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Coursera blocks access to students in Cuba, Iran, Sudan and Syria

359 pointsby zactralover 11 years ago

50 comments

smnrchrdsover 11 years ago
As someone who lives in Iran, this is sad but not news. I have gotten used to see half the websites blocked by my government(Facebook, YouTube, Flickr, WordPress, etc) and the other half by your government(Java SE or anything else from Oracle, Google Code, Google Play Store, anything from Xilinx, etc).<p>If one of my favorite websites was blocked, I may have considered not using it anymore. When virtually all websites are blocked, I can either not use the internet or find a way around it. Of course I chose the second option. Most Iranians have been using proxies and VPNs for the past few years. This blockage would not affect us much.<p>P.S. Please stop using Google Code. Edit: Also App Engine. Udacity has been inaccessible to Iranians since the beginning because they use App Engine for hosting. This is what I get when I try to access Udacity: <a href="http://i.imgur.com/zUecPHk.png" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;i.imgur.com&#x2F;zUecPHk.png</a><p>P.P.S. I am curious what percentage of the internet is blocked in Iran. When you try to access a blocked website, the censorship system shows a page explaining that the website is blocked and some links to Iranian websites. Is it possible to write a script to scan all the internet (or at least the popular websites) and determine which ones are blocked? Here is what I get when I try to access YouTube: <a href="http://git.io/HG3nsQ" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;git.io&#x2F;HG3nsQ</a><p>I have two questions:<p>1. Where can I find a list of all domain names, top 1000, top 100000?<p>2. Is it possible to conclusively determine censorship from headers only or do I have to load the whole page and compare HTML code with a sample? Bandwidth is very expensive here.
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reuvenover 11 years ago
The problem here is that Coursera is a for-profit company. If they were an educational non-profit, my guess is that they could find a way to somehow work with individual citizens of these countries. But the sanctions are in place to stop US companies from doing business with these countries, and it probably never occurred to anyone that a for-profit company, in the US, would want to educate people in Iran.<p>Thus, this seems less a case of the US trying to stop citizens of Cuba, Iran, Sudan, and Syria from being educated, and more a case of the law not keeping up with the times.<p>It would be nice if the US Justice Department, or whoever is in charge of enforcing such sanctions, could give a clear waiver to education-related companies. I doubt that this will happen, though.
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rikacometover 11 years ago
This is ridiculous! What is the use of being the premier institute in the world, and do just about nothing about such a obvious immorality!?<p>The kids in these countries are already suffering under oppression&#x2F;war&#x2F;famine&#x2F; you name it.. things you won&#x27;t want upon yourself, much less on your kids.I know a guy who plays a rpg with me who is from Syria, he is 14 year old, and his school is defunct. Just few months back I recommended him Coursera and EdX.. and now this..? This is shit!<p>Whats next? Edx, Khan Academy follow course!?<p>This is almost like that rule that was imposed back in 2003-2007 era.. when all rpg players with name Osama&#x2F;Usama were banned, or forced to change their usernames. People who had their legimate natural name as Osama&#x2F;Usama way before 9&#x2F;11.<p>Talk about overkill!
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c7b0rgover 11 years ago
The US regime never ceases to amaze me.<p>Power projection at all levels of an ordinary human&#x27;s life, from privacy to education.<p>I&#x27;m dumbfounded they are self proclaimed defenders of freedom. How can such cognitive dissonance run rampant within the US.
johnhessover 11 years ago
What&#x27;s really chilling about this is:<p>&gt;Federal regulations prohibit U.S. businesses from offering services to countries subject to economic sanctions -- a list that includes Cuba, Iran, Syria and Sudan<p>On this message board, I can imagine that &quot;U.S. businesses&quot; includes a substantial number of us. You&#x27;re all blocking those IPs, right?<p>The State Dept. set a dangerous precedent when it didn&#x27;t immediately respond to edX and Coursera with an &quot;Of course a web application filled with educational content doesn&#x27;t constitute doing business with the enemy.&quot;<p>It leaves those of us without a legal team in a real pinch.
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rdlover 11 years ago
It would be nice if there were a safe harbor for open source&#x2F;educational&#x2F;non-dual-use materials even to individuals in a sanction-restricted regime.<p>I doubt the Government of Cuba (the true target of the sanctions) would get material benefit from free courses for their populace. Certainly only the most indirect and limited military benefit.<p>Unfortunately, as far as I&#x27;m aware, the treasury and state restrictions aren&#x27;t so specific. IANAL though, particularly not an export-compliance lawyer.
