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ggm将近 5 年前

The shift in meaning of the word morale is important. "Pour encourager les autres" is subtly different. Officers (and sergeant's) canes are sometimes called 'starters' and were used to 'encourage' harder work. I think calling them 'swagger sticks' came into use when hitting troops and sailors became less acceptable.'give that man the end of the rope to encourage him to pull harder' comes to mind: it does not mean 'let him be the one pulling on the back end' -a concept found in many a book by CS Forester, Patrick OBrien or maybe even Herman Melville (who witnessed flogging)