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Getting Started with Lisp in 2019

125 点作者 wheresvic3超过 5 年前

10 条评论

reikonomusha超过 5 年前
This is the document [0] we maintain for new Lisp hackers at Rigetti, where we use Common Lisp to build open source quantum software development tools. Following that, here’s the rundown of some basic Lisp nomenclature and how to edit in Emacs [1].<p>The article isn’t <i>bad</i>, but it also doesn’t provide you with a sustainable way to develop Lisp; interactive and incremental development together form a great proportion of value of using the language in the first place.<p>[0] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;rigetti&#x2F;qvm&#x2F;blob&#x2F;master&#x2F;doc&#x2F;lisp-setup.md" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;rigetti&#x2F;qvm&#x2F;blob&#x2F;master&#x2F;doc&#x2F;lisp-setup.md</a><p>[1] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;rigetti&#x2F;qvm&#x2F;blob&#x2F;master&#x2F;doc&#x2F;editing-and-running.md" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;github.com&#x2F;rigetti&#x2F;qvm&#x2F;blob&#x2F;master&#x2F;doc&#x2F;editing-and-r...</a><p>(PRs are welcome!)
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eatonphil超过 5 年前
I&#x27;m not a fan of Roswell or Portacle, personally, because I&#x27;m used to taking control of my setup. I try to stick with well-maintained distribution systems (e.g. Debian&#x27;s .deb or the source itself if need be) otherwise upgrades tend to be complex, not well documented, and supported by few people. Additionally, as one new to Common Lisp, it is difficult to understand the abstraction layer at which Roswell &amp; Portacle operate with respect to abstraction layers implicit to Common Lisp.<p>I better understood these layers by installing SBCL myself and playing with Quicklisp (a package manager) and ASDF (a package definition library). I wrote about this a year ago [0]. It was confusing at first. But it became clearer after exploring and writing that post. Ultimately I don&#x27;t find it very different than writing a Python library with setuptools.<p>re: SLIME; I never ended up remembering the keyboard shortcuts as a CL hobbyist so I turned it off after a few uses and stuck with vanilla Lisp-mode. Parenthesis completion and auto-ident are the only two tools I expect of my text editor (vs. in a GUI, buttons take the place of keyboard shortcuts you must remember). I use Emacs at work and home but I hardly remember any extension shortcuts (as much as I want to benefit from projectile and magit). It even took me a few years before I felt comfortable using package-install vs. just `git clone`-ing new modes and adding their paths to my .emacs.<p>For all these reasons, Portacle as a distribution isn&#x27;t really my style. Roswell didn&#x27;t solve anything for me either once I got familiar with ASDF and Quicklisp.<p>Complacency on tool UX doesn&#x27;t help a community. Roswell &amp; Portacle may be a forward iteration on UX. But I also want to share the fundamentals (or at least N-1 layer down) and get other hobbyists comfortable there too.<p>[0] <a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;notes.eatonphil.com&#x2F;starting-a-minimal-common-lisp-project.html" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;notes.eatonphil.com&#x2F;starting-a-minimal-common-lisp-pr...</a>
dtornabene超过 5 年前
Adding my own disagreement about using either portacle or roswell. If you&#x27;re running literally any widely used Linux distro, or {Free|Open}bsd you are a package install away from a working common lisp install. I&#x27;ve seen this come up alot in irc and reddit, this push to get people to use a C library (!) to get to common lisp, and its downright bizarre. If you&#x27;re that bent on packaging and C, use Guile or Gambit. And if you&#x27;re just a random person perusing this thread, just go download the simplest thing and get started, not slime (which is awesome) not Lem (which is fine), just lisp and a text editor
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TurboHaskal超过 5 年前
I would recommend to ignore Roswell and just install SBCL or CCL from your package manager. For a quick Emacs setup with good defaults, use Spacemacs with the common-lisp layer.<p>If you have never used Emacs I would just ask the LispWorks guys for an evaluation license. It&#x27;s the closest thing to experiencing one of those Lisp environments of the 80s (Emacs doesn&#x27;t come close). You&#x27;ll be impressed.
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verisimilitudes超过 5 年前
This article would have someone believe Common Lisp is any other UNIX language, where near-meaningless UNIX configuration and other things abound. It indents the Lisp in an odd fashion, with closing parentheses on their own lines, and it doesn&#x27;t mention the REPL but in one paragraph.<p>As for Steve Losh&#x27;s article, I don&#x27;t recommend that one either; it recommends using a Discord <i>server</i>; it recommends using C libraries; it discusses performance and representation characteristics that are allowed, but not required, in interfacing with things such as graphics cards; and it has other characteristics that I don&#x27;t believe someone new to Common Lisp would recognize it, so I don&#x27;t recommend that article to novice Common Lispers.
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pmoriarty超过 5 年前
I was very fortunate that my university had a ton of old Lisp books, and after browsing through a bunch of them I found some really good ones and learned from those. Unfortunately, I don&#x27;t remember the titles (though a book on CLOS stands out in my memory as being an excellent introduction to the awesome power of OO programming in Lisp), but if you have a university with a good comp sci library you may want to check it out.<p>Parenthetically, I don&#x27;t know if it&#x27;s true but I&#x27;d heard that there have been more books published on Lisp than all books on other programming languages combined.<p>I&#x27;d also recommend that anyone who starts out with Common Lisp give a modern Scheme (like Chicken, Racket, or Guile) a try. I found Scheme to be much more to my taste and once I learned it I viewed CL as quite backwards in many ways, so Scheme is what I use today if I can at all help it.<p>Finally, newbies should check out Emacs and eLisp. eLisp is more primitive than either CL or Scheme, but it&#x27;s still great when combined with Emacs, which you can customize and improve to your heart&#x27;s content. In addition, there&#x27;s a mountain of eLisp code to build on for you Emacs improvement projects. I came to eLisp after learning both CL and Scheme, so it was pretty easy to pick up, and that&#x27;s what I&#x27;d recommend others do too, just so you first learn what Lisp is truly capable of.
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iovrthoughtthis超过 5 年前
I’m not a fan of Roswell it’s self but I see the value. The LISP ecosystem is not bash centric as most languages today are.<p>It wraps everything it’s own cli which, while powerful break the common interface that most developers today have become accustomed to.<p>I know that I would have enjoyed a good bash cli interface for managing my lisp packages using some of the notions developed in ruby &#x2F; python &#x2F; javascript e.g. project local installs (quick-lisp i stalls packages globally by default), project lock files for versioning, package binaries &#x2F; commands (things like Rake, Rspec, NPM run scripts).<p>You can do all of this stuff with your lisp install it’s just more complicated and requires more steps.
madiathomas超过 5 年前
Each time I see a LISP related article on Hacker News, I always ask myself why LISP is so popular only on HN. This is the only website where I hear about LISP. Is LISP popular on HN because it brings advantages to the table or is it popular because it looks cool to say you use it, or something else?<p>Please help me understand. I am tempted to learn it but needs justification.
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pvaldes超过 5 年前
&gt; use roswell<p>or apt install cl-launch...
mac_was超过 5 年前
I can see Lisp is the ‘new’ React. Two years ago there were loads of articles about React, prior to that it was just Javascript. I can see people got enough of Javascript.
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