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Makani Power, a Google funded wind energy startup, comes out of stealth

155 点作者 miratrix将近 15 年前

26 条评论

jacquesm将近 15 年前
Wow, where to begin. First off, I'm really happy that Google continues to fund energy related start-ups, their solar and wind efforts are commendable.<p>Also, I'm fairly sure that the engineers behind this project are top notch and giving this project all they've got, it sure looks like they have picked some interesting challenges.<p>That said, I don't think this will ever 'fly' (pun intended) on any appreciable scale.<p>Wind is a fickle thing, and if you look at the design parameters of even the smallest windmills you realize that it takes bullet proof engineering to get a windmill to operate at all for any stretch of time without catastrophe, tying one to a kite seems to compound those problems to the point where even if the power generated were substantially higher than that on the ground you'd still be left with a higher per KW bill. Being able to operate in places where windmills are otherwise not viable is nice, but at 600 meters above the ground there will be substantial risk from getting kits entangled so the closest spacing will probably be such that a 'farm' of these will generate relatively little power for a given area of the planet over which the kites fly.<p>1 MW seems to be a pretty ambitious goal for a first setup, think about it, a 1 MW turbine sitting on the other side of a line will pull on the tether with a very impressive force, the kite will have to pull aloft a tether strong enough to withstand that force and up to 600 meters of power transmission cabling. These are not simple challenges. What I don't understand is why they don't build a 10 KW or so scale model and gain experience from that before going for a full MW, even a 10KW system flown for a year or two would give them plenty of experimental data to help design a larger one.<p>Then there are the liability issues, windmill towers are pretty solid and yet they've been known to fail. I figure the failure rate of kite lines+power lines would be substantially higher than that of a tower and so you'd have to contend with the occasional free flying kite+windmill combination.<p>All that said I wish these folks best of luck with what they're doing, but unlike the cheap solar panel revolution I highly doubt that this will ever be deployed at a scale large enough to be notable. Neat project though!
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dalton将近 15 年前
I used to live in a co-op with Corwin (the CEO/CTO). The main thing I remember about him was that he was really into kite surfing.<p>He was also scary smart and about as good of a mechanical engineer PhD as I have ever met.<p>Him being the CEO/CTO of makani makes a whole lot of sense.<p>Good luck, makani!
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troygoode将近 15 年前
<i>"Makani AWTs will produce energy at an unsubsidized real cost competitive with coal-fired power plants, the current benchmark of the lowest cost source of power."</i><p>If this is true, it could be huge. Would these be deployable basically anywhere that is reasonably open?
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cmurphycode将近 15 年前
This looks pretty interesting. They have some nice explanations of their concept- particularly the fundamentals link: <a href="http://www.makanipower.com/concept/fundamentals/" rel="nofollow">http://www.makanipower.com/concept/fundamentals/</a><p>It looks pretty complex, but if the numbers work out right, this is probably the cheapest way to tap into the great winds available high in the sky.
tlack将近 15 年前
It's an interesting idea (more wind higher up, without the expensive tall shaft required for a regular wind turbine), but how does it get relaunched when it falls to the ground? Wouldn't a balloon or regular kite be simpler and just as effective?
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tsally将近 15 年前
The anser to the FAQ "Will this harm birds or bats?" was obviously crafted with the careful help of a PR and Legal team. :-p<p><a href="http://www.makanipower.com/faq/faq/#2" rel="nofollow">http://www.makanipower.com/faq/faq/#2</a>
aufreak3将近 15 年前
The contrarian in me has always been curious about how tapping "eco friendly" energy sources impact the environment. (Any here have some serious pointers?)<p>For example, if the energy of the wind at high altitudes is tapped, the wind will (duh) lose its force. How will that impact weather systems?<p>Same for solar power - we'll be trapping radiation that will otherwise be reflected back into space. How does this affect thermodynamic equilibrium?<p>Same for geothermal energy - how does it affect deep-earth physics?<p>Maybe the effects in these cases are indeed linear in the small - like taking a drink from a river, but it is hard to be sure about whether they can be scaled with continued linear behaviour. Just as with fossil fuels ... one car probably didn't do much damage. 8 orders of magnitude later, its a different story altogether.
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keeptrying将近 15 年前
