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Escaping Poverty Requires Almost 20 Years with Nearly Nothing Going Wrong

224 点作者 monsieurpng大约 7 年前

18 条评论

temp-dude-87844大约 7 年前
The article is a book teaser for <i>The Vanishing Middle Class: Prejudice and Power in a Dual Economy</i>, by Peter Temin at MIT. The central point, he argues, is that the top 20% professional-and-up top crust of American society has enacted structural gatekeeping processes like many years of education, and low minimum wages to systematically repress groups by race.<p>From an economist, this is a surprisingly racial thesis, where a simple economic one would do: close the door on others after they&#x27;re already in the castle. You can see this play out everywhere, from how &#x27;disruption&#x27; pivots to regulatory capture, from how homeowners fiercely guard their property values, and society self-sorts into cohorts of similar income and circumstance.<p>We&#x27;ve seen in recent years with working-class people&#x27;s backlash against neoliberal ideas of governance and trade, in Europe and the US, that the economics notion that growth creates wealth at all levels, and wealth isn&#x27;t a zero-sum game, is a perception not widely shared among everyday people. The fact is, most people perceive wealth solely in relative terms: are they better off than their neighbors, or people with similar life circumstances? Or are they plagued by the same anxiety and insecurity as people they always thought of as poorer than them?<p>Race plays into this, sure, but more in terms of shared history or the lack thereof, and of being a convenient visually-obvious indicator for a dimension of difference. The people fighting for the scraps below try to band together along dimensions they find relatable -- similar upbringing, comparable treatment by the same sorts of people, similar biases, similar goals and struggles, and race often correlates with enough difference in these life circumstances to interfere with relatability. Conversely, outside of the upper crust of society, different groups all quest for the same opportunities, where victory of one group is quite often to the economic detriment of another. Simply, every group is trying to keep another out. Those whose families have recently ascended to economic security have a vested interest in keeping large waves of additional risers out, while those competing for opportunities to be upwardly mobile are fighting over limited capacity in education, employment, and housing.
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lifeisstillgood大约 7 年前
I call this the Michael Caine, Sean Connery and Tom Jones effect. In the 1910s Britain was a viciously divided society - with poverty gaps greater than the US sees now. The Great Depression was somewhat levelling but children born in the East End of London, Glasgow&#x27;s Gorbals, or the rural poverty of Welsh valleys had desperately worse outcomes than those in the middle classes. (Can you guess where each of the celebrities was born and raised ? :-)<p>Then came a war that threatened to cut off our food supplies (Nazi UBoats sank horrifying tonnage of shipping), and to combat it a simple solution was found cutting through generations of political baggage - rationing. Every citizen got given a minimum set of healthy food (like two eggs a week, a pound of meat etc etc).<p>For some this was government over-reach - for others it was the first time in their lives they had eaten properly. After the war, a Labour government introduced a welfare state that prescribed a minimum amount of food, education, healthcare in an on going fashion.<p>And what did we get 20 years later? We got tall strong good looking actors and singers who came to dominate their niches and did so without the rickkets, malnourishment and disadvantages that had been their older brothers lot. We got similar results in medicine, science and business, with each area finding their own James Bond, drawn from a much wider pool of talent.<p>In short we fed our underclass and turbo charged our growth in the post war period.<p>In my view there is a bottle labelled &quot;nitro&quot; attached to the American Economy that has yet to be turned on. The knob does have razor blades attached to cut whichever politician tries to turn it, but folks, it will be worth it, 20&#x27;years from now
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bdcravens大约 7 年前
(anecdotal data point) I grew up in a very poor family. (Like electricity-or-food, owned no car my entire childhood poor) Always had a love for technology, however, and bought my first used computer (old 286) at 18. (1995) Bought my first Windows machine 2 years later. Was always learning and writing code - school machines, graphing calculator, my computer etc. In 1998 got first &quot;tech job&quot; doing phone support for ISP&#x2F;computer store in little rural town in Oklahoma. Starting doing web sites for them, then learned server-side (ColdFusion), and by early 2000 was doing contract work in Houston at typical rates. Definitely broke out of poverty, and along the way, made some very dumb mistakes (as well as significant medical costs). Still not in poverty.<p>Counterpoints: my aunt&#x27;s family was middle class and all educators, so I had a great example within arm&#x27;s reach. I&#x27;m also a white male, so don&#x27;t have some of the social issues that would hindered me otherwise.
