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Stoicism: Indifference is a power

434 点作者 bilifuduo超过 8 年前

33 条评论

zeteo超过 8 年前
After reading a fair amount about Stoicism and still being unclear, I&#x27;ve found a good summary in Adam Smith&#x27;s almost forgotten classic, &quot;The Theory of Moral Sentiments&quot; (1759) [1]:<p>&quot;Human life the Stoics appear to have considered as a game of great skill; in which, however, there was a mixture of chance [...] In such games the stake is commonly a trifle, and the whole pleasure of the game arises from playing well, from playing fairly, and playing skilfully. If notwithstanding all his skill, however, the good player should, by the influence of chance, happen to lose, the loss ought to be a matter, rather of merriment, than of serious sorrow. He has made no false stroke; he has done nothing which he ought to be ashamed of; he has enjoyed completely the whole pleasure of the game. [...]<p>Our only anxious concern ought to be, not about the stake, but about the proper method of playing. If we placed our happiness in winning the stake, we placed it in what depended upon causes beyond our power, and out of our direction. We necessarily exposed ourselves to perpetual fear and uneasiness, and frequently to grievous and mortifying disappointments. If we placed it in playing well, in playing fairly, in playing wisely and skilfully; in the propriety of our own conduct in short; we placed it in what, by proper discipline, education, and attention, might be altogether in our own power, and under our own direction. Our happiness was perfectly secure, and beyond the reach of fortune.&quot;<p>[1] <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.econlib.org&#x2F;library&#x2F;Smith&#x2F;smMS7.html" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.econlib.org&#x2F;library&#x2F;Smith&#x2F;smMS7.html</a>
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will_brown超过 8 年前
I was only recently introduced to stoicism as a philosophy on a run.<p>I was asked what my technique is during a run, do I concentrate on pain or ignore it. Of course there isn&#x27;t always pain and pain during a run can vary greatly, so I explained my answer is simply, <i>yes</i>. I have tried everything and nothing works, I explained like everyone some days I dominate and some days I struggle, but I&#x27;m always thankful for my <i>character building days</i> and hopeful I&#x27;ll have new thought processes to try.<p>I don&#x27;t know if it&#x27;s stoic or not, but a cool way to be introduced to the philosophy. Then, I explained a specific thought I sometimes embrace during very difficult runs, I remember when I did a back to back half&#x2F;full marathons, and on day 2 I was feeling great like there was nothing I couldn&#x27;t do and just before the race I was introduced to a 67 year old cancer survivor running her first marathon, to this day the thought brings chills and humbles me.
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dominotw超过 8 年前
This &#x27;hack&#x27; is known to drug addicts for centuries. Cyclic withdrawal from the drug to increase potency. Stoicism is the same principal used to recalibrate hedonic treadmill so you don&#x27;t have to keep running faster and faster.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Hedonic_treadmill" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Hedonic_treadmill</a>
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seanlinehan超过 8 年前
The Serenity Prayer popular in 12-step programs is the tldr; of Stoicism I keep in mind:<p>Grant me the serenity<p>To accept the things I cannot change;<p>Courage to change the things I can;<p>And wisdom to know the difference.
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grecy超过 8 年前
I couldn&#x27;t agree more.<p>In so many situations in life, it really only comes down to how you view the situation.<p>If you see it as a pain in the ass and horrible, it is.<p>If you see it as a challenge and enjoyable and something to learn from, it is.<p>Your happiness really is your choice.
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aecorredor超过 8 年前
Coincidence, or life maybe, is just incredible. I bought &quot;A guide to the good life&quot; a couple of days ago, and started reading it 2 hours ago. I finished the first two chapters, and checked hacker news for the first time today, this post was in the top 10...Good article, even better writing. Cheers.
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thekevan超过 8 年前
Maybe it isn&#x27;t strictly sticking to the definition of stoicism I&#x27;ve found this effective, surprisingly, in road rage or what some would call bullying situations. When someone is getting aggressive, I have just stayed serious, calm and looked slightly determined. I keep eye contact and try to think about being bored as well. When bully-types blow up at a stranger, they usually do it to someone that they think will back down. When they don&#x27;t, they get confused.
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waynecochran超过 8 年前
The &quot;Obstacle is The Way&quot; is a very popular book and now sits on my nightstand. I have drawn a lot of strength from it as I endure difficult struggles:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;The_Obstacle_Is_the_Way" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;The_Obstacle_Is_the_Way</a>
jsinkwitz超过 8 年前
As a stoic I&#x27;m getting an emotionally neutral response from this thread.
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tomohawk超过 8 年前
This seems like a decidedly un-Stoic statement:<p>&quot;Stockdale rejected the false optimism proffered by Christianity, because he knew, from direct observation, that false hope is how you went insane in that prison.&quot;<p>Perhaps the author is interjecting something.<p>Stoicism and Christianity share many traits. Consider, as but one example, this statement by James:<p>&quot;Consider it pure joy, my brothers and sisters, whenever you face trials of many kinds, because you know that the testing of your faith produces perseverance. Let perseverance finish its work so that you may be mature and complete, not lacking anything.&quot;
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StavrosK超过 8 年前
So <i>why</i> is it? The article didn&#x27;t really answer the question, for all its meandering through history.<p>Does anyone know of a good and concise summary of the main points of Stoicism?
