Lisp for web apps? Tell me more.. (seriously)

I'd use a continuation based framework to get started. Seaside for smalltalk, plt-scheme or UCW in lisp. I've been using UCW to develop my project. It makes it really easy to think about the problem. You serve a page, the page has actions (method calls) which take parameters. The parameters are fields on the page. It's really easy to think about an application. It lets you prototype in code.<p>For our stuff, I started with rails, just found it too hard to get started. I had to decide what the tables looked like, how I was going to divide the data, write a model for every table then connect it to a page. <p>With UCW, I write code which connects to a function call. Simple.<p>

Here's a detailed link on setting up a scheme server (perhaps more detailed than many system admins would need). I'd err towards mod_lisp under Apache rather than run SISC Scheme under Tomcat, but this is a pleasant read: <a href="http://www.lisperati.com/quick.html">http://www.lisperati.com/quick.html</a>

Here's an overview of different approaches: <a href="http://bc.tech.coop/blog/041017.html">http://bc.tech.coop/blog/041017.html</a><p>And here's a list of different web server resources: <a href="http://www.cl-user.net/asp/tags/web-servers">http://www.cl-user.net/asp/tags/web-servers</a>

There's also this resource which is very much for beginners but if you're just starting to find out all about using Lisp to do web development this might be a good read:<p><a href="http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/practical-web-programming-with-allegroserve.html">http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/practical-web-programming-with-allegroserve.html</a>

Wow, what a response. I am excited by the prospect that at some point in the near future I can dive into lisp with a clear goal in mind and the resources to make it happen. I have been hearing for years about how lisp is really the ultimate programmers language. I respect this lisp-lover's oppinion and experience ultimately, and put him right in the list with Paul and Carl. So, 3 elite programmers who sing the graces of lisp. One was enough for me to want to learn to think in lisp. 3 in support should be a point to ponder.<p>The problem I have always encountered with trying to build a solution in lisp is the lack of resources. It sounds like lisp is inching closer and closer to the critical mass where tools and libraries will finally be available for more then a few uses.<p>This lisper I know said "Don't hold your breath." when I suggested that lisp may be coming close to getting its due. I know that there are alot of people out there like me. We will start using lisp when the great advantages of the language finally outweigh the disadvantages of implementation. I think its just a matter of time until lisp is a clear win, as long as the tools come.<p>I've never written a line of lisp. I want to save my lisp cherry for a time when I can have more "Yay" then "Doh" while I learn and use it. I think it will be worth the wait.

From my limited perspective, it looks like one of the major drawbacks (evidenced in this discussion) is the lack of critical mass for one specific Lisp stack. Having so many competing setups makes for:<p>-little documentation<p>-little support<p>-limited libraries<p>-super tiny communities<p>Compare that to LAMP(P = PHP, Perl, or Python) and Rails. Their communities, docs, support, libs, etc are HUGE compared to the tiny fractured Lisp ecosystem.<p>Do LAMP and Rails have their own problems? Of course. But the point is that they have been proven over and over and over. Lisp is certainly sexy and will give you that toned body and hairy chest you always wanted, but beyond Viaweb and Reddit (cough, cough) can you readily (and without searching) think of other top sites that have delivered a major hit with it? Second, can you think of any hit Lisp sites that didn't involve Paul Graham? I rest my case.<p>I'd love to see this change, but unfortunately that's the current reality.<p>------<p>Update: After doing some searching, I also found ITA's backend Orbitz software written in Lisp. That certainly was a hit and is also used by many other systems. The author is Carl de Marcken and this hit is also mentioned in pg's "Great Hackers" essay.<p>So, Two Lisp Hit-makers:<p>Paul Graham, Phd in CS from Harvard<p>Carl de Marcken, Phd in CS from MIT<p>So, if you're a Phd in CS from one of the top programs in the <i>world</i> - I'd say Go For It! ;)

Sorry, I spent years demonstrating to people how Lisp is better for everybody doing web development, not just elite programmers. I'm done. My new philosophy is, if you can't get them to join you, beat them.<p>Now I'm at a point where my venture absolutely must succeed. I'll take every advantage I can get.

It's scheme, not CL, but don't forget HOP <a href="http://hop.inria.fr/">http://hop.inria.fr/</a> and whatever the PLT people have in store <a href="http://www.plt-scheme.org/">http://www.plt-scheme.org/</a>

if you're thinking of developing a web app in lisp but haven't looked at python or ruby, you might consider them -- remember, it's not just the raw language but also the surrounding infrastructure, and python (django, turbogears) and ruby (rails) have arguably much more developed frameworks, and also arguably have most of the interesting language features that would draw you to lisp in the first place.<p>the point is the language is only one piece of the equation -- you want to be spending your time developing your app, not rolling your own supporting elements (templating systems, init scripts, form validators, sql bindings/mappers, etc.) and of course i'm sure others will point out reddit's switch from lisp to python.