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VW 'Dieselgate' software developed at Audi in 1999: report

200 点作者 oinkgrr大约 9 年前

12 条评论

aidos大约 9 年前
I&#x27;m actually looking at getting a car at the moment so I&#x27;ve been looking into this to better understand the repercussions for consumers.<p>It&#x27;s weird, VW say that if your car if affected, they&#x27;ll fix it. It&#x27;s a software update that a) won&#x27;t affect performance and b) won&#x27;t affect fuel consumption.<p>So, why did they do it in the first place?<p>Edit &quot;VW confirmed the fix will not affect the performance or fuel economy of the cars, while Mueller also said the cars will pass the European emissions test (without cheating) after the fix has been installed.&quot; - <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.autoexpress.co.uk&#x2F;volkswagen&#x2F;92893&#x2F;vw-emissions-scandal-recalls-compensation-is-your-car-affected-latest-news" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.autoexpress.co.uk&#x2F;volkswagen&#x2F;92893&#x2F;vw-emissions-s...</a>
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cisstrd大约 9 年前
So the software used was written in 1999 at Audi, designed to be &quot;capable of turning off certain engine functions&quot;, for what purpose? Cheating purposes? Testing purposes? Does not say.<p>I personally find that not really informative, but ok.<p>Regarding VW: Everyone living at Germany the last years and following the news heard that same mantra over and over again... &quot;to be the most successful car maker&quot;, every end of the year the story was how far behind they were compared to Toyota or in other words: how much closer they came.<p>Problem is that they were absolutely obsessed with beating their competitors, especially Toyota, at the same time VW relied heavily on the earnings of their premium brands Audi and Porsche, the margins of VW itself were always somewhat thin, especially compared to Toyota.<p>Too many models, too much variation, they are definitely pursuing now to shift to less models and (even) more modular platforms, but at the same time closing down plants in Germany and shifting to foreign countries will likely not happen. The state of Lower Saxony holds ~20% of the company, VW has repeatedly pledged to &quot;stay a german company&quot; and doesn&#x27;t want to cut jobs in their home country.<p>Under those circumstances, competing with Toyota might just have not been possible. VW heavily made its bet on the Diesel Engine, and maybe that was wrong, as they had to cheat to make that bet pay off. VW needs a change in culture, desperately, that is unlikely to happen though. Interesting times to come, I wouldn&#x27;t bet on VW though... but then again, what somewhat rational thinking person would, I know.
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the_mitsuhiko大约 9 年前
I find this very confusing because the software that caused &quot;dieselgate&quot; was written by Bosch and other companies and not by either VW or Audi.
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f_allwein大约 9 年前
So the manipulations have been going on since 1999 (2005 for VW) and appear to have been deliberate, rather than snuck in by a small group of engineers.<p>Will be interesting to see how VW and the other brands mentioned here get out of this. Their crisis management so far certainly does not help.
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braderhart大约 9 年前
Right before this happened I was looking into getting a Golf SportsWagen Diesel TDI. When the news broke, the dealership I was working with stopped selling them. They tried to get me to buy a gas model instead. I asked them how much they were willing to work with me. They wouldn&#x27;t even budge saying that the gas model wasn&#x27;t affected, and that they didn&#x27;t feel like the depreciation would be affected. Screw you VW!
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glenndebacker大约 9 年前
To be honest it would really surprise me if Audi is the only one pulling these kind of tricks. A lot of car manufactures like to skew numbers.<p>Look at the fuel&#x2F;distance range some are advertising with. I never once got the same fuel&#x2F;range ratio or the difference is a lot bigger in practice.
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maho大约 9 年前
I am German and went to school in Germany. I completed the 11th grade at an American high school in Oregon, as an exchange student.<p>One of the more unexpected culture shocks I experienced, was how academic cheating was seen as bad <i>even by the American students</i>. In contrast, let me give you a brief, personal account of academic cheating in my school(s) in Germany:<p>We cheated. A lot [1]. Mostly, it was &quot;cooperative cheating&quot; (copying each other&#x27;s homework, comparing answers during exams), but sometimes it was cheating to get ahead personally (using cheat sheets). Only rarely did we copy homework off the internet, but mostly, because the internet was pretty new. Having others (parents) flat-out do homework for us was, at least to me, unknown, and would have been seen as &quot;bad&quot; cheating, even by the students.