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wu-ikkyu超过 8 年前
&gt;It is our attitude toward events, not events themselves, which we can control. Nothing is by its own nature calamitous -- even death is terrible only if we fear it.<p>&gt;There is only one way to happiness and that is to cease worrying about things which are beyond the power or our will.<p>-Epictetus
mark_l_watson超过 8 年前
Nice article. A little off topic, but the book &quot;A Guide to a Good Life. Writings of Marcus Aurelius&quot; is a fantastic read. He was one of the last &quot;good&quot; Roman Emporers, and his ideas on Stoicism are excellent.
kensai超过 8 年前
I always find the poem &quot;If&quot; the epitome of (British) Stoicism.<p>Enjoy: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=JWvcwVWCcnY" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=JWvcwVWCcnY</a>
walkingolof超过 8 年前
This is a fantastic talk about Stoicism <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=seLLJP3H1FU" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=seLLJP3H1FU</a>
return0超过 8 年前
Indifference - bad choice of word. It makes it sound like apathy.
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fsiefken超过 8 年前
For an introduction on stoicism as applied to our current life: &quot;A Guide to the Good Life&quot; by William Irvin <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.goodreads.com&#x2F;book&#x2F;show&#x2F;5617966-a-guide-to-the-good-life" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.goodreads.com&#x2F;book&#x2F;show&#x2F;5617966-a-guide-to-the-g...</a><p>Ecclesiastes (contained in the Tanakh and the Old Testament) has a streak of stoicism. Written around 25 centuries ago, author unknown. Here is the NJB translation of a part of 1 and 2:<p>&quot;I, Qoheleth, have reigned over Israel in Jerusalem. Wisely I have applied myself to investigation and exploration of everything that happens under heaven. What a wearisome task God has given humanity to keep us busy! I have seen everything that is done under the sun: how futile it all is, mere chasing after the wind! What is twisted cannot be straightened, what is not there cannot be counted.<p>I thought to myself: I have acquired a greater stock of wisdom than anyone before me in Jerusalem. I myself have mastered every kind of wisdom and science. I have applied myself to understanding philosophy and science, stupidity and folly, and I now realise that all this too is chasing after the wind. Much wisdom, much grief; the more knowledge, the more sorrow.<p>I thought to myself, &#x27;Very well, I will try pleasure and see what enjoyment has to offer.&#x27; And this was futile too. This laughter, I reflected, is a madness, this pleasure no use at all. I decided to hand my body over to drinking wine, my mind still guiding me in wisdom; I resolved to embrace folly, to discover the best way for people to spend their days under the sun. I worked on a grand scale: built myself palaces, planted vineyards; made myself gardens and orchards, planting every kind of fruit tree in them; had pools made for watering the young trees of my plantations. I bought slaves, male and female, had home-born slaves as well; herds and flocks I had too, more than anyone in Jerusalem before me. I amassed silver and gold, the treasures of kings and provinces; acquired singers, men and women, and every human luxury, chest upon chest of it. So I grew great, greater than anyone in Jerusalem before me; nor did my wisdom leave me. I denied my eyes nothing that they desired, refused my heart no pleasure, for I found all my hard work a pleasure, such was the return for all my efforts.<p>I then reflected on all that my hands had achieved and all the effort I had put into its achieving. What futility it all was, what chasing after the wind! There is nothing to be gained under the sun. My reflections then turned to wisdom, stupidity and folly. For instance, what can the successor of a king do? What has been done already.<p>More is to be gained from wisdom than from folly, just as one gains more from light than from darkness; this, of course, I see: The wise have their eyes open, the fool walks in the dark. No doubt! But I know, too, that one fate awaits them both. &#x27;Since the fool&#x27;s fate&#x27;, I thought to myself, &#x27;will be my fate too, what is the point of my having been wise?&#x27; I realised that this too is futile. For there is no lasting memory for the wise or the fool, and in the days to come both will be forgotten; the wise, no less than the fool, must die.<p>Life I have come to hate, for what is done under the sun disgusts me, since all is futility and chasing after the wind. All I have toiled for under the sun and now bequeath to my successor I have come to hate; who knows whether he will be wise or a fool? Yet he will be master of all the work into which I have put my efforts and wisdom under the sun. That is futile too.<p>I have come to despair of all the efforts I have expended under the sun. For here is one who has laboured wisely, skilfully and successfully and must leave what is his own to someone who has not toiled for it at all. This is futile too, and grossly unjust; for what does he gain for all the toil and strain that he has undergone under the sun since his days are full of sorrow, his work is full of stress and even at night he has no peace of mind? This is futile too.<p>There is no happiness except in eating and drinking, and in enjoying one&#x27;s achievements; and I see that this too comes from God&#x27;s hand; for who would get anything to eat or drink, unless all this came from him? Wisdom, knowledge and joy, God gives to those who please him, but on the sinner he lays the task of gathering and storing up for someone else who is pleasing to him. This too is futility and chasing after the wind.&quot;<p>==<p>For a contemporary take on Ecclesiastes see &quot;American Beauty&quot; or read &quot;Beyond Futility, American Beauty and the Book of Ecclesiastes&#x27; by Robert Johnston in &quot;The Gift of Story: Narrating Hope in a Postmodern World&quot; <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;books.google.nl&#x2F;books?id=2WP_KMBmf7UC&amp;pg=PA85" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;books.google.nl&#x2F;books?id=2WP_KMBmf7UC&amp;pg=PA85</a>
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evo_9超过 8 年前
I read A Guide to the Good Life roughly once a year and found this summary a nice way to stay on it between readings:<p><a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;becomingeden.com&#x2F;summary-of-a-guide-to-the-good-life&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;becomingeden.com&#x2F;summary-of-a-guide-to-the-good-life&#x2F;</a>
criddell超过 8 年前
I wonder if taking a stoic approach to life could help with depression?
