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Launch HN: Point (YC W19) – First Debit Card with Points

94 点作者 patrickmro大约 6 年前
Hi HN community,<p>We’re Patrick, Kenan, and Sid, the founders of Point (<a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;trypointbank.com" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;trypointbank.com</a>), a consumer digital bank focused on rewards. After being fed up with the poor customer experience and tactics of traditional banks, we did some digging into why we put up with our own subpar banks. We&#x27;ve discovered that the way most people end up with their current bank is by default (ex: parents set it up for them), rather than by choice. The complete opposite was the case for credit cards; credit cards were actually chosen based on their qualities.<p>We began to wonder why a solution that combined the rewards and benefits of a credit card, with the simplicity of a bank account didn’t exist. After extensive research and testing of various existing products, we determined that everything came up short for our personal needs. That was the problem.<p>Whether it was simply the lack of a clean mobile user experience, or rewards that were relevant, nothing managed to fit the bill. Since banks are a fundamental part of our everyday modern lives, we shouldn’t have to settle for a less-than-stellar experience just because that’s the current standard. That’s when we realized, we don’t have to settle. This was an exciting enough realization for us all to quit our day jobs as product managers, designers, and engineers. We decided we needed to create a revolutionary bank.<p>In order to solve this problem, we created a new-and-improved debit card. We are focusing our efforts on debit because it is currently the most popular payment method. Although debit is the preferred method, in the real world, there is little incentive to use one over the perks offered by credit cards. This unfortunately leads the majority of the dissatisfied group to settle for credit cards, with their offer of limited perks that typically come hand-in-hand with unavoidable debt.<p>Our business model is sustainable because we are partnered with a smaller regional bank and don’t have the hefty over head of a branch network. The reason we don’t see larger banks offering debit cards with rewards is because of the &quot;Durbin Act”; a federal mandate which slashed interchange margins of banks with more than $10 billion in deposits. This was done in order to protect consumers and merchants from increasing and predatory prices that banks were trying to instill.<p>If successful in our mission we hope to keep the up and comers out of un-necessary credit cards and raise the standards of user experience for banks. There is no reason why dealing with your bank should be as dreadful as the DMV.<p>We look forward to hearing your thoughts on what we are building and are open to any and all suggestions. Feel free to drop us a line at hello@trypointbank.com and check out our waitlist on our landing page.

44 条评论

jwr大约 6 年前
Ok, so here&#x27;s my take on most new debit card and checking account offerings.<p>Things I do not care about:<p>* points and loyalty programs * measly 2% APR * tracking my spending habits * how the card looks<p>Things I do care about:<p>* a card that works and gets accepted (no spurious declines because the bank thought so) * a card that works with Apple Pay (hi Revolut) * no nags, upsells, emojis, animated GIFs, or other teenager stuff (hi Revolut) * do not waste my time * have secure online access (as in, do not use SMS for 2-factor auth, because really) * ability to issue new cards quickly * ability to change my address quickly, even if I move to a different country * whether the company will disappear and&#x2F;or steal my money (don&#x27;t laugh, this happens, and recent Revolut scrutiny scares me)<p>In other words, I am looking for no-nonsense banking, and a debit card is just a small part of it.<p>This offering, unfortunately, seems to bring nothing new compared to Revolut.
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ferrisford大约 6 年前
I&#x27;ve seen debit card&#x27;s with a points system at a credit union (just sharing so you can research) <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.redwoodcu.org&#x2F;personal&#x2F;redwood-rewards" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.redwoodcu.org&#x2F;personal&#x2F;redwood-rewards</a> I have no affiliation with them, had just been researching something similar a few months back.<p>I don&#x27;t personally want to use a debit card for my everyday purchases, mostly for security reasons. I figure if I only use a credit card, then if the card gets compromised I can argue with my bank over the charges rather than asking them to put money back in my checking account while the fraud is investigated. Cashback on purchases is just icing on the cake.