This is an incredible idea and an amazing feat of engineering. I'm sure they'll face huge challenges in deploying this thing but it just shows that real engineering is still alive. Damn, makes me wanna break out my fluid mechanics textbook :).
extension将近 15 年前
Did they convert a fire engine into a mobile ground station?<p><a href="http://www.makanipower.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/IMG_7011.jpg" rel="nofollow">http://www.makanipower.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/IMG_70...</a><p>EDIT: yup<p><a href="http://www.makanipower.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/20100610-IMG_2189.jpg" rel="nofollow">http://www.makanipower.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/201006...</a>
hop将近 15 年前
This looks way better than than the giant fixed turbines they are putting in Eastern Oregon which cost $2.4 million a pop, interrupt the view, and can't pay for themselves.<p>It's also funny Oregon has abundant hydroelectric power, but subsidizes these wind projects with rate hikes and taxes - while selling billions of dollars of these electrons to California at market rates.
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jamie将近 15 年前
I thought this was Saul Griffith's startup, but I see no mention of him on the about page. At his Long Now talk last year, I recall him talking about Makani as being his new effort.<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saul_Griffith" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saul_Griffith</a><p>Saul seems totally awesome; his Long Now talk "Climate Change Revisited" was a fantastic survey of alternative energy solutions, and how no one was the answer, but that a cocktail of solutions is. His ability to put big numbers in context was stunning, especially his equating of industrial output in the US pre-WWII to the effort required to build wind turbines to cover half the usage of the current US electricity grid.<p>Here's the video of the talk: <a href="http://fora.tv/2009/01/16/Saul_Griffith_Climate_Change_Recalculated" rel="nofollow">http://fora.tv/2009/01/16/Saul_Griffith_Climate_Change_Recal...</a>
goooooaaaalll将近 15 年前
Joby Energy is another company in the area working on this problem. <a href="http://www.jobyenergy.com/" rel="nofollow">http://www.jobyenergy.com/</a>
hartror将近 15 年前
This idea has been batted around for a while and in fact the biggest risk to getting a project like this aloft will be regulators like the FAA.
thibaut_barrere将近 15 年前
The concept looks amazing!<p>I'm a bit concerned about how to protect human lives around - will it be required to forbid access to a large area ?<p>The FAQ states that the peak altitude is 600 meter. Does that mean a circle with a radius of 600m must be protected ?<p>Pretty sure they thought of it already, it looks like a well thought out project, I'm just wondering.
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tjlynn将近 15 年前
Since this is a hacker site, any control theorists in the house? From observation and experience, controlling a tethered airplane is the most pressing technical challenge facing the team right now. Anyone ever modeled the dynamics of a glider or a turboprop?
mdolon将近 15 年前
The only question I have is: how does it deal with harsh weather? Especially with offshore setups where storms are frequent, can it handle high winds and strong waves?<p>Overall it's an incredible step towards innovation in energy, kudos to the entire team.
smhinsey将近 15 年前
They are mentioned on Discovery Channel's Powering the Future. I believe it was Saturday's episode. It has interviews and demos. No mention of Google but they do say they feel their problem is control systems for the kites, not the actual energy generation.
known将近 15 年前
Hope Google also invests in solar powered <a href="http://www.bogolight.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=BOGO-BUYONESN2&#38;Show=TechSpecs" rel="nofollow">http://www.bogolight.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=BOGO...</a>
aheilbut将近 15 年前
What happens when the wind stops blowing or changes direction?
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wooster将近 15 年前
So, uh, a bunch of my friends are working on this:<p><a href="http://www.jobyenergy.com/" rel="nofollow">http://www.jobyenergy.com/</a><p>Which is pretty awesome.
yuan将近 15 年前
If they can make it work, this could be perfect for powering ships, too.
ph0rque将近 15 年前
So, does the M1 produce 1 MW on average, or peak?
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daychilde将近 15 年前
So... do they makani power?
borism将近 15 年前
Rotors are tiny compared to conventional wind turbines. Even with six of them, just no comparison. Sure they harvest the wind much higher and it flys in circles quite fast, but I'm not quite sure how they'll be able to generate 1MW with on of those production things. It has the wingspan of B737!<p>It's a neat idea, but do benefits outweigh problems?
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noverloop将近 15 年前
my nephew got recruited by a similar wind startup.<p><a href="http://www.jobyenergy.com/tech" rel="nofollow">http://www.jobyenergy.com/tech</a>
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CptMauli将近 15 年前
This will not work. It uses too much space and It looks like it will need repairs or at least maintenance all the time.