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DHH: The HEY stack Vanilla Ruby on Rails, MySQL, redis, stimulus, elastic search

266 点作者 Aduket将近 5 年前

31 条评论

epoch_100将近 5 年前
What I think is even more significant than Hey’s backend stack is its _frontend_ stack. There’s no complex JavaScript framework; it’s all server side rendered HTML with a few touches of lightweight JS (mostly Turbolinks and StimulusJS, afaik) on the client to add basic interactivity. And it feels just as fast—if not faster—than any other modern, well-built web app.<p>It goes to show that libraries like React and Vue are _not_ necessary to build smooth, modern, and fully-featured web interfaces.<p>Edit: removed mention of Angular because, yes, it’s a framework, not a view library.
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piazz将近 5 年前
Noteworthy how they tout the success of their &quot;magic&quot; frontend stack made with vanilla JS, lack of a trendy framework, etc. But if you use the app, the UX is fairly laggy, requires frequent refreshes, all the animations and interactions are off - the list goes on and on. It&#x27;s noticeably subpar (and I <i>like</i> Hey).<p>Seems to me that the proof is in the pudding wrt their stack, but it&#x27;s probably not what they wanted to prove. I would take a well tuned React SPA over this any day of the week.
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amrrs将近 5 年前
Idk,I actually don&#x27;t understand the obsession of many with Tech Stack or predicting the doom of a language. Because Facebook uses PHP for their service, Would you still use PHP? A lot of people despise PHP. But there&#x27;s PH maker Mubs, most of his indie products LAMP stack. The main lesson I get from any of these is that pick the one that you&#x27;re comfortable with and deliver the project than looking for what&#x27;s the best tool in 2020
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didip将近 5 年前
I am a huge fan of server side rendering with progressively enhancing Javascript. It simply feels right to me:<p><pre><code> * Search engine indexing works as expected. * Informational web pages don&#x27;t need a lot of interactivity anyway. * You don&#x27;t need crazy amount of build tools. * You don&#x27;t need extra browser extensions just to debug the JS. * If for some reason there&#x27;s one JS error, most of the pages are still functional. * I am unconvinced that SPA is faster than server side rendering. * Separation of concern is natural, business logic is handled by BFF, UI interaction is handled by JS. * If you super love Javascript, you can write the BFF in Node.js. </code></pre> I am glad that Hey is another high profile app exemplifying this.<p>I can&#x27;t wait for the pendulum to swing back.
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iamleppert将近 5 年前
I tried hey and was put off by its bulbous, fisher-price UI. Signing up and having to press &quot;next&quot; after every single bit of information they collected should have been my first clue at the brain-dead thinking that went into this product.<p>About the UI -- Why is there a trend in designers to add padding to an interface as a disguise for limited features? It&#x27;s like, does a button really need to to take up half the screen? Oh yeah, that&#x27;s right, it does if you only have a single feature.<p>Even the name is annoying. Hey is what you say to get someone&#x27;s attention in dating app.
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parhamn将近 5 年前
It’s rare for tech to be a determinant to a products success, which is why I’m confused at all the extrapolations here.<p>What’s working for Hey is years of brand development and marketing that allowed them to do such a hyped launch. It could’ve been written in php with jquery and it wouldn’t have made much a difference.
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ggregoire将近 5 年前
All the comments here are about frontend (which honestly comes as no surprise if you know a bit Basecamp [1]) but the interesting one for me is Kubernetes. It totally makes sense but I expected Basecamp to use something more &quot;old fashion&quot; (somehow like the rest of their stack).<p>[1] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;basecamp.com&#x2F;about&#x2F;open-source" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;basecamp.com&#x2F;about&#x2F;open-source</a>
JeremyNT将近 5 年前
I&#x27;ve switched to Stimulus since seeing a presentation on it at last year&#x27;s Railsconf and it has been a real joy to use.<p>This is really the bit Rails was lacking for a long time. JS always felt like a second class citizen in Rails before, but webpacker finally brings the two worlds together in a way that makes sense. And with Stimulus, I actually find it a joy to write well organized js that is easy to reuse across my app. It&#x27;s minimal, but just opinionated enough to keep me from mucking things up badly, the way I did in the asset pipeline days.<p>I wish Stimulus got more attention. It really is all most web sites need, and it works so well with the well proven Rails way of server side html added to judicious js. It&#x27;s also a good tool to use as glue while you migrate legacy js over from the asset pipeline, you can just load your old js in a Stimulus controller and go.<p>I kind of wish Basecamp would promote it more, maybe even optionally bundle it with Rails, because it really is the missing piece that almost any Rails app could take advantage of. Having a little more guidance here would really help new Rails developers :)
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jimnotgym将近 5 年前
Am I misreading something, or can you only use a *@hey.com address and not your own domain? So if Hey lock you out you potentially lose access to all of the accounts you set up using that address. PayPal can&#x27;t send their 1 time code, your bank can&#x27;t reset your login. Your password manager can&#x27;t do 2fa. If you own the domain you can switch there dns to someone else and regain your life. If you don&#x27;t own the domain to your main email you are running a risk I wouldn&#x27;t run.
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drewda将近 5 年前
