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International Lisp Conference 2014 Summary

75 pointsby pietrofmaggiover 10 years ago

3 comments

sramsayover 10 years ago
&quot;CL went through a spike of interest in the mid-2000s; where did those people go . . .&quot;<p>I don&#x27;t know about others, but I was part of that spike and I went . . . far away from Common Lisp.<p>Learning Lisp absolutely blew my mind. I felt like every page of Peter Siebel&#x27;s <i>Practical Common Lisp</i> was some new kind of glorious revelation. I was going to write everything in Common Lisp.<p>I did write some fairly serious things in CL, but in the end, it came down to what felt like a broken, barely documented, half-assed ecosystem for doing most of the things that ordinary working programmers want to do.<p>I realize that sounds harsh and unfair (though I&#x27;m hardly the first person to put it in those terms), but the problem is relative. It&#x27;s not a total disaster as such, but if you&#x27;re used to the ecosystems of languages like Java, Python, Ruby, PHP, Javascript -- almost anything else (including, in recent years, Haskell) -- you&#x27;ll probably find yourself frustrated with CL. I did, anyway.<p>So what did I do? I abandoned CL and took my knowledge over to languages like JavaScript (cum Underscore) and Clojure.<p>The OP ends that quote above by asking &quot;What can we learn from that?&quot; I don&#x27;t know. I don&#x27;t know how a group of brilliant programmers working in one of the most brilliant languages of all time end up turning enthusiastic newbs into people who feel frustrated and disappointed. But I&#x27;ll say it: It for damn sure ain&#x27;t the language or the skills of the people who work with it.
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eudoxover 10 years ago
The reason I have stuck with Common Lisp, rather than bailed to Clojure or something else, is that the language is so fundamentally good -- Mature, robust, standarized, performant, compiled, gradually-typed -- that it is worth sticking with it, it is worth working to expand its ecosystem.<p>Regarding the ecosystem, Common Lisp has improved a lot over the recent years. We have Clack (Equiv. of Python&#x27;s WSGI&#x2F;Ruby&#x27;s Rack), a bunch of web frameworks, an ORM, a small set of web-related tools built around those. It&#x27;s certainly nowhere near the size of the ecosystems of Ruby and Python, but I think it&#x27;s acceptable given the size of the community.<p>I do, however, think there has to be a movement like Fare&#x27;s &quot;Lisp library consolidation&quot;[0] to, if not expand, improve the existing libraries: Build Github Project Pages, Sphinx documentation, a better-looking wiki. Just porting old READMEs to Markdown would be an improvement.<p>[0]: <a href="http://fare.livejournal.com/169346.html" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;fare.livejournal.com&#x2F;169346.html</a>
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malvoseniorover 10 years ago
I was looking up some info on hash tables in Scheme the other day and came across this insightful HN comment:<p><a href="https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=531079" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=531079</a><p>I imagine the same applies to CL.<p>I personally use and love Clojure, but wish it compiled to native code.
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