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mavdiover 11 years ago
As an Iranian I can&#x27;t really blame them. They are forced to comply with the law, and unfortunately the law is very broad. Can&#x27;t really blame the US government for this sort of blanket ban either because exceptions to laws create loopholes. It won&#x27;t take long until people find ways to ship missile chips as educational material.<p>Maybe if our government didn&#x27;t threaten other nations with annihilation, this sort of shit wouldn&#x27;t happen to us. Who knows.
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primitivesuaveover 11 years ago
&quot;Mr. Secretary, how can we show these democracy-haters that we mean business?&quot;<p>&quot;I&#x27;ve got it! Let&#x27;s go after the studious ones by blocking their access to online education! Let&#x27;s force them to overload their VPNs and proxy servers while chasing their aspirations to improve the social and political climate in their countries of origin! That&#x27;ll show them.&quot;
sdfjklover 11 years ago
This export rule nonsense can be bypassed, as demonstrated successfully by Phil Zimmerman[1], who ended up getting crypto legislation changed. Also in a similar case about European laws that prohibited bypassing DRM, the developers of CloneCD moved their development to Antigua[2] (and named the new company Slysoft).<p>Coursera, please investigate such avenues of bypassing this nonsense.<p>[1] <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pretty_Good_Privacy#Criminal_investigation" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Pretty_Good_Privacy#Criminal_in...</a> [2] <a href="http://www.myce.com/news/Elby-announces-that-CloneCD-emigrates-to-Antigua-6639/" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.myce.com&#x2F;news&#x2F;Elby-announces-that-CloneCD-emigrat...</a>
ad93611over 11 years ago
Interesting that coursera mentions that they only have a IP address block. It seems like they just want people to workaround that and access the courses.
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bambaxover 11 years ago
&gt; <i>Why has this not been an issue in the past?</i><p>&gt; <i>Until now the interpretation of export control regulations as they relate to MOOCs has been unclear and Coursera has been operating under the interpretation that MOOCs would not be restricted. We recently received information that has led to the understanding that the services offered on Coursera are not in compliance with the law as it stands. Accordingly we have instituted a restriction...</i><p>I don&#x27;t understand such a proactive respect of the law. Why don&#x27;t they wait to get sued instead?<p>Laws are not always meant to be respected; they&#x27;re meant to be broken and challenged in court.
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acdover 11 years ago
Personally I do not understand the hard grudge against Cuba. My girl friend met a car mechanic from Cuba temporarily living our country who really struggled to make a living and trying to ship home some money for their family. Yes communism is shit bad, that doesn&#x27;t mean we should shield them from our culture and knowledge. I think opening up our culture to these countries as much as possible makes for the maximum possibility of influencing the local people to want change.<p>The other countries on that list I&#x27;m more skeptical too especially when they are not fully peaceful as knowledge can be miss used.
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kriroover 11 years ago
Call me naive but I always assumed access to more information and education was a strong driving force towards less oppression and more freedom.<p>I guess US brass disagrees and would rather put a nice &quot;rogue&quot; label on things and replace governments with worse governments over and over instead of supporting generic change that comes from the people.
samstaveover 11 years ago
Coursera should <i></i><i>ONLY</i><i></i> allow access to IPs from .GOV -- Clearly these are the most desperately in need of an education.
shervinrsover 11 years ago
In Iran there are restrictions on downloading articles from IEEE and ACM databases, not that we cannot access them, but our universities cannot renew their subscriptions. But there are always some ways to get what you need. It won&#x27;t be different for Coursera. But it&#x27;s not fair, because facebook, youtube, gmail and services like these are always available, and in here people are very good at hating US for making these differences.
kfkover 11 years ago
A startup in Europe should create a free proxy to use Coursera for these guys living in those unfortunate countries. Berlin, London, Munich, etc. anything?
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level09over 11 years ago
This should be followed by a speech from a US official bragging about internet freedom and equal access to knowledge.<p>Seriously, instead of starting projects like Google Proxy (to help people in these countries bypass their government blocking), it would be better to start a project that actually helps changing those ridiculous US laws.<p>Maybe offer some educational courses to those officials behind these laws.
