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Burglars Who Took on F.B.I. Abandon Shadows

429 pointsby philipnover 11 years ago

13 comments

selmnooover 11 years ago
<p><pre><code> Among the grim litany of revelations was a blackmail letter F.B.I. agents had sent anonymously to the Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., threatening to expose his extramarital affairs if he did not commit suicide. </code></pre> Hoooooly shit. Wow. They actually did that.
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suprgeekover 11 years ago
It is hard to conceive of the risk faced by these folks in order to carry out what was in effect an act of civil disobedience -for no personal gain.<p>Bravo!<p>Unfortunately it looks like such courageous folks are the last remaining defense against absolute tyranny in the United States. One wonders how many such actions are even possible with the advent of the global surveillance state?
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hooandeover 11 years ago
What strikes me is how little was gained by both sides in this, and how futile their actions seem in hindsight.<p>History probably would have ended up in a similar way if Hoover had not devoted so many resources to spying on Viet Nam protestors and counter culture revolutionaries. He was really pursuing his lifelong obsession with communism, which was another political movement that probably would have died without so much government surveillance. His spying didn&#x27;t do anything to dissuade Martin Luther King or other members of the Civil Rights movement. All that effort and violation of privacy for a difficult to discern impact on history.<p>Stealing and publishing documents from the FBI didn&#x27;t seem to have much of an impact either. There was a temporary public outcry, some commissions were established and the whole thing was forgotten in less than a decade. We just wound up in the same situation 40 years later and will most likely end up with the same results. It takes a mountain of courage to steal from the freaking FBI, and that group of people deserve credit for standing up for what they believed in. If only their risk produced a more appreciable reward for society.<p>I fear a never ending cycle of surveillance and protest. Chicken and the egg. The stakes seem higher now, on both sides, but there are no guarantees that we won&#x27;t go through the whole process again to achieve the same non-result. We need to figure out how to use the political process instead of theft to stop our government agencies from doing things that we don&#x27;t like. Or else we&#x27;ll be reading this same story again decades from now.
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ck2over 11 years ago
If the government was scary powerful then, it is terrifying now.<p>If you&#x27;ve ever protested anything in the USA, regardless if on the left or right, you can almost certainly count on your name on some kind of tracking, and they&#x27;ve given themselves legal permission, because they don&#x27;t have to look at the data in real-time anymore. They can just store it and look at it later on demand if they want with frictionless warrants from courts with no lawyer &quot;for the people&quot; present.<p>If the government feels you&#x27;ve become an annoyance they can just pop you on a no-fly list without court review and no-way to get off. And heaven help you if you go near a border if they&#x27;ve peaked their interest in you, all your data is theirs without any need for warrant or even a reason.<p>The government has also learned the secret that if they want to control the message, they just have to limit media exposure. Release news late on a Friday and it will be gone by Monday. Control court trials to the point where there is no audio or video and TV news will almost certainly not cover it. They are getting incredibly good at this.<p>The newest corruption since 9&#x2F;11 is to insist they need super powers for anti-terrorism, then use them against average criminals. Even worse, if no real criminals can be found, manufacturer one by constantly harassing some dupe until they do something half-assed and then roll them out for the cameras to justify the insane budgets and overeaching powers.
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tokenadultover 11 years ago
I see most of the interesting comments here so far are from a strictly American perspective, that is just commenting on what was happening in the United States then or is happening in the United States now. But of course there is more than one country in the world. In another place I have lived[1] a supposedly democratic government that in fact was a dictatorship engaged in comprehensive spying on all civil society organizations--not just the organizations that were formally opposition organizations--and stifled all mass media organizations with censorship. That didn&#x27;t stop a people-power democracy movement from starting and succeeding in democratizing that country. I&#x27;ve advised Hacker News participants before[2] that people power democracy movements to overthrow dictatorships with comprehensive surveillance programs are not easy, but they can succeed. You and I need mental toughness, persistence, and courage to be part of the solution, but what better reward for those virtues is there than expanded freedom (and the dignity of knowing you did the right thing)? Don&#x27;t give up. Keep on organizing to gain freedom and protect civil rights.<p>[1] <a href="https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5985720" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=5985720</a><p>[2] <a href="https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6336795" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=6336795</a>
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juntoover 11 years ago
I wouldn&#x27;t put it past the current government to try and push through a new bill so that they could remove the statute of limitations in cases like this where &quot;national security was compromised&quot;, so that they can now still prosecute the &quot;traitors&quot;.<p>I also wouldn&#x27;t put it past the current government to use that new power to then posthumously prosecute Mr. Davidon who &quot;died late last year from complications of Parkinson’s disease&quot;.<p>Call me cynical, but nothing that USG does to further &quot;protect&quot; its &quot;national security&quot; would surprise me anymore.
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joshfraserover 11 years ago
It&#x27;s interesting how history repeats itself. This is the story of how we ended up with the FISA court. The lesson for us is that need to be careful that whatever reforms we make to fix the NSA won&#x27;t be used in even worse ways in the future.
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pedalpeteover 11 years ago
I&#x27;m surprised that this hasn&#x27;t been referred to regularly throughout the whole current NSA revelations. Or have I just missed it.<p>Really looking forward to reading the book.
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forgotAgainover 11 years ago
Interesting that, if done today, analysis of a few months worth of meta-data would show exactly who they were.<p>Edit: Also interesting that today they would be called home grown terrorists instead of anti-war activists.
oinksoftover 11 years ago
By taking no credit, they ensured the story would be about the documents and not the burglars.
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Taekover 11 years ago
As I read more about this, I wonder if there has yet been a powerful intel (or otherwise secret) government organization that hasn&#x27;t abused its power in some major way. Without organizations that can keep secrets, you lose a lot of options (such as undercover operations, and surprise nuclear defence systems), but I wonder if you can&#x27;t draw parallels to open source.<p>When your government is &quot;closed source&quot;, the risks are higher as there are less checks and balances. But maybe, like many open source efforts, keeping the government entirely transparent would increase efficiency enough to make up for the types of operations that you can no longer undertake.
pistleover 11 years ago
Organized civil disobedience was ineffective.
strathmeyerover 11 years ago
Am I the only one who gets an auto-play video and then an uncloseable popup that prevents me from pausing or muting it??
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