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Famo.us pivots, fires 20 employees

176 点作者 thepoet超过 9 年前

39 条评论

dmvaldman超过 9 年前
Hey all. I was the second engineer at famo.us and was later chief architect. I have many stories, but I won&#x27;t go into any of them :-)<p>If you were interested in the library and are sad that this pivot means it won&#x27;t be supported, I want to mention there is ongoing work in the OSS community outside the company supporting the pre-pivot vision.<p>I&#x27;ve personally been working on a fork called samsaraJS (<a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;samsaraJS.org" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;samsaraJS.org</a>), and there is another community effort at infamous.io.<p>These are both early stage labors of love, and always looking for contributors!
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duiker101超过 9 年前
I am quite baffled by all this. I heard of Famo.us, but didn&#x27;t give it more than 1 thought. I thought it was just another framework, I would have never thought that they had employees, let alone that many and raising that much money.<p>I watched the video in the article, and I can&#x27;t believe that people are throwing money at someone with a pitch like that.<p>I feel like everything about Famo.us is all the wrong things that were described in the Reconsider article that was posted the other day <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;medium.com&#x2F;@dhh&#x2F;reconsider-41adf356857f" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;medium.com&#x2F;@dhh&#x2F;reconsider-41adf356857f</a>
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n7c3c1超过 9 年前
I will never understand how startups like this get money with such incompetent leadership.<p>Look at how this Famo.us office tour showcases the waste: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=imc1p_laIt4" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=imc1p_laIt4</a>
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ndesaulniers超过 9 年前
&gt; Open Source ≠ Business<p>&gt; Newcomb himself admits it was a “divergent brainstorming process,” saying “We tried everything…we tried everything so we could create a business model around open source. And at the end of the day, we just couldn’t do it.”<p>What a load of shit. This has nothing to do with open source.<p>It&#x27;s more like people don&#x27;t want to pay for another JavaScript framework that claims to be better than the current web stack which at the end of the day, ends up reimplementing most features a web browser already has, but in WebGL. In the article, Steve even admits &quot;We built a shitty game engine&quot;.<p>Recently, there were a few other attempts at reimplementing most of the web in WebGL, I think Flipboard had an article.<p>Let me point out, this is hard. You wind up with some of the features HTML&#x2F;CSS already has that&#x27;s faster, but a ton of missing stuff you end up needing at some point.<p>For example in WebGL, layout is non trivial, rendering text correctly is non trivial, events are non trivial. These things are an afterthought when working with HTML&#x2F;CSS.<p>People love to shit on HTML&#x2F;CSS and blame it for their problems, but at the end of the day, the grass really isn&#x27;t greener on the other side.<p>Don&#x27;t blame open source because it can&#x27;t rescue your product. Great products and care for the community foster great open source communities, not the other way around.
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AdrianRossouw超过 9 年前
Man, famo.us.<p>I dove in because i try to get a balanced view of things before I make up my mind about things, and there was some stuff in there that I really liked. I tried building something with it, and it didn&#x27;t really work out.<p>But even worse was the way that they interacted with their open source community.<p>It was completely cathedral-style, for a long time. And just as they became more bazaar-like everything dries up from them. Nobody was on irc, nothing on the issue queues. The only thing we heard was more promises for x integration, and y integration.<p>Eventually the community got fed up and called them out on it, to which they finally admitted that they had started a complete rewrite behind closed doors to use &#x27;mixed mode&#x27; css3d and webgl rendering. 6 months later, they released their new &#x27;engine&#x27; rewrite, and an additional &#x27;framework&#x27; on top of it, which really did not seem fully baked.<p>They subsequently made a really big deal of helping found the jquery foundation, and organized a jquerySF conference that had them on stage promising to replace major jquery widgets with drop-in famo.us ones.<p>And then nothing. Commits stopped, feedback stopped, slack channel was closed. News started filtering out of devs working there leaving one after the other.<p>The entire thing did teach me some important life lessons, though =) At least there&#x27;s a few mistakes i won&#x27;t make again.
tptacek超过 9 年前
<i>Famo.us’ 15 minutes of open source fame have come to an end. JavaScript rendering engine Famo.us has pivoted away from its hardcore open sourced engineering platform which had raised over $31 million. It’s now refocused on commercializing the idea of powerful mobile web apps with a content management system for branded marketing apps.</i><p>Yikes. If ever I wanted a paragraph printed on a poster to scare me into working harder, this is probably the one.