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iooi大约 6 年前
Most credit cards have sign up bonuses worth a couple hundred dollars in points, that&#x27;s definitely something to consider for your customer acquisition.<p>Not sure how you&#x27;re going to compete in terms of CAC when banks are spending so much on this already.<p>Also, MR and UR points are transferrable to a ton of partners -- not all points are created equally, MR and UR points are some of the best at 2cpp.<p>Overall, since you&#x27;re comparing yourself with the CSR, I would much rather get a CSR with 50K UR point bonus which is worth $750 in travel. I also get $300 in travel benefits, and I can cancel the card later to avoid the second AF from hitting. And finally, I earn points faster since it&#x27;s 3x on travel and dining.
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isoskeles大约 6 年前
&gt; The reason we don’t see larger banks offering debit cards with rewards is because of the &quot;Durbin Act”; a federal mandate which slashed interchange margins of banks with more than $10 billion in deposits. This was done in order to protect consumers and merchants from increasing and predatory prices that banks were trying to instill.<p>OOC, will this limit your growth in the long-term? What happens if you grow beyond $10B in deposits? Is the plan to partner with other small regional banks that have less than $10B in deposits, and does that circumvent the &quot;Durbin Act&quot;?
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sosodev大约 6 年前
I&#x27;m not sure I see the value proposition. Currently my bank (Alliant Credit Union) gives 2.08% on my savings and .648% on my checking. I&#x27;d say they&#x27;re very reasonable with their fees considering I don&#x27;t think I&#x27;ve ever gotten one.<p>For rewards I&#x27;d just use my credit card which is arguably better for daily transactions anyway. My bank even offers a credit card with 3% cash back in the first year and 2.5% after that.<p>So why would I use Point over already existing and arguably better solutions?
bravura大约 6 年前
Why should I prefer a debit card over a credit card, when fraud protections are so much better on a credit card?
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RandallBrown大约 6 年前
My Chase debit card has had rewards for over a decade. How is this going to be better?
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alehul大约 6 年前
Hey there!<p>What is the value of a point? You say &#x27;2x points,&#x27; but I can&#x27;t find the value of a point anywhere on your website. Is it one cent = one point? How do we redeem points?<p>That aside, love the design and concept. :)
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the_watcher大约 6 年前
A few questions:<p>* What&#x27;s the ATM network that you&#x27;re using with no fees? Since I have good rewards credit cards that I can pay off every month, my debit card is essentially just for accessing cash and paying the very few bills I have that won&#x27;t take a credit card, my debit card choice is entirely related to &quot;no ATM fees, anywhere in the US.&quot;<p>* I&#x27;m a little confused about &quot;All-in-one&quot; including checking, savings, etc. Does that mean I&#x27;d get multiple accounts by default? Or does the debit card just pay HYS-competitive APY?
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ds大约 6 年前
Ive always wanted a better credit card to be honest. Something that had a insane amount of transfer partners, similar to how the starwood preferred guest card used to be. Something as simple as 1 point per dollar on everything and 2 points per dollar on dining&#x2F;gas. The ability to also throw in the benefits that amex&#x2F;chase cards offer would also be awesome (lounge access, return protection, roadside assistance, etc..) - I would switch to a card like that instantly. Im currently stuck putting all my spend on a American Airlines card, just because all the other options suck.<p>Now, with that said. I wouldn&#x27;t use this product. Its not listed what the &#x27;points&#x27; they give you do, so i can only imagine its nowhere near the value of being able to transfer them directly to airline or hotel partners. Im guessing its either a built in travel portal redemption they host or simply cashback. Either option is pretty garbage compared to other redemptions.<p>The interest is standard if you have a private bank, so its nice they give it to common folk, although i think many banks offer this now.<p>But most importantly, Using a debit card is risky. It lacks the chargeback and other protections a credit card has. (I could be wrong here, but I know it used to be this way a few years ago)<p>Anyways, dont take this as a negative guys. If anything, please continue improving your product and I will be a user. As it stands though, Its still lagging behind existing players.
Bluestrike2大约 6 年前
Minor suggestion: rework the &quot;Compare Point to Other Banks&quot; part of your homepage to better differentiate the two columns and explicitly identify which column is for which bank. While it&#x27;s obviously implied that Point is the one on the left with the more impressive point (ugh) in the comparison, at first glance it&#x27;s possible to miss that for a second until your brain catches up.