<p>Our teachers were by no means oblivious to the problem. Quite the contrary! Having cheated in schools themselves, they knew all the tricks. They spotted us. And they mostly let it slide. I guess if all students are cheating, they still have a level playing-field? In any case, the cooperative nature of our cheating, and the &quot;us vs. the teachers&quot;-attitude, created a strong bond among us students, and helped integrate the nerds among us (myself included) into the general student body. Imagine my surprise, as I tried to recreate this bond with my fellow American students at the Oregon high-school!<p>Most times, the consequences for getting caught cheating in an exam were (from 1st grade to final exams at University, including medical &quot;boards&quot;, my wife tells me): You get a warning for being caught the 1st time, a stern warning for being caught the second time, and you fail the exam for being caught the third time. This is <i>per exam</i>.<p>The only times I ever heard second warnings being issued, was teachers mocking the students for being too obvious. I don&#x27;t recall ever seeing someone fail an exam for cheating, although I hear, it does happen.<p>Cheating subsides as you move up in the academic system. Cheating on your PhD-thesis is not seen as a trivial offense anymore, but as a serious offense not entirely unlike fraud.<p>And here is my points about Dieselgate: I would not be surprised at all if management and the whole engineering team were in on it together - at every German (and possibly European) company simultaneously. With a mindset of: &quot;If everyone is doing it, noone is at an unfair disadvantage.&quot; Just like school. Or like quoting fuel-consumption measured by the European standrad such-and-such. Or like giving projected battery-life for a tablet or notebook. Or ...<p>I have since come to appreciate the American way of treating (academic) cheating, but, at times, I also appreciate the German way. It&#x27;s simply a cultural difference, and I don&#x27;t argue for either way as the &quot;right way&quot;.<p>[1]: <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.zeit.de&#x2F;2012&#x2F;34&#x2F;C-Abschreibestudie-Interview-Sattler" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.zeit.de&#x2F;2012&#x2F;34&#x2F;C-Abschreibestudie-Interview-Satt...</a> (This German article describes a study, in which 4 out of 5 students admitted to having cheated in the last semester, at university. If anything, I would expect the fraction of cheating high-school students to be even higher.)<p>Addendum: I have also worked with students from countries, where cheating seems to be even more blatant than in Germany. I was (Of course! Certainly!) morally outraged! I only later realized my hubris.
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excitom大约 9 年前
The practice of adding &quot;gate&quot; to the end of every scandal should have ended in the last century.
rurban大约 9 年前
No, they still haven&#x27;t got it. It was developed by Bosch, probably on request by Audi, and it was parameterized (= enabled) by Audi 1999.<p>Most others engine manufacturers were also tested positive to use this cheat setting.
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stuaxo大约 9 年前
&quot;But they never used it&quot; ORLY ?
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justsaysmthng大约 9 年前
I&#x27;ve noticed changes in my personality since this scandal happened.<p>Before it, I strongly believed that it&#x27;s possible to be just as successful and competitive without breaking any rules.<p>I didn&#x27;t go to exams which I didn&#x27;t study for and refused to cheat when everyone else was doing it. I had opportunities to earn a lot of money by doing shady things, but I&#x27;ve always refused, because I didn&#x27;t want to compromise on my moral values.<p>But diesel gate made me stop and think.<p>If Germany&#x27;s largest company does it - then who else does it ?<p>Add to that the wiki&#x2F;snowden leaks and now the panama papers (to name just a few) and I&#x27;m totally confused:<p>It seems that the rich and successful are all corrupt cheaters.<p>Why do I have to part with 30%-40% of my earned income so that some corrupt politicians can spend them on wars and distribute them to their cronies ?<p>Why do I have to play by the rules when the only advantage of doing so is a &quot;clear conscience&quot; which nobody gives two cents about ... maybe just my 5-year old daughter.. but she also believes in Santa Claus.<p>So this scandal has really put me at a moral crossroads - will I go on being a &quot;sucker&quot; or play by the &quot;big boys&#x27; rules&quot; and be taken &#x27;seriously&#x27; - take advantage of the weak, find ways to avoid taxes, steal, cheat, etc ?<p>What&#x27;s even more disturbing is that this scandal was provoked by maybe a handful of executives at VW, but now tens of thousands of engineers and workers are going to pay the price - in the form of layoffs, reduced bonuses and so on.<p>Once again, very unfair, since most of those people, I&#x27;m sure, are good professionals.<p>So yeah, scandals like this generate more than financial losses or pollution. They generate loss of faith and disappointment and encourage others to step over the line to the &quot;dark side&quot; and become corrupt themselves.
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lugus35大约 9 年前
Please, don&#x27;t call it &#x27;dieselgate&#x27; as it is only a VW group fraud.
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