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The Strange Disappearance of Cooperation in America (2013)

167 点作者 metasean超过 7 年前

23 条评论

tardygrad超过 7 年前
This was touched upon heavily in the book &#x27;The Righteous Mind&#x27; by Jonathan Haidt, an amazing book if you&#x27;re interested in this sort of thing and part of Bill Gate&#x27;s reading list where I first found it.<p>This quote (by Bertrand Russell) stood out: &quot;Social cohesion is a necessity, and mankind has never yet succeeded in enforcing cohesion by merely rational arguments. Every community is exposed to two opposite dangers: ossification through too much discipline and reverence for tradition, on the one hand; and on the other hand, dissolution, or subjection to foreign conquest, through the growth of individualism and personal experience that makes cooperation impossible.&quot;
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tomohawk超过 7 年前
Cooperation used to be by free association through civic organizations. As the government has grown in scope, it has eclipsed these, and it really isn&#x27;t surprising that civic society has declined as a result.<p>When people freely participate in civic activities, they are being generous. There is no coercion. When government does the same thing, it is coercive. The activity does not occur unless taxes are collected. Choice goes out the window.<p>I&#x27;ve heard many people ask why they should volunteer or help out others, when they&#x27;re already paying lots of money in taxes to &quot;take care of those problems&quot;.<p>This is the final tragedy of the government intervention. It turns activities where people are helping people into programs that solve problems.
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schoen超过 7 年前
While I found this quite interesting, and I&#x27;m as concerned about some of these trends as the next person, I was eerily reminded of some of John Robbins&#x27;s stuff graphing meat consumption against incidence of diseases and his kind of casual thinking about causation. We have so many datasets available now that it&#x27;s so easy to graph things against each other and notice things that may be coincidentally related, or even causally related, and then tell some kind of story about where the relationship came from. And I remember that there&#x27;s even a funny web site that tries to underscore the difficulty in reasoning from these associations.<p><a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.tylervigen.com&#x2F;spurious-correlations" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.tylervigen.com&#x2F;spurious-correlations</a><p>In this case, the n-grams chart really exemplified this for me. There are so many influences on the frequency of a word, including lexical substitution of a word by its synonyms, changes in spelling, and increased or decreased interest in a topic regardless of whether that interest is positive or negative.<p>For example, check out the long-term decline in avarice in America! It&#x27;s profound!<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;books.google.com&#x2F;ngrams&#x2F;graph?content=avarice&amp;year_start=1900&amp;year_end=2008&amp;corpus=15&amp;smoothing=0&amp;share=&amp;direct_url=t1%3B%2Cavarice%3B%2Cc0" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;books.google.com&#x2F;ngrams&#x2F;graph?content=avarice&amp;year_s...</a><p>Oh, wait, maybe we just stopped using the <i>word</i> &quot;avarice&quot; rather than the concept. :-)<p>Or, during this Second Gilded Age, our society actually started to become <i>less</i> atomized:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;books.google.com&#x2F;ngrams&#x2F;graph?content=atomized&amp;year_start=1900&amp;year_end=2008&amp;corpus=15&amp;smoothing=0&amp;share=&amp;direct_url=t1%3B%2Catomized%3B%2Cc0" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;books.google.com&#x2F;ngrams&#x2F;graph?content=atomized&amp;year_...</a><p>... or maybe we just moved away from calling the phenomenon that.
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RealityNow超过 7 年前
This is due to the entrenchment of neoliberalism since the 70s (famously Reagan in the 80s), the ideology that government&#x27;s sole responsibility is to enforce free markets, any other function of government is bad, and that every aspect of life should be dictated by free markets. Margaret Thatcher&#x27;s &quot;there is no such thing as society, only individuals&quot; sums it up. Rising wealth inequality is simply a byproduct of this.<p>When we&#x27;re indoctrinated to suppress our humanity and see each other as self-interested profit-maximizing businesses rather than people, then it shouldn&#x27;t come as any surprise that we&#x27;re less cooperative.
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Animats超过 7 年前
Here&#x27;s a question. Do you belong to any organization which chooses its leaders democratically? That is, you get to vote, there&#x27;s more than one candidate, and the incumbents and their designated successors sometimes get kicked out?<p>Do you belong to any organization which has member meetings in which members can vote and make decisions binding on the organization?
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kafkaesq超过 7 年前
Nothing &#x27;strange&#x27; about this at all; to a first-order approximation, it&#x27;s the inevitable byproduct of the transformative shift in the society&#x27;s governing ideology over the same timespan:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.theguardian.com&#x2F;news&#x2F;2017&#x2F;aug&#x2F;18&#x2F;neoliberalism-the-idea-that-changed-the-world" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.theguardian.com&#x2F;news&#x2F;2017&#x2F;aug&#x2F;18&#x2F;neoliberalism-t...</a><p>That said, the various participation rates he&#x27;s siting may presumed to be somewhat skewed by immigration.