77yy77yy大约 6 年前
As well as <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.pointbank.com&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.pointbank.com&#x2F;</a><p>Rebrand in the making.
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jammygit大约 6 年前
I dont personally care about points, but I do care about being able to make purchases without wondering who my bank is selling&#x2F;trading the records to.<p>Points are manipulative anyway, they&#x27;re designed to make people spend&#x2F;do more than they ordinarily would. Eg, scene points, drug store points, credit card points, points in arcade games maybe even
martin-adams大约 6 年前
I don’t really have much to comment on the card itself. I’m from the UK and use a credit card for most spending due to the consumer protection it gives you.<p>One thing that I feel is extremely important, but not well executed in general is the budgeting. This does budgeting, but looking at it, I suspect it reports the categories of spending. The marketing site is somewhat vague at how that works. If that is correct, that’s reporting not budgeting. Budgeting is allocating your spending to predict and plan for the future.<p>A couple of years ago I switch to YNAB and it’s been a remarkable mindset change in how I manage money. I feel a lot of young people are missing out because they don’t have the education or tools at the bank level to do it right. Most people I know of all ages do bank balance budgeting.
kevinyun大约 6 年前
This is pretty sweet! Looks like it checks all the boxes of what I currently have spread across multiple accounts and apps:<p>* Savings (want sitting cash to make market-competitive interest) * Checkings with no monthly fee * Budgeting analysis (if you can integrate with other Banks via Plaid or something that would kill 5 birds in one stone) * No international fees * Dining&#x2F;travel points<p>## Questions:<p>* Do dining&#x2F;travel 2x points apply internationally? And any chance this can become 3x? * 30k ATMs... compared to Schwab, who credit all ATM fees, how reasonable is Point to work overseas in the same manner?) * How fast (business days) do transfers take? * When is launch? * Mobile Apps --&gt; do you support Android?<p>Great job, I think there&#x27;s definitely something here.
koolba大约 6 年前
Is this a debit card that transacts as a credit card? ie you validate the balance on the spot, approve or reject the transaction immediately, and then run the transaction on the network as a credit card so you can charge credit card rates? (Enough for rewards)
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epodox大约 6 年前
Hello,<p>I signed up for your waiting list. I was redirected to a page with my current position in your queue. I have since lost that link and dont see a way to get back to it on your website. Can you provide a link on how to get back to this list?<p>Thank you, Joshua
arosier大约 6 年前
How do you plan on dealing with the nightmare of the other organization in the finance space that is named &quot;Point&quot; <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;point.com" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;point.com</a>?
kevindong大约 6 年前
Your website mentions that a customer would receive 2x points on travel&#x2F;dining which raises the questions of:<p>1. how many points are received on non travel&#x2F;dining purchases?<p>2. what&#x27;s the value of 1 point?
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motivated_gear大约 6 年前
You mentioned the Durbin act which limit debit card fees. Since you&#x27;re exempt from it, I assume you&#x27;ll be jacking up fees for merchants in order to pay for your rewards program which is basically just a credit card.<p>This might not be a large enough of a pain point to be viable. Actually it might be detrimental to consumers who are living paycheck to paycheck. They rely on an incremental paycheck and short term credit fills the void.
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not_a_moth大约 6 年前
&quot;2x points&quot; is advertised front and center, but since I couldn&#x27;t find information on how they can be used or redeemed, I&#x27;m not sure if they are actually worth anything. For me, if you do not have, for example, airline transfer partners, I would not particularly value these points. FYI, optimizing for travel rewards is probably the #1 reason folks with a healthy disposable income use credit cards.
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keshwa01大约 6 年前
Congrats on the launch. I would have thought that instead of trying to convert existing CC holders, you would have a better shot at converting cash&#x2F;debit card holders who don&#x27;t have great alternatives. Often these people will have low credit scores, keeping them from the very best CC opps, but by linking to their cash balance, you can give them rewards without having to handle credit risk.
newscracker大约 6 年前
I read through all the marketing on the homepage and got to the end where it says it&#x27;s currently invitation only and that one can sign up for the waitlist. Where exactly is the link to the waitlist? I tapped all over that box and didn&#x27;t find any links. The contact link goes to Twitter, whereas your email address should be the main way to contact you (not everyone uses Twitter).