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f_salmonover 11 years ago
If first World countries can do 1 evil, it&#x27;s suppressing&#x2F;eliminating education for the oppressed and&#x2F;or poor. (So they have no chance for future equality and can continue to be dominated by us.)
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mukundmrover 11 years ago
There is a petition going on to stop these kinds of blocks. You should vote for the petition if you want a change.<p><a href="https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/reverse-policy-which-prohibits-massive-open-online-courses-moocs-including-students-sanctioned/dkpm2cyM" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;petitions.whitehouse.gov&#x2F;petition&#x2F;reverse-policy-whi...</a>
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atmosxover 11 years ago
&gt; How is Coursera identifying students in sanctioned countries?<p>&quot;Coursera has implemented an IP address block that prevents users in sanctioned countries from logging into a Coursera account. When attempting to sign in, these users will see a message explaining that we cannot allow them to access the site due to U.S. export control restrictions. In rare instances, students with IP addresses bordering on but not geopolitically within the bounds of these countries will be affected. Our engineers are working to mitigate this issue while pursuing a broader solution to the restrictions.&quot;<p>Translation, the USA gov is acting kinda stupid, we can&#x27;t help it. Use a proxy and you&#x27;re fine.<p>NOTE: A link to TOR would be nice :-)
thornover 11 years ago
This is very sad news. Restricting education access for some people looks like very bad move for whole MOOC community. I wonder what made them to do that? Would Coursera be sanctioned or even close otherwise?<p>I wonder what is the process how those restriction are being applied to the company and what are the consequences if you not follow this (law)?
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lispmover 11 years ago
Cuba? About time to get rid of the sanctions.
camus2over 11 years ago
the land of free enterprise, hey ?
pjmlpover 11 years ago
Such attitudes only increase the hate from the affected countries towards US.
impeachgodover 11 years ago
Someone should create a Coursera clone that&#x27;s not hosted in the US.
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k-mcgradyover 11 years ago
What a stupid thing to do. I&#x27;m hoping (but not holding my breath) that the USG will change the export laws to accommodate businesses like Coursera. I don&#x27;t really agree with the US export bans at all but banning an educational service just seems really dumb. If you want people in a country to agree with your ideals what better way than to allow them to access educational resources for free!
Grue3over 11 years ago
It&#x27;s like it&#x27;s the first time some of you hear about these sanctions. Shows how much you cared about these countries until now.
au_dudeover 11 years ago
Don&#x27;t live in any of those countries (Australia) but Coursera should take a very hard look at themselves. I have a few friends from those countries and they are great scientists&#x2F;engineers cause they recognize that through education and improving learning standards the world could truly be their oyster. Thanks for taking it away.
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blackRustover 11 years ago
Why doesn&#x27;t Coursera do what corporations that export far more dangerous goods than education do: Have a subsidiary in another country where export restrictions permit you to work with Cuba, Iran, Syria and Sudan.<p>To not try to counteract this political manipulation is almost more outrageous than the political manipulation itself.
shashikiranover 11 years ago
Thought Experiment:<p>Imagine a large cohort of reasonable, well intentioned, creative, knowledgeable and empowered people came together and asked each other this question:<p>How can we as Homo sapiens, organize society, design and deploy systems, create technologies that allow us to live and pursue the lives that we want on a day to day basis.<p>More urgently, how can we as well save ourselves from eventual but certain destruction, in the event that we are too complacent to venture outside planet earth, remaining fragile to cosmological scale events that other evolved animals couldn&#x27;t survive?<p>--<p>Run a 1000 simulations in 2014 January, include whoever you think is smarter than you or Obama - say Gates, Page, Musk, Zuckerberg, Jobs - Snowden, Theil, Kurzweil, Hawking, Dawkins or anyone who you think is competent.<p>Solution: First - Invent the Nation State. Create ~200 Nations of random sizes, resources, people, but create a bureaucratic institution that nobody takes seriously called the UN. All nations will be treated equally. Then create armies, spend billions on mutually assured destruction. Create a fake crime called &#x27;sedition&#x27;, create concepts of espionage. Use the nation state to justify everything, like a modern religion. Inspire democides and dictatorships. Prevent access and create isolation. Prevent Spotify from running anywhere, make ibooks store in most countrues have only titles without book covers from the victorian era &#x27;because they are in public domain&#x27;. Have people blocked or restricted access to BBC because they are not in britain so they can&#x27;t appreciate a neuroscience documentary. Create visas and passports and foreign embassies and diplomatic immunities. Restrict movement on land air water and radio waves or optic fibres. Have people do paperwork to see Niagra falls or prove their nationality before they are allowed to apply for a ONLINEprogram...<p>Then finally restrict and kill access to knowledge, with NO paywalls.<p>Can someone please tell me if they think this solution would show up?<p>Common, we have to recognize that the best invention since the wheel was not a stupid technology like the nation-state. Even if it was, this is ample proof that we&#x27;ve lived with it to a point where it&#x27;s maladaptive. I hope we can see the writing on the wall and convince ourselves that we need to dissolve and bury this human invention, like most religions.<p>Our survival is literally at hand.