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braythwayt超过 9 年前
<p><pre><code> &gt; Newcomb describes it as “one of the toughest decisions I’ve ever had to &gt; make because it meant letting go of some people.” Stressing the firings &gt; weren’t easy for him. “Before I made the decision, I drove scar from San &gt; Francisco to Baltimore and back to think it through,” he explains. “I took &gt; eight days.” </code></pre> I have fired people. It is brutal. I have been fired. It&#x27;s worse. So managers, please: Never solicit sympathy for the pain of firing people.
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0x0超过 9 年前
I never understood how they could claim &quot;this is not html5&quot; and &quot;we have a direct conversation with the GPU&quot;, when it appears to be just a bunch of &lt;div&gt;s with style=&quot;transform:matrix3d(0,1,2...)&quot;?
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Uroboric超过 9 年前
I briefly contracted there and it was obvious to me that this would happen.<p>The platform they built is really amazing, but there was no sense of how they could start making money in any reasonable period of time considering their costs. I&#x27;m sure everyone who was working there will be fine as they had some tremendously talented engineers.
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untog超过 9 年前
Wait, you&#x27;re telling me a VC funded JavaScript framework didn&#x27;t work out?
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jbuzbee超过 9 年前
Clickbait use of &quot;Fired&quot; - It&#x27;s a pet peeve of mine when headlines used the term to create more drama. The correct term for terminating an employee due to business reasons as opposed to &quot;cause&quot; is laid-off.
ThomPete超过 9 年前
Famo.us to me was always a platform&#x2F;framework or even a language more than it was a product or service.<p>I have no idea how they could have raised $31M on that.<p>This could have been an amazing framework built by the open source community instead it&#x27;s now just another growth before revenue scheme that went wrong.<p>Sad.
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jonny_eh超过 9 年前
They always seemed so smug about themselves and their lackluster product. I&#x27;m not the least bit surprised. I wish them the best though.
aaronbrethorst超过 9 年前
At least the employees who got canned weren&#x27;t being paid as poorly as Gumroad&#x27;s employees: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;web.archive.org&#x2F;web&#x2F;20141224195227&#x2F;https:&#x2F;&#x2F;angel.co&#x2F;famo-us&#x2F;jobs" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;web.archive.org&#x2F;web&#x2F;20141224195227&#x2F;https:&#x2F;&#x2F;angel.co&#x2F;...</a><p>Of course, Famo.us&#x27; employees seemed to get a lot less equity, but let&#x27;s be honest: I&#x27;d rather make $175,000&#x2F;year and get 0.05% of nothing than $75,000&#x2F;year and 1% of nothing[1]<p>[1] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=10517008" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=10517008</a>
drcode超过 9 年前
&gt; What makes our product offering unique is that our apps can be built without coding<p>Oooh... that&#x27;s going to be a tough argument to sell to people.
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elmar超过 9 年前
“We have about five years of money in the bank, so now it doesn’t matter what happens in the market”<p>First time I heard of 5 years runway....
