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Moom removed from sale due to patent violation claim

226 点作者 esolyt大约 8 年前

24 条评论

mistersquid大约 8 年前
What&#x27;s really galling about this particular patent trolling is that Rob Griffiths, principal of Many Tricks which publishes Moom, is one of the original OS X nerd&#x27;s nerd.<p>He&#x27;s done so much for the OS X and the UNIX communities, having run Mac OS X Hints for more than a decade. [0] When pro users were just figuring out best practices for everything from window management to command line AppleScript (osascript) to postfix configuration, Griffiths&#x27; tireless and largely selfless (ads were unobtrusive, implemented with a very light touch) support of Mac OS X hints made it the go-to site for how to do all things command line in OS X.<p>It&#x27;s a shame this patent troll has chosen to shake down so selfless a member of the OS X community.<p>[0] <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;macosxhints.com" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;macosxhints.com</a> (redirects to) <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;hints.macworld.com" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;hints.macworld.com</a><p>EDIT: Grammar: add missing direct object to last sentence of second paragraph.
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janten大约 8 年前
If anyone is looking for an alternative: I put together a grid based window manager without an UI some months ago. <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;janten&#x2F;keypad-layout" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;janten&#x2F;keypad-layout</a>
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oneeyedpigeon大约 8 年前
Oh dear. I guess Spectacle (the app I use that does a similar thing) will be on a pretty long list of those to follow.
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amelius大约 8 年前
Software patents don&#x27;t exist in Europe. So they can probably just add some small-print that says &quot;please don&#x27;t download this if you are outside of Europe&quot;.<p>(IANAL)
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miguelrochefort大约 8 年前
I once designed an app to later realize that I was infringing dozens of patents I never knew existed before.<p>Go and read a dozen patents, then come back and tell me they&#x27;re not obvious. Most of them are ridiculously obvious, assuming you have some understanding of their given field&#x2F;domain.
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jakobegger大约 8 年前
I was about to complain loudly about bullshit patents, but then I took some time to read the actual patent (make sure to look at the images too!), and it turns out that this patent describes a method that is very similar to what Moom does (judging by screenshots). This is not a case of the overly broad patents that we usually complain about, this is a very precise patent.
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qwerty_asdf大约 8 年前
This person holds a number of similar patents from the looks of it:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.google.com&#x2F;patents&#x2F;US8434019" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.google.com&#x2F;patents&#x2F;US8434019</a><p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.google.com&#x2F;search?q=&quot;Daniel+Paul+Nelson&quot;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.google.com&#x2F;search?q=&quot;Daniel+Paul+Nelson&quot;</a>
mjw1007大约 8 年前
The patent describes something very like Moom&#x27;s &quot;Grid&quot; feature (I think the «select more than one selectable region» bit is the key restriction).<p>So if the patent stands up, I suppose they&#x27;d have the option of just removing that feature.
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Plugawy大约 8 年前
Interesting, I guess there&#x27;s so much prior work around* it should be easy to dismiss the patent.<p>* <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Tiling_window_manager" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Tiling_window_manager</a>
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Brajeshwar大约 8 年前
Another Moom Alternative (free) - SpectacleApp, <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.spectacleapp.com&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.spectacleapp.com&#x2F;</a>
wink大约 8 年前
Looks roughly like WinSplit Revolution, which afaik was first released in 2009, but I don&#x27;t know which features existed back then.
altern8tif大约 8 年前
There&#x27;s something fundamentally broken about the patent system.
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RayVR大约 8 年前
knowing absolutely nothing about patent law, I&#x27;m surprised that tiling window managers are not considered prior art or would at least mean this idea is not novel.
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JoelTheSuperior大约 8 年前
I&#x27;d be curious to see how this affects other similar apps. I use Magnet and I love it - I&#x27;d hate for it to disappear.
dctoedt大约 8 年前
The most important single thing to read in a patent is the claims, especially the independent (stand-alone) claims.<p>Infringement analysis amounts to attempting to map the claim&#x27;s list of elements onto the accused method or structure; if the map function returns FALSE, then that particular claim very likely isn&#x27;t infringed by that particular accused method or structure.<p>(That is: If any claim element isn&#x27;t present—possibly in the form of an &quot;equivalent&quot;—then the accused method or structure doesn&#x27;t infringe that particular claim.)<p>Prior-art analysis works backwards: If a claim returns TRUE when mapped onto a piece of prior art—or onto something that would have been &quot;obvious&quot; at the time the invention was made when taking into account all of the relevant prior art [0]—then that claim is probably unpatentable.<p>In this patent, claim 1 seems to be representative. I&#x27;ve broken up the paragraphing and added bracketed lettering.<p><i>(Usual disclaimer: This shouldn&#x27;t be relied on as a substitute for legal advice; I&#x27;m not acting as anyone&#x27;s lawyer; etc.)</i><p>==QUOTE==<p>1. A method for positioning a window on a user&#x27;s display, the method comprising:<p>[A] providing, in a window-based computing environment, an image [i] representing an entire display area of a user&#x27;s computer screen and [ii] comprising a plurality of selectable regions,<p>each selectable region [x] representing a sub-area within the display area and [y] having a shape and orientation similar to the corresponding sub-area,<p>wherein the selectable regions are arranged in the same way the corresponding sub-areas are arranged in the display area;<p>[B] enabling a user to simultaneously select more than one selectable region from the plurality of selectable regions; and<p>[C] automatically moving a window in the window-based computing environment to a sub-area corresponding to the selected more than one selectable region.<p>==END QUOTE==<p>[0] Obviousness analysis is really tricky because it necessarily requires hindsight. The test is, in essence: Given everything that was known in the relevant field(s) at the time, would a hypothetical person of &quot;ordinary skill&quot; (in that field or fields) have regarded the claimed subject as obvious?<p>My personal tl;dr for obviousness analysis is this: Suppose that a team of competent-but-not-necessarily-stellar colleagues were shown or told about the claimed invention. If their collective reaction was to raise their eyebrows and murmur, &quot;hmm; <i>that&#x27;s</i> interesting,&quot; then the claimed invention might well have been non-obvious. On the other hand, if their collective reaction was to shrug their shoulders and say, &quot;um, yeah, and?&quot; then the claimed invention might well have been obvious.<p>In the real world, obviousness analysis is supported by &quot;objective evidence&quot; of nonobviousness, if available. For example, commercial success that&#x27;s shown to be due to the technical merits of the claimed invention (as opposed to being due mainly to, e.g., marketing) can weigh heavily in favor of nonobviousness. Admiration of experts, ditto.<p>(I once heard a story, very likely apocryphal, about a patent examiner who rejected a patent application on grounds of obviousness; the patent attorney overcame the rejection by pointing out that the claimed invention had received the Nobel Prize. Personally I&#x27;m skeptical because the timing wouldn&#x27;t work, but the story illustrates the concept.)
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eb0la大约 8 年前
Let&#x27;s talk about prior art about this patent claims.<p>I remember using software from Barco to position application Windows on a videowall that predates that patent at least five years.<p>Maybe getting prior art at hand could be good (just a suggestion)
shafiqissani大约 8 年前
Kinda feels the same to me as when they tried to patent Turmeric.
brighthero大约 8 年前
What&#x27;s the best way to prevent patent trolls from suing you? Or is it more like hoping to just have luck and not get sued?
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beshrkayali大约 8 年前
Are there any interesting stats&#x2F;graphs or an estimated percentage of US-granted patents that are bullshit?
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codecamper大约 8 年前
so.. as programmers, we should be getting a patent first on any new idea before we begin programming? So much for an MVP.<p>We need tools to simplify the process of writing a good patent. The current system is skewed towards business types that would rather game the system than create an actual thing.
danschumann大约 8 年前
I thought patents were invalid if they were just &quot;something you can do in the real world... but using a computer&quot;. I&#x27;m pretty sure grid layouts have been in mathetmatics, printing, etc for hundreds&#x2F;thousands of years. It&#x27;s likely a shit patent.
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jostmey大约 8 年前
What kind of person spends their days looking through other people&#x27;s software, asking if their collection of questionable patents applies to someone else&#x27;s hard work?
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wideem大约 8 年前
are there any open source alternatives to Moom?
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z3t4大约 8 年前
the patent troll likely want little money instead of no money or costs.