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In Sweden, Happiness in a Shorter Workday Can’t Overcome the Cost

48 点作者 slizard超过 8 年前

12 条评论

sctb超过 8 年前
Previous discussion: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=13318990" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=13318990</a>
raesene9超过 8 年前
For me, an important takeaway from reading this article was to consider the type of employment they trialled it on.<p>The trial was in a retirement home, which is by design somewhere that needs 24x7 cover. This means that any reduction in hours needs to be covered by more staff, obviously necessitating more expense.<p>What would be far more interesting to me, is a trial on an industry like software development where output isn&#x27;t measured in number of hours but more in the product created. It would be interesting to see if a reduction in hours negatively or positively affected the quality&#x2F;quantity of code produced.
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beerbajay超过 8 年前
This headline is terrible. The issue is not the cost; it&#x27;s political will even by the social democratic party. As it says in the caption of the main image:<p>&gt; Toyota has been using the shorter workday there for more than a decade.<p>This is typically lazy American reporting when considering different political systems&#x2F;paradigms.
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ascorbic超过 8 年前
It seems a particularly poor choice of workplace to try this. Care homes need to maintain certain staffing levels, 24 hours a day, so there is a hard limit to the benefits that can be gained from improved productivity.
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slizard超过 8 年前
Even if it is not found to be acceptable now (which might sadly turn out to be the case even in Sweden), at least when jobs start to dry out, people will realize that an intermediate solution to increasing unemployment is letting people work less -- hopefully for similar pay.
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godzillabrennus超过 8 年前
I like how they reference Japan and Qatar. Japan has a pretty overworked populace and a culture that is toxic to the health of the worker.<p>Qatar has literally brought in masses under indentured servitude to build their workforce.<p>Not exactly countries with workforce practices that I&#x27;d like to see emulated in the USA.
ptaipale超过 8 年前
Some former threads in HN:<p>2014-06-03 Sweden’s proposed six-hour workday (washingtonpost.com) <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=7838459" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=7838459</a><p>2014-07-14 Sweden&#x27;s Six-Hour Workday Experiment Officially Kicks Off Tomorrow (entrepreneur.com) <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=8029162" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=8029162</a><p>2015-10-01 Some companies in Sweden are testing a six-hour work day (fastcoexist.com) <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=10306635" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=10306635</a><p>2016-04-22 Gothenburg&#x27;s six-hour work day experiment hangs in the balance (thelocal.se) <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=11543538" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=11543538</a><p>All in all, the HN posts were not that bad, but in social media - Facebook and Twitter - I saw plenty of overly optimistic, baseless junk spouting the magnificence of how Sweden just went to 6-hour workweek for the nation and productivity gains were so huge. It was actually depressing...<p>Well, obviously people are happier if they work a shorter day and get the same salary, and the productivity per hour may actually increase somewhat. But it won&#x27;t reach the productivity of 8 (or 7.5) hours.
gremlinsinc超过 8 年前
I think the way forward is some sort of basic income, even if that&#x27;s just 25% of average salaries across the country, so that then the company can employ MORE people, but make them work 25% less, and pay them 25% less making them happier, healthier, and the gov&#x27;t picks up the bill for the lost 25% income to the worker... It&#x27;d also be a good experiment for gbi in general.
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inputcoffee超过 8 年前
The first question we should ask is where does the extra value come from (not money, but value, and you&#x27;ll see why in a moment).<p>One answer may be automation, and typically, the excess value is passed on to the customer in the form of lower cost. (That&#x27;s why we ought to talk about value, even if we can&#x27;t easily measure it).<p>One alternative is not to pass on the value to the customer, but to give it to the workers. You could do this by reducing hours, increasing pay, or some combination.<p>There are two problems with this:<p>1. You can&#x27;t do this in an open, market economy. The government could do this with government jobs where they have a monopoly.<p>2. It is kind of arbitrary that you decide to value this particular worker over this particular consumer.<p>Another solution is to give everyone a basic income with all the extra value (collected as taxes, roughly equally) that automation generates. So the seller might give a discount to the customer but the rest of the value would go to the state.<p>Then people can decide how they want to spend it.
robbrown451超过 8 年前
This is what I&#x27;d like to see:<p>Companies be required to offer various plans, at the employees discretion, that have different pay rates. For instance, working 75% of 40 hours might get you 80% of the salary. (with the hope that you are at least a bit more productive during your more limited hours than you would be if doing 40 hours)<p>Employees shouldn&#x27;t be discriminated based on which plan they take. They just have to give a couple months notice if they change plans, especially if it is a small company where the impact might be greater.<p>Benefits is a complication, but personally I&#x27;d prefer health insurance etc was just separated from employment. Regardless, if you work less hours, you&#x27;d probably have to chip in more toward insurance.<p>This may still be costly to employers, but if all companies have to do it, it should work out. (sure, there are foreign competitors, but that is a different issue) And this can potentially help with unemployment.
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vlasev超过 8 年前
If we twist things the other way - this shows that you can buy happiness...
unabridged超过 8 年前
Instead of mandating specific amount of hours per day or week, I&#x27;d like to see something like:<p>1.5x pay at 30 hours<p>2x pay at 40 hours