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imaginenore超过 9 年前
Famo.us business should be selling books and webinars on how to raise crazy money. They are definitely awesome at that.
idibidiart超过 9 年前
Hype to usefulness ratio of 1000:1
stevebmark超过 9 年前
Famous never should have been funded. Not because of lack of talent on the team, but because it&#x27;s an inherently unprofitable idea. The responsibility of knowing that should fall on the team, not the investors. I think it was disingenuous to seek funding for this idea. GitTip or another OSS funding model would have been far more appropriate. A cross platform animation library should not have paid employees, and was an unfortunate choice for investors. (They burned 30 MILLION working on an open source animation library?!). It sounds like a few dozen people were lucky enough to get Bay Area salaries to meander around a broken idea. I don&#x27;t think an investor would have the technical experience to realize the technology both would not work well, not solve the right problems, and not be marketable. They fired a dozen people? How many more are left?! Anything built by the remaining team should not be done under the Famous brand. It was disingenuous of the founder to pitch it as a fundable, profitable idea and use techno-speak to wow investors for something that many developers in the industry could see right through.
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puppetmaster3超过 9 年前
I predicted this:<p><a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=7689406" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=7689406</a>
spyder超过 9 年前
For a company that&#x27;s building UIs their website in Firefox is unreadable due to the horrible font: <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;imgur.com&#x2F;8ANC4bH" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;imgur.com&#x2F;8ANC4bH</a><p>I don&#x27;t hate thin fonts - for example in bigger sizes it looks good - but the thin an small combination is a bad choice. In Chrome it&#x27;s a little bit better but I still won&#x27;t read it.
tlobes超过 9 年前
Ex-famo.us (pre-pivot short-term contractor&#x27;ish) here. It&#x27;s sad to see famousJS go to the grave, but I&#x27;m excited to see dmvaldman&#x27;s samsaraJS (<a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;samsaraJS.org" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;samsaraJS.org</a>) evolve into something great (cakaaaaaaw!). The pre-pivot famo.us was inspiring to work with and I was humbled to see all the projects being created by both the in-house and external teams.<p>It was an exciting place to work, for all it&#x27;s ups and downs. Besides the product itself, the office, albeit ungodly expensive given it&#x27;s location and size, was the perfect place to be productive and push yourself well into the night. There were spots you could work collaboratively next to others as well as little nooks you could &quot;hide&quot; and get some comfy undisturbed privacy. The ambiance of the place worked beautifully to be both creative and technical, together or individually. In the grand scheme of things, I think it&#x27;s an expense that easily justified the potential reward.<p>On the other hand, the social culture that Steve crafted, often reinforced by his example, didn&#x27;t sit right with me personally, nor did it sit well with many others. &quot;Toxic&quot; was an unfortunate word thrown around quite a bit while I was there. I do hope he takes time off to honestly...subjectively... reflect back on how he chose to treat people he calculated could be useful to him in the moment as opposed to those who were not.<p>On the flip side, when child-like dreamer Steve came through, speaking about his passions and what inspires him to do what he does, he was, in those moments, a really enjoyable guy and motivational figure to work for. I&#x27;ll be casting an unpopular opinion here, but I do think the guy has it in him to lead another company to success, as long as he takes a cold, hard, unbiased, and honest look at himself to fully understand why famo.us, not just the product, but more the culture he crafted, failed with him at the helm.<p>The most important takeaway from my stint there was working with the incredible team and crafting the friendships I did. The level of talent that many of the original engineers had and the amazing personalities behind said talent gives me no worries that those who were let go will move on to something far greater and hopefully, personally rewarding. I already know that quite a few have! :)<p><a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.thefamousgroup.com" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.thefamousgroup.com</a> - Dat logo, though.
