Something similar, like going to say the White Palace or 11 City Diner downtown in Chicago would have easily cost double that.<p>Maybe this guy has never lived anywhere but here in SF, but dining out here seems much cheaper.<p>EDIT: The burger at Kronenburger was awesome too.
<i>So why do we pay more when we can’t tell the difference?</i><p>To answer this one must realize the true nature of these services. Their main product isn't in physical goods such as food or clothing. Rather, it's a psychological product. Customers are paying for the affirmation that their tastes are superior. For that they are more than willing to pay extra. Expensive toast is really a psychological indulgence rather than a culinary one.
I've lived in the SFBA for nearly my whole life and for as long as I can remember SF has been kind of pretentious with food, even before the recent tech boom. My non-tech worker friends who are long time residents are into it, but my tech worker friends who moved here for jobs are not. So I don't think the food thing has anything to do with the tech industry.<p>The astronomical rent is a different matter, of course...
This article is so based in false premises its hard to know where to start. For 1) San Francisco has the highest minimum wage in the country. 2) California has an high sales tax with a base of 7% and 8.75% in "the city". She also choose a trendy place for her $6 dollar breakfast that and taxes are a large reason for the amount.<p>I think what everyone really notices is the exorbitant rent prices in "the city". The reason for that is rent control and subsidized housing which artificially lowers the supply of housing thus raising prices. I am techie living in a crappy part of SF in a crappy building since I don't want to pay half my salary in rent. Across from me is a Mercy housing complex with an income limit of 30k. They enjoy large rooms, views and cheaper rent than me but no blames pricing on that. Its all the techies fault for bringing income and demand to "the city".
I read a lot of articles on HN nowadays that are part of what I think of as "SF exceptionalism" -- articles around the idea that things in SF are somehow very different than in other places. Even when couched in the form of a complaint, as this article is, it's hard not to think that what the author is actually doing is showing off about how rich their city is -- look, toast and coffee here costs $6!<p>I've lived in the Bay Area a long time and this sort of attitude puzzles me. There are plenty of rich areas up and down the Valley, and many places where a $6 breakfast is not something to write an article about. But yes, because it happens in SF it must be special.
I go to Burger King on market and 10th and get a $3 burger. You could spend $10 at Super-Duper or whatever, or you could go a block down to McDondald's at the Montgomery station exit and buy something from their dollar menu.
What makes young wealthy tech people "overprivileged"? Where does the "over" come from? By what measure do they have "too much" money?
I don't think it is really related to tech, I'm in Dubai where we have no tech, and we pay even more in many places for food/coffee and even clothes.
probably its more like a cultural/human nature thing?<p><a href="http://www.raptitude.com/2010/07/your-lifestyle-has-already-been-designed/" rel="nofollow">http://www.raptitude.com/2010/07/your-lifestyle-has-already-...</a>
Coincidentally Blue Bottle started selling $!50 pajamas today...<p><a href="http://www.bluebottlecoffee.com/products/pajamas" rel="nofollow">http://www.bluebottlecoffee.com/products/pajamas</a>
The tech industry ruined SF in the late 90s. Live/work spaces and the attraction of the Mission to .commers ruined SF. I don't think anything happening now is making it any worse.
Honestly, I would find a better place to work and live. When you live paycheck to paycheck with a good salary, you're going to become tired very soon.
All I know is that I want some of that Tech density to spread out to Texas. Texas right now is probably one of (if not THE) top states to start/grow a business in. If you're in SF and you're young (and/or willing) come over to Texas and get rich over the next 10 years, then go live wherever you want with your future partner and kids. ;)
geez. waaaaaay back in 2007 i remember la boulange on fillmore (about 4 blocks from "the mill", apparently) did a croissant and a coffee for less than 3 bucks... i used to go there in the mornings with spare change i found around my place from the night before.