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metasean超过 7 年前
&gt;Almost 200 years ago that discerning observer of social life, Alexis de Tocqueville, wrote about the exceptional ability of Americans to form voluntary associations and, more generally, to cooperate in solving problems that required concerted collective action. This capacity for cooperation apparently lasted into the post-World War II era, but several indicators suggest that during the last 3-4 decades it has been unraveling.<p>&gt;In these articles I argue that general well-being (and high levels of social cooperation) tends to move in the opposite direction from inequality. During the ‘disintegrative phases’ inequality is high while well-being and cooperation are low. During the ‘integrative phases’ inequality is low, while well-being and cooperation are high.<p>With economic inequality only getting worse [0, 1, 2] I can&#x27;t help but wonder if there is also a decline in open source contributions? Or do our contributions increase because it provides visibility, and therefore increased economic opportunity, for those lower on the income scale?<p>[0]: <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;money.cnn.com&#x2F;2016&#x2F;12&#x2F;22&#x2F;news&#x2F;economy&#x2F;us-inequality-worse&#x2F;index.html" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;money.cnn.com&#x2F;2016&#x2F;12&#x2F;22&#x2F;news&#x2F;economy&#x2F;us-inequality-w...</a><p>[1]: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.nytimes.com&#x2F;interactive&#x2F;2017&#x2F;08&#x2F;07&#x2F;opinion&#x2F;leonhardt-income-inequality.html" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.nytimes.com&#x2F;interactive&#x2F;2017&#x2F;08&#x2F;07&#x2F;opinion&#x2F;leonh...</a><p>[2]: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;twitter.com&#x2F;lpolovets&#x2F;status&#x2F;890610260251033602" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;twitter.com&#x2F;lpolovets&#x2F;status&#x2F;890610260251033602</a>
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balance_factor超过 7 年前
&gt; polarization<p>What polarization is there in Washington? Or outside the beltway? What are the two poles? How people feel about transexuals? I don&#x27;t see any polarization. The two parties are close together on almost everything. As the real differences fade, unimportant differences must be heightened. Trump is of that type - he makes a big show, but on what big issue in which he can get anywhere is he substantially far from the Democratic (or Republican) party? As real differences fade, the showmanship of there being a difference must increase, thus, Trump.<p>Even healthcare has no polarization. Both parties are agreed on what it should be. Any party acting as if it will do single player or scrap Obamacare is just showboating. Any changes that get through will be minor ones. It was a 60 Senator consensus vote of the middle-of-the-road consensus view of what healthcare would be. McCain&#x27;s thumbs down to any major overhaul.<p>In the past two centuries the US went from a civil war to the intitial struggle of how to deal with the Great Depression. There hasn&#x27;t been much polarization since that. Even the big squabble in the 1960s was over a non-issue - over a small, peasant country in Indochina. The cold war began cooling off in the early 1950s, and stayed cool, aside from occassional flare-ups in certain areas. By the 1970s, US conservatives were trying to figure out how to heat the cold war up again against the background of SALT and the Helsinki accords.<p>The political establishment is less polarized than ever nowadays. It&#x27;s not like post-war France, where Joliot-Curie, Picasso, Sartre etc. were members of the largest political party in France - the PCF.
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acslater00超过 7 年前
The proposed link between civic participation (&quot;cooperation&quot;) and both inequality and political polarization is a strange one to me, since civic participation seems like it would be a local phenomenon, and both inequality and political polarization mostly show up as regional differences rather than differences <i>within</i> communities.<p>Sure, the political space between Allegany County, NY (low income and trump voting) and Westchester County, NY (high income and clinton voting) is huge. But if you go to an elk lodge in Allegany or a (i dunno) running club in Westchester, you&#x27;re going to find that everybody there has basically the same politics and basically the same income.<p>Something else is going on here.
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CamperBob2超过 7 年前
A decline in cooperation is probably a natural consequence of prosperity. Groups with more prosperous, empowered individuals see a decline in mutual cooperation over time, simply because it&#x27;s not as necessary for their members to stick together.<p>Meanwhile, groups with fewer prosperous members tend toward the opposite behavior. They realize that the only way to compete with the &quot;in group&quot; is to gang up on them... or at least, that&#x27;s what they tell themselves.<p>It hardly seems necessary to point to US electoral politics as a case in point.
pcmaffey超过 7 年前
The arena for &#x27;cooperation&#x27; has shifted from socio-political realms to economic ones. Business now is the primary vehicle for cooperative efforts.