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seymour333大约 7 年前
Personally what I find the most frustrating is finally escaping poverty and getting pushed firmly against an artificial, middle-class, ceiling where it isn&#x27;t possible to become more financially free because of constant inflation and the choice I made to contribute to society by having a family. Meanwhile productivity and profitability continue to increase
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poster123大约 7 年前
&quot;Temin argues that, following decades of growing inequality, America is now left with what is more or less a two-class system: One small, predominantly white upper class that wields a disproportionate share of money, power, and political influence&quot;<p>Temin avoids mentioning Asians, who have a higher average income than whites, despite many being relative newcomers to the country. That would undermine the narrative of a static class structure.
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vinceguidry大约 7 年前
&gt; The MIT economist Peter Temin argues that economic inequality results in two distinct classes. And only one of them has any power.<p>Nobody studies history anymore. This has always been the case, and the ratio of haves to have-nots has only improved with time, as has the quality of life of the have-nots. That ratio may have been a little better in the golden years after WW2 in the USA, but it&#x27;s still way better now than it ever was before WW2.<p>Modernity truly is the tide that lifted all boats.
soared大约 7 年前
&gt;upper class of FTE workers ... has strategically pushed for policies ...to bolster the economic success of some groups and not others, largely along racial lines<p>&gt; His final recommendation is to address systemic racism<p>Not a good start from Temin. Its not like the entire upper class is outwardly racist like the first quote implies. If you want to reduce racial&#x2F;class divides, maybe making the upper class appear to be a purposefully racist enemy isn&#x27;t the best way to go.
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xivzgrev大约 7 年前
I don&#x27;t think there is a mass conspiracy going on. I do think there are disvirtuous circles going on. Ex one school is located in a bad area over time gets less funding, becomes less attractive, fewer people with means want to send their children there, school gets less funding etc.<p>It&#x27;s not just rich people who oppose poor people. It&#x27;s also poor people. Think of the guy who is scraping to get ahead and sees someone he knows totally taking advantage of the system and not working, or is involved in criminal activity. This was a good article on it: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.google.com&#x2F;url?sa=t&amp;source=web&amp;rct=j&amp;url=http:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.cracked.com&#x2F;blog&#x2F;why-we-cant-stop-hating-poor&#x2F;&amp;ved=2ahUKEwjd08D42q3aAhUIvlMKHV31CeoQFjABegQIBxAB&amp;usg=AOvVaw39P5_o6d_CBFjSzR2xfhSM" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.google.com&#x2F;url?sa=t&amp;source=web&amp;rct=j&amp;url=http:&#x2F;&#x2F;...</a>
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bigjimslade大约 7 年前
Ok the linked article seems to be a short synopsis of a book, one which I did not read nor have intention to.<p>But dear Lord the article was so full of government fluff, obvious and trite blather of what has been tried and failed, over, and over, and over again.<p>It is nothing but why we need government to fix the very problems it created, and makes even worse with its choking regulations, legislation, and self-serving laws.<p>My very own grandfather broke into the roofing business around age 11, growing up in abject poverty. He didn&#x27;t much care for sitting in a school house. He made a good living eventually, becoming one of the largest employers in town, a respected local businessman who would hire anyone willing to work, and give them a fair shot.<p>Today, though, his life would be completely unable to be lived, legally, anyway. Between the government&#x27;s silly attempts at paperwork for immigration tracking, taxes, labor laws, minimum wage laws, the list goes on and on and on, it would be impossible. The barriers to entry for the poor but motivated ensure nothing more than the permanent existence of the poor.<p>The article is frankly disgusting in its puerile and obviously wrong insistence that what we need is more of the above.
