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German hate speech law tested as Twitter blocks satire account

139 点作者 mh-cx超过 7 年前

15 条评论

danschumann超过 7 年前
The problem with hate speech laws are, it means you can&#x27;t insult everyone equally. If you call someone stupid, they could accuse you of a crime, but you&#x27;re not calling them stupid because of their race.<p>And I want people who actually are racist to talk, so I know who I don&#x27;t want to be friends with. If they&#x27;re all keeping their racist opinions to themselves, I might waste a bunch of time being their friends. And I can&#x27;t correct them when they&#x27;re wrong if they don&#x27;t expose their opinions.<p>And what about having an argument? Someone could accuse you of a crime if they misinterpret what you say. That&#x27;s the real problem here. You can say something with no hateful intent, but people can interpret it with vigorous hate. It&#x27;s a really stupid law.
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olivermarks超过 7 年前
That term &#x27;hate speech&#x27; - what does it actually mean?<p>This seems like another assault on free speech to me and there is a danger in limiting the online Overton Window to a massive bland snooze fest.<p>The current joy of the internet is being able to read all sorts of perspectives from &#x27;sensible&#x27; to radical and I really hope that continues...I worry for all the citizen journalists and investigators who have been so magnificent in the current western &#x27;glasnost&#x27; era online...<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Overton_window" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Overton_window</a>
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everdev超过 7 年前
This is exactly the moral dilemma with free speech vs hate speech.<p>Do you use fascist techniques like criminalizing speech to stop the spread of fascist ideas? Or do you simply hope fascist ideas don&#x27;t take hold?<p>The former is a scary slippery slope but Germany doesn&#x27;t have a great track record with the latter.
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shaki-dora超过 7 年前
That&#x27;s obviously stupid. But it&#x27;s day two, and Twitter is likely to get their procedures in order, just like they (and Facebook etc) have previously done when implementing their own content policies.<p>The law applies only to a narrowly defined class of hate speech. Statements that fall under the definition have always been illegal. People always ran the risk of prosecution when calling for genocide etc.<p>As such, nobody&#x27;s freedom of speech is more limited today than it was a week ago. What the law tries to accomplish is similar to the DMCA, i. e. to force companies to take steps to address criminal activity on their platforms when such is reported.<p>I know there are many who disagree with laws limiting hate speech. But this is not that debate.
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Grollicus超过 7 年前
LOL they managed to get reuters.<p>Banning messages via NetzDG is on message basis, that means single tweets get removed.<p>Here a whole account got banned which is twitter SOP when accounts violate their TOS.<p>Because the new NetzDG came into effect this month now every media in germany is confused. Seems like the international ones follow suit.<p>Also the Titanic account (the satire account) got - wrongly - banned some time before so it propably was some kind of repeat offender thing
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cmurf超过 7 年前
Twitter&#x27;s TOS cannot be taken seriously when it comes to abusive speech. They apply their rules arbitrarily.<p>While I think it&#x27;s never inappropriate to punch a Nazi (self avowed variety anyway), I&#x27;m definitely on the side of letting Nazis have free speech. It&#x27;s best when the cockroaches are scurrying around in public, rather than hiding in the wood work. And as it turns out, the U.S. has a long history of fascists engaged in crimes, theft and murder, and have plotted the overthrow of the government - same as Germany where these ideas are illegal.<p>So which method actually inhibits Nazis? Neither. But at least one is cheaper, and at least with one you&#x27;ve got an example that most every one else, not merely just the government, will point to as what not to be. Unless you wanna get punched.
blattimwind超过 7 年前
The NetzDG in its current form is a disgrace for the state of law. I think an improvement in this area would be needed, but the NetzDG law is mind-boggingly stupid and inaccurately formulated.
nwatson超过 7 年前
Whether the satirical Twitter account should be shut down or not ... satire&#x27;s not very effective per Malcolm Gladwell&#x27;s &quot;Revisionist History&quot; podcast at [0] (automated lossy transcript at [1]) ... targets of the satire often find the satire humorous themselves, and can find enough &quot;truth&quot; in exaggerated viewpoints to reinforce those views rather than call them into question.<p>[0] <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;revisionisthistory.com&#x2F;episodes&#x2F;10-the-satire-paradox" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;revisionisthistory.com&#x2F;episodes&#x2F;10-the-satire-paradox</a> [1] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;blog.simonsays.ai&#x2F;satire-paradox-with-malcolm-gladwell-s2-e10-revisionist-history-podcast-transcript-37119b0bf8ae" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;blog.simonsays.ai&#x2F;satire-paradox-with-malcolm-gladwe...</a>
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akerro超过 7 年前
Ha, great!<p>^ see what I did there? One will say I support censorship, other will say it was sarcasm, another will stay silent.
yoz-y超过 7 年前
Wait but... isn&#x27;t this journal considered &quot;newsworthy&quot; and thus able to publish whatever they want? There is at least one person out there publishing hate speech in a non-satirical way and getting away with it on an almost daily basis.
theafroc超过 7 年前
Free speech doesn’t mean the right to be on twitter
singularity2001超过 7 年前
Is there a social media in Germany that does not censor?
randyrand超过 7 年前
I&#x27;m so very glad the USA founders made the first amendment. Other countries are not as lucky as we are.
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aceofspad4s超过 7 年前
Heh, I still can&#x27;t believe they have &quot;outlawed racism&quot;. That&#x27;s like outlawing any other political opinion. How is that possible?
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wildmusings超过 7 年前
Show me a committee you think qualified to determine what is hate speech, and I will show you a group fallen men, like the rest of us, who will ultimately abuse their power for political ends.
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