Ruby on Rails is the stack I&#x27;ve felt most comfortable in for well over a decade and it&#x27;s always great to see it&#x27;s continued progress!<p>That said, I do think it&#x27;s unfortunate that Rails has yet to have a &quot;canonical&quot; and opinionated approach to JSON-based API design, alongside the page rendering.<p>There are multiple JSON&#x2F;API gems, but they come and go over the years, with inconsistent maintenance and development.<p>So, I will pick no fight with Basecamp about using server-side rendering for Hey, but I&#x27;ll still be a bit disappointed that this hasn&#x27;t become an opportunity to extend Rails support in another direction.
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mkchoi212将近 5 年前
It uses ElasticSearch? Does this mean that HEY only supports searching when the device is online? I would expect search to work on a mobile app with no internet access when I&#x27;m paying $100 for an email service...
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diminish将近 5 年前
&gt; - MySQL for DB (Vitess for sharding)<p>Curious why not postgres?
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jinqueeny将近 5 年前
I am wondering have you considered the open source NewSQL database solutions like TiDB, CockroachDB? They have the best of both traditional RDBMS and NoSQL and would be the perfect choice to the hyper-growth scenarios.<p>TiDB could be considered as a scale-out MySQL and CRDB a scale-out Postgres. They are all Spanner-inspired solutions that can help avoid manual sharding.
dethos将近 5 年前
If it does the job, the experience is good and ends up reducing the complexity for the development team, looks like a good solution for that particular kind of product&#x2F;service.
cookiecaper将近 5 年前
For more detail see the Gemfile for Hey [0], posted in a follow-up tweet. [1]<p>[0] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;gist.github.com&#x2F;dhh&#x2F;782fb925b57450da28c1e15656779556" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;gist.github.com&#x2F;dhh&#x2F;782fb925b57450da28c1e15656779556</a><p>[1] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;twitter.com&#x2F;dhh&#x2F;status&#x2F;1275917612556226562" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;twitter.com&#x2F;dhh&#x2F;status&#x2F;1275917612556226562</a>
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learc83将近 5 年前
dang was this flagged for some reason? It seemed to be pushed off the front page really fast.
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hypewatch将近 5 年前
While learning about another tech stack is lots of fun for an engineer, I believe that great products aren’t written by great tools. They’re built by great engineers. A great tool helps but is not sufficient to build a great product.
sitzkrieg将近 5 年前
i have to admit i don&#x27;t get it. there seems to be zero compelling reason to use hey over; eg, fastmail.<p>fastmail is to this day the fastest website ive ever used
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x87678r将近 5 年前
how does MySQL work for a site like this? I think he said its one instance. Do they have a table for each account?<p>Also is every mail stored in a row? Attachments too? That isn&#x27;t how I&#x27;d expect it.
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steveharman将近 5 年前
Has anyone managed to find a needle in the HEY stack?
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jfdi将近 5 年前
anybody know what they&#x27;re using for the imap&#x2F;smtp&#x2F;pop core?
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sradman将近 5 年前
243 character original DHH Tweet:<p>&gt; The HEY stack:<p>- Vanilla Ruby on Rails on the backend, running on edge<p>- Stimulus, Turbolinks, Trix + NEW MAGIC on the front end<p>- MySQL for DB (Vitess for sharding)<p>- Redis for short-lived data + caching<p>- ElasticSearch for indexing<p>- AWS&#x2F;K8S
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deltron3030将近 5 年前
Was AWS unavoidable?
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k__将近 5 年前
The creators of Ruby on Rails use Ruby on Rails, why is this new?<p>DHHs whole career is based on it, why should he use something different?
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gyanamo将近 5 年前
isn&#x27;t &quot;Vanilla Ruby on Rails&quot; akin to &quot;Vanilla Deluxe Chocolate Fudge Sundae&quot;?
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buboard将近 5 年前
If the bizarre world of tech goes full circle back to php&amp;jquery , i ll have won a 10 y o bet
Aduket将近 5 年前
Relevant discussion: The return of the 90s Web<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=23567744" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=23567744</a>
nojito将近 5 年前
And would be exorbitantly expensive for 99% of companies because of the stack chosen
jeffbee将近 5 年前
Doesn&#x27;t sound very sophisticated from a privacy standpoint. How does this kind of vanilla tech stack protect my private emails from access by rogue insiders?
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unixhero将近 5 年前
Why is it called Hey stack?<p>Why does the &quot;Hey stack&quot; persist to the obsolete Mysql dB engine and not PostgreSQL (opinionated dovnvote fodder, I know, but hey; bring it on! They are valid questions).
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maxdo将近 5 年前
Good retro old-fashion ruby stack from d̶i̶n̶o̶s̶a̶u̶r̶s veterans. Nice :) No fancy magic. Went to check some of their stack on github and some component describe IE5 hacks.<p>Kind of awkward to see how they trying to create a PR driven fight with Apple for obvious reason.<p>&quot;From creators of basecamp&quot; sounds like anti-motivation to use product. They were first infomarketing company. Eventually they lost all the competition to every other company, but wrote books and succeed in this area while competitors went IPO with actual product. Why on earth someone would trust their business communications to outdated pre-hipster infomarketing company?<p>My negative comment is only due to this disgusting leverage on riot&#x2F;liberal values when they created a stupid buzz around a 10+ years old 30% rule. Providing as an example Tesla app and 30% cost of the car which is not the case for obvious reason. Do you think people are so stupid? Yeah, it might force me to remember this product. As a product from company with extremely mean values you should never trust.
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