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justherefortart大约 7 年前
The hardest part is changing people&#x27;s patterns when they get money (I have this same issue to a lesser degree than my friends that had poorer childhood experiences).<p>That spend it before you lose it thing is really difficult to overcome.
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johnrichardson大约 7 年前
I don&#x27;t see the word &#x27;IQ&#x27; mentioned anywhere in that article. And yet, it&#x27;s the single biggest determinant of lifetime success. Unfortunately, it&#x27;s also highly heritable, so environmental interventions have a fairly marginal effect on it.
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mr_overalls大约 7 年前
From the article: &gt; The first are skilled, tech-savvy workers and managers with college degrees and high salaries who are concentrated heavily in fields such as finance, technology, and electronics—hence his labeling it the “FTE sector.”<p>Am I the only one who&#x27;s wondering why &quot;electronics&quot; is its own category, instead of being lumped under &quot;technology&quot;?
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noetic_techy大约 7 年前
&gt; That’s a 16-year (or longer) plan that, as Temin compellingly observes, can be easily upended.<p>I personally think the entire college level education system needs a do-over. Stop requiring people to get expensive degrees, when a decently accredited micro degree system would work. Who gives a fuck if you&#x27;re more well rounded coming out of college when you&#x27;re in massive student loan debt. You just created a giant glass ceiling that keeps the poor who are trying to break through even poorer. A handful of Ivy League Universities should be for the elites and the rest of us should have the option to bypass this system altogether. I&#x27;m one of these FTE&#x27;s, and I look back at my college degree as 30% worth the time, and 70% a waste of time, and all of that time cost me a lot.
RickJWagner大约 7 年前
According to the non-profit Brookings Institute, there are 3 keys to avoiding poverty. (Of those that follow these rules, only 2% are in poverty.)<p>- At least finish high school - Get a full-time job - Wait until age 21 to get married and have children<p>We should all be committed to spreading this message.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.brookings.edu&#x2F;opinions&#x2F;three-simple-rules-poor-teens-should-follow-to-join-the-middle-class&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.brookings.edu&#x2F;opinions&#x2F;three-simple-rules-poor-t...</a>
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RickJWagner大约 7 年前
According to the non-profit Brookings Institute, there are 3 simple rules to avoid poverty:<p>- At least finish high school - Get a full-time job - Wait until age 21 to get married and have children<p>Of those that follow these 3 rules, only 2% are still in poverty.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.brookings.edu&#x2F;opinions&#x2F;three-simple-rules-poor-teens-should-follow-to-join-the-middle-class&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.brookings.edu&#x2F;opinions&#x2F;three-simple-rules-poor-t...</a>
internetman55大约 7 年前
I&#x27;m sure white people do control a lot of jobs or whatever, but I&#x27;m still always confused about people talking about white males in tech or techbros etc. when probably 50-75% of my coworkers (F50 tech company) were Asian (note that whites make up 75% of the population and Asians 5% by the 2010-2015 census data i found on wikipedia)
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turc1656大约 7 年前
The first sentence already contains a lie. <i>&quot;A lot of factors have contributed to American inequality: slavery, economic policy, technological change, the power of lobbying, globalization, and so on.&quot;</i> Slavery ended more than 150 years ago. To claim that it is a contributing factor to <i>current</i> economic inequality is absurd. Racism and discrimination, sure. But not slavery.
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randyrand大约 7 年前
As Ben Shapiro likes to say, to move out of poverty you have to do 3 things. 1. graduate high school. 2. get a job. 3. don&#x27;t have kinds until you are married. If you do those 3 things you will not stay in poverty 99.8% of the time.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=cdEMw_lDUx0" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=cdEMw_lDUx0</a><p>Also, the headline does not ever appear in the article itself. huh?
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