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Kye大约 6 年前
I couldn’t find anything about the partner bank on your site. Most people probably won’t care, but it matters to enough people to mention it.
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anonfunction大约 6 年前
Looking at the career section I noticed you&#x27;re backend stack consists of:<p>Node.js, Express, GraphQL Yoga, Prisma, PostgreSQL, Docker, and Fargate in AWS.<p>I&#x27;m wondering why you chose JS for a financial services org instead of a language that offers more safety in the sense of types and memory control such as Rust or Go?
elliekelly大约 6 年前
Very cool! There&#x27;s a lot about the banking industry that needs improvement so I&#x27;m always excited to see people trying something new. I&#x27;m curious if you have (or perhaps have applied for) one of the OCC&#x27;s new nondepository &quot;financial technology&quot; charters?
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eternalny1大约 6 年前
How does this compare to secured credit card offers?<p>Those are also backed by a linked bank account, and Discover offers good rewards:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.nerdwallet.com&#x2F;best&#x2F;credit-cards&#x2F;secured" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.nerdwallet.com&#x2F;best&#x2F;credit-cards&#x2F;secured</a>
opportune大约 6 年前
Will you be funding this with merchant fees? What about fraud protection, will it be as good as a credit card?<p>If the answers are &quot;yes&quot; and &quot;no&quot; it seems like there&#x27;s almost no reason for me to pick your card over a credit card right? Unless I&#x27;m missing something big.
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snr大约 6 年前
I bank with SoFi. 2.25% APY on a checking (like) account. $1.5M FDIC insured (not that I care&#x2F;need it). Access to practically ALL ATMs. Beautiful app.<p>I use Uber Visa Credit Card, which is free, which auto pays itself from my SoFi, with helluva lot benefits: 4x dining, 3x travel.<p>Why should I use Point?
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qv1x0te大约 6 年前
To reward your costumers for spending money is not exactly the same tactic of a traditional bank?
jwr大约 6 年前
&gt; because we are partnered with a smaller regional bank<p>This here is the problem. This industry is heavily regulated and dominated by behemoths. You can&#x27;t innovate when you are partnered with a whale. Sooner or later there will be an impedance mismatch.
dansoto大约 6 年前
It&#x27;s disheartening to join a waiting list then see that the top two spots are reserved by two of the founders. It makes you wonder how many other of their people are holding spots while we&#x27;re sitting at 2,000th in line :(
JimDabell大约 6 年前
Is this for Americans only? There&#x27;s no mention of availability on the website.
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chelovek89大约 6 年前
I think HN skews towards high income engineers who qualify for Chase Sapphires&#x2F;Amex Platinum. Theres definitely a dearth of good rewards card for lower income people so I can see why this is a great idea.
bluedino大约 6 年前
Why, when I can just use a credit card? What&#x27;s nex, checks with rewards?
wolco大约 6 年前
Do merchants pay 3% on debit card transactions similiar to credit cards.
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atdrummond大约 6 年前
Patrick - I&#x27;m in the payment services space. Do you have a phone number or email I can contact you at?
donpdonp大约 6 年前
Nice feature set. I&#x27;d also like to see an API&#x2F;Direct OFX access.
ninetax大约 6 年前
Loved the artwork so much, I impulse bought a print from Laura Berger!
thoughtstheseus大约 6 年前
I thought everyone used a CC just to build credit. Guess I was wrong.
truthhurt大约 6 年前
Should have mentioned synapsefi in the website because it&#x27;s big lie that they partner with this bank.<p>They really don&#x27;t partner with bank. They use synapsefi
Giorgi大约 6 年前
whaah? We have had debit cards in Georgia (Country) with points for years now. Maybe first in the US - Yes.
matz1大约 6 年前
Instead of giving cashback&#x2F;point, why don&#x27;t lower the transaction fee instead ?
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77yy77yy大约 6 年前
Point.com is in the business of financial services. Sounds like you chose a terrible name.