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given超过 8 年前
&gt; Marcus Aurelius started each day telling himself: ‘I shall meet with meddling, ungrateful, violent, treacherous, envious, and unsociable people’<p>In other words: every day I will meet with sinners - but additionally &quot;just as I myself am a sinner&quot;<p>Christianity understands this much better than the stoics. The problem of the world is sin and what is the remedy?<p>Jesus Christ<p>&gt; he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.<p>or<p>&gt; For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.<p>The foolishness of God is wiser than the wisdom of the world
pasbesoin超过 8 年前
Stoicism is life&#x27;s consolation prize.<p>(I should know...)
stewbrew超过 8 年前
So where is the International Stoicist Front fighting today against the evil in the world and the suppression of the poor? Oh, they aren&#x27;t. They are working for international cooperations in a middle management position.<p>Why is meditation and Stoicism so hyped these days?
fatdog超过 8 年前
Stoicism is fundamentally subversive to the Hobbesian leviathan that has been constructed from within the post-enlightenment university system. It is the foundation of western morality and ethics, (the Bible borrows heavily from it).<p>Stoicism is not taught in public schools because it would make citizens ungovernable. Most education today is about training dependents, where stoicism teaches a kind of spiritual freedom. No grand conspiracy or anything. When education was elite, students learned elite ideas. Now that it is common, for cohesion they must learn common ones instead. Universities wouldn&#x27;t have survived centuries if they produced graduates who would overthrow their governments, or obviate them entirely.<p>To cosmopolitanism, great and principled men are dangerous and anathema. Irony is that its most prominent works were by the rulers and elites of city states. Some people on the alt-right spectrum have taken that strain and created a kind of genre-philosophy out of it, like what John Williams is to classical music, some alt right thinkers are to classical philosophy.
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thro32超过 8 年前
&gt;<i>No wonder the Stoic sage, in Western culture, has never obtained the popularity of the Zen master.</i><p>Perhaps author should check history of Roman Empire and relation between stoicism and Christianity.
sean_patel超过 8 年前
&gt; stoic<p>&gt; Someone who does not give a shit about the stupid things in this world that most people care so much about. Stoics do have emotions, but only for the things in this world that really matter.<p>Best definition I&#x27;ve seen of &#x27;stoic&#x27; yet :)
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ue_超过 8 年前
Anyone interested in Stoicism should have a read about Buddhism, especially the Theravada branch. There are quite interesting parallels to be drawn.
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edblarney超过 8 年前
I really do agree with the advantages of Stoicisms ... and agree that they &#x27;do it better in the East&#x27; ...<p>but to say: &quot;No wonder the Stoic sage, in Western culture, has never obtained the popularity of the Zen master.&quot;<p>I think is pushing it a little far.<p>There are a lot of Christian Monks - now and throughought the ages who would be borderline stoics. And many big thinkers as well.<p>We (Westerners) just didn&#x27;t define it very well :)
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Pica_soO超过 8 年前
I came upon stoicism in the Andreas Eschbachs - &quot;the Last of his kind&quot; (great book by the way). Its really quite a fascinating worldview- not at all the &quot;depressed punching bag&quot; of the universe as it looks from the outside.
cb18超过 8 年前
What is the relevance of the image at the top here of a sub-Saharan African to an article about an ancient European philosophy.<p>An ancient European philosophy we know of today thanks to written language and a European civilization that developed, preserved and cultivated countless worldchanging ideas.(like the controlled conveyance of photons into your eyes relaying this information)<p>Written language was never even devised in sub-Saharan Africa!<p>These agenda driven, Magical Negro juxtapositions are becoming obscene.
nickthemagicman超过 8 年前
So people in concentration camps who werent enjoying it just had a bad attitude?
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dschiptsov超过 8 年前
Hindus and Theravada Buddhists would laugh at this.)
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kevinSuttle超过 8 年前
I couldn&#x27;t make it through the first sentence of fluff.
rokosbasilisk超过 8 年前
Stoicism resurgence seems very unusually connected to the rise of the alt-right.
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