ex_famous超过 9 年前
Another ex-famous person here (again, short-term-contractor).<p>The folks focusing on the techcrunch cribs video and drawing damning conclusions from it are, rather predictably, chasing a red herring.<p>For what it&#x27;s worth I actually felt more productive, focused, and relaxed (in a good way) in that office than in any I&#x27;ve ever worked in before or since. The high ceilings made a remarkable difference. The mix of open and private spaces worked. Going to work in a place that felt like a higher-class version of your home but where you could collaborate with your coworkers was pretty amazing. It was basically what co-working spaces always try to be but can never fully pull off. It doesn&#x27;t make sense to complain about the damage open plan offices are doing to productivity and then get angry at someone who does the opposite. Granted, you don&#x27;t need a semi-luxury penthouse. :) But I think the office was an under-appreciated reason why they were able to get (and retain) a lot of great engineers. It was in general a very sane, reasonable environment to do good work in, in contrast to most offices.<p>jondubois, aikah, and others are on the right track. Making money off a front-end framework is a long shot. The monetization plan (to the extent there was one) was always heavy on optimism and reliant on a lot of things going very very right.<p>That&#x27;s not to say it was impossible, though.<p>The reasons famo.us failed are the reasons most startups fail: 1. They didn&#x27;t do nearly enough to truly understand their users and meet their needs 2. They didn&#x27;t communicate or collaborate well or consistently enough internally.<p>I could say more about both 1 and 2, but I&#x27;ll wrap it up there. The real narrative of what went wrong is one that&#x27;s familiar and pretty generic. The subplots of what they were trying to build and who was involved just makes it all a bit more interesting to speculate about.<p>p.s. dmvaldman is the man – you should check out his framework and say hi.
rubiquity超过 9 年前
I&#x27;m not sure you&#x27;re allowed to call that a pivot.
fiatjaf超过 9 年前
&quot;micro-app&quot;, a landing page you have to download from an app store. What a stupid idea.
Grue3超过 9 年前
Back when this got released, I thought &quot;there&#x27;s no way this is going to work&quot;. It was just too slow while hardly doing anything impressive. And it was billed as if it is actually faster than doing things normal way.
dchuk超过 9 年前
Why on Earth would they have a smushed iPhone 6 on that landing page for famous.co?
jondubois超过 9 年前
Making a business out of open source is hard. Especially for front-end related stuff. I think it&#x27;s much easier to build a business around backend technologies - On the backend, there are more opportunities for things like enterprise plugins and integrations (as-a-service).<p>Also the frontend space is insanely competitive. There are a lot of really good frontend frameworks that most people have never heard of.
zurichisstained超过 9 年前
As an early intern, I wonder if the stock that I got after being let go from these guys will ever be worth a lick. :-&#x2F;
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draw_down超过 9 年前
To be honest, nothing about this has ever made sense to me. And I&#x27;m a JS developer.
anonbanker超过 9 年前
I think, with the three javascript videos I had to click away while trying to read this article, I vow to never read techcrunch again.<p>I think they&#x27;re exploiting their relationship with HN, and their need should be re-evaluated.
wdmeldon超过 9 年前
It kinda looks like he somehow made $31M selling &quot;mystery boxes&quot;....
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chkuendig超过 9 年前
Aren&#x27;t these the guys who implemented their own UI toolkit on top of WebGL because &quot;HTML5 is slow and our stuff is GPU-accelerated&quot;?
pbreit超过 9 年前
Like Gumroad, a company like this should not be staffing up to 20+ before finding some traction or at least some product&#x2F;market fit.
ismail超过 9 年前
Honest question: Is it normal for SV companies to be taking &quot;beer breaks&quot; during the work day?<p>I found that a bit strange.
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kevin_thibedeau超过 9 年前
How did they get a hold of famous.org? Should startups be spending money on domains like that?
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fivesigma超过 9 年前
Obligatory Jared Dunn: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=M1vfXoUNDYA" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=M1vfXoUNDYA</a>
agounaris超过 9 年前
Actually where did they spend those 31m??
iamleppert超过 9 年前
Can someone please explain what an &quot;app engine&quot; is? Is it 4-stroke or straight 6? Does it come with a cat back exhaust?<p>In all seriousness, to me a framework is just an opinoited way of doing things that makes a bunch of decisions for you so you have less to think about. It hinges on the fact someone has uncovered some useful abstractions that make the act of coding less tedious.<p>I checked out their demo and while it looked fancy, I didn&#x27;t see any compeling reason to use it over plain html&#x2F;css or three.js if you need fancy 3d stuff.<p>Also, calling your product &quot;shitty&quot; isn&#x27;t the best strategy. Geeks see self-deprecation as a sign of weakness.