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myzeroxover 11 years ago
This is the worst possible measure to deal with those sanctioned countries.<p>As we&#x27;ve seen in the Arab Spring or currently in Ukraine, extremist regimes have to replaced by bottom-up grassroot movements, by the will of the people.<p>Having said that, what could be a stronger weapon than access to education?
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level09over 11 years ago
<a href="http://www.change.org/petitions/united-states-government-lift-some-of-the-sanctions-on-syria-that-are-affecting-the-people" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.change.org&#x2F;petitions&#x2F;united-states-government-lif...</a>
droopybunsover 11 years ago
&quot;The Department of State and Coursera are aligned in our goals and we are working tirelessly to ensure that blockage is not permanent.&quot;<p>Tirelessly: indefatigably: with indefatigable energy; &quot;she watched the show indefatigably&quot; <a href="http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=tirelessly" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;wordnetweb.princeton.edu&#x2F;perl&#x2F;webwn?s=tirelessly</a> Two thoughts:<p>1) Does anyone really think that the word &quot;tirelessly&quot; can honestly be applied to any work done by the state department?<p>2) Tirelessly is one of those weasly pr words that I am promising never to use again. Usually when a business says they are &quot;working tirelessly,&quot; it turns out that the real meaning is &quot;We want you to feel like we&#x27;re working towards a solution, but this is pretty much out of our control.&quot;
znowiover 11 years ago
Apart from the usual VPN advice for those affected, I&#x27;d like to suggest a EU based competitor to Coursera - <a href="https://iversity.org/" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;iversity.org&#x2F;</a>
linuxhanslover 11 years ago
Yeah, that&#x27;s smart. The best tool against poverty and violence is education. By enforcing export restrictions on this (and other things like software) the US is doing itself a disfavor.
Anevenuaover 11 years ago
KNOWLEDGE DOESN´T MEAN PRIVACY... what da hack with U.S ?? Politics plays laws, Knowledge plays proudly.<p>There´s too many ppl in America from those conuntries, so... they will feel it too.
xamdamover 11 years ago
Blocking educational content from countries which we would like to improve relations with seems like a terribly dumb idea. There are not even sales involved here - WTF.
alexeisadeski3over 11 years ago
We mere vassals are happy to obey your wishes, m&#x27;lord.
strictfpover 11 years ago
Why block the whole site? The notice mentions that some activity falls under export restriction. Why then block every course?
mathattackover 11 years ago
This seems counterproductive. Access to western educational services should advance our causes there, not harm them.
sazaryover 11 years ago
as an iranian, i dont give a damn. i already route all of my traffic to my vps in US, so i can access everything that is blocked to me either by iranian or american government. but this kind of sanctions, just like financial sanctions on iran, increases the hatred of americans in iran, and shows their hypocrisy.
guard-of-terraover 11 years ago
&quot;All students from Syria&quot; Both in loyalist and insurgent areas?<p>That&#x27;s a Solomon solution, I have to admit.
linux_devilover 11 years ago
I don&#x27;t understand the fault of students here. Are we still living in 90&#x27;s?<p>Udacity can be a good alternative.
masterkainover 11 years ago
dark times
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maccoover 11 years ago
This is sad and not very clever. If you want to destroy this regimes: educate the people. Period.
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zukunftsalickover 11 years ago
Coursera could suggest (and eventually subsidize) non-US VPN services for those students.
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donniezazenover 11 years ago
This will not only fail but both antagonize and radicalize youth in those countries.
nichocharover 11 years ago
I find this simply shocking.
voluneover 11 years ago
God forbid someone in Sudan gets an education.
clamprechtover 11 years ago
What if my proxy server is in Cuba?