mythrwy超过 7 年前
At one point the US military borrowed binoculars from citizens.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;clickamericana.com&#x2F;media&#x2F;newspapers&#x2F;why-the-navy-wanted-binoculars-for-wwii-1942" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;clickamericana.com&#x2F;media&#x2F;newspapers&#x2F;why-the-navy-wan...</a><p>It&#x27;s hard to even imagine now. But presumably people sent them. They were helping. It was their war. Now the military probably buys 20 times the binoculars they&#x27;ll ever use. At 20 times the price a citizen pays for them. And it&#x27;s all run by career service bureaucrats. The taxpayers foot the bill but the specific expenses are unknown. And the war isn&#x27;t the peoples war now. It&#x27;s usually some kind of undefined action cheered on by think tanks and special interests and pumped up by news stories of terrorists. The citizens are mostly removed from the process, as it goes right on regardless of who they vote for. Unless they enlist, then they are involved, but that is less for principal now and more for a free college education or because what else to do?<p>This is what has changed in society. Life has become a faceless bureaucracy running on it&#x27;s own agenda. Corporate, government, you name it. The concept of community is a pale shadow of what it once was. I don&#x27;t know if this is better or worse, it&#x27;s probably not great if your military has to beg for binoculars but seems the new hazards may be even more dangerous.
netcan超过 7 年前
This is one of those questions where people can reference their pet Big Theory: corporate dominion, government coercion, individualism vs collectivism, insurance, secularization, leaderlessness...<p>It&#x27;s hard to pin cultural changes to anything definiteively. So, my 2c with the same grain of salt...<p>Personally, I think it&#x27;s the regionalism vs globalism dynamic. At least, I think that&#x27;s the force acting on me.<p>We think of our political &amp; cultural identities as part of a much bigger whole. Solidarity and identitiy are closely related. Take HN, for example. If HN was regional and something happened in our region then we&#x27;d be far more inclined mobalize. If we regulalry met in person to discuss ideas, we&#x27;d have more solidarity. We&#x27;d probably be an impactful force.<p>As an online group, we draw from a much bigger pool. The intellectual aspects are richer. But, the community is weaker.<p>TLDR, solidarity of mass culture, maybe. Could be something else.
cameldrv超过 7 年前
In the specific measures of civic organizational membership, you have to put a lot down to women entering the workforce. People of my grandparent&#x27;s generation (middle aged in the 50s and 60s) participated heavily in these activities, Elks and church in their case. A lot of the planning and organization of these groups was done by women who stayed home. Particularly after the kids had gone off to school, homemakers put a lot of effort into civic groups during the day. Now, of course, there were lots of women who worked, but there were enough women who didn&#x27;t to keep these groups running. With women staying home now rare, especially after the kids are old enough for school, the people with free time to keep these organizations going don&#x27;t exist. If you want to see a subculture where these organizations are still thriving, look at members of the LDS church.
PrimalDual超过 7 年前
Perhaps this has to do with the increasing heterogeneity of American society. The US probably looked more like Sweden, Denmark and Japan in the past. People may feel more compelled to partake in civil engagement and similar things like helping your neighbors out if you have the same background. At the very least you must trust the members of your community to play fair. Homogeneity comes at a cost but it&#x27;s definitely useful to be able to assume correctly that you are a reasonable model for other people in your community.
Mary-Jane超过 7 年前
They say nothing brings people together like a common enemy. I&#x27;m surprised no one has correlated the periods of &#x27;good feelings&#x27; with incidence of war, at least of the ones that posed credible threats to the nation. The first polarization low immediately followed the war of 1812. From there polarization increased until WW1, at which point it abruptly halted, then plummeted through to the end of WW2.
galaxyLogic超过 7 年前
My view is that people shouldn&#x27;t be putting too much of their resources into collaboration, charity and helping their neighbors (only). Rather if they want to &quot;do good&quot; they should spend time and effort making the government better, more transparent, more accountable, less corrupt. A better government can better help everybody.
RachelF超过 7 年前
The Economist had an article on this is Issue last week.<p>Mistrust in America could sink the economy<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.economist.com&#x2F;news&#x2F;business&#x2F;21726079-part-problem-lack-competition-some-industries-mistrust-america-could-sink" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.economist.com&#x2F;news&#x2F;business&#x2F;21726079-part-proble...</a>
carapace超过 7 年前
Population density? I&#x27;d love to see a chart of these social indicators plotted against population density.
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freech超过 7 年前
Maybe we are just parts of other groups now, like this one, instead of trade associations and soccer clubs?
georgeoliver超过 7 年前
Did I miss it or did this article not mention online social networks even once?
HillaryBriss超过 7 年前
people respond to incentives.<p>how have the benefits of membership in the Elks lodge or the FreeMasons (or whatever) changed since the 1970s?
coop-throwaway超过 7 年前
The dating market for men has become extremely difficult over the last few years (lots of factors for that), more and more men are unable to find a mate. Men are less inviting of other men from my observation as they are in deep competition with each other -- why risk having another man around when he might take your girl or reduce your chances? Apps, dating sites, clubs, and events are filled with men looking for women, don&#x27;t expect them to be cooperative with you, you are their compitition.<p>I believe this is a factor in men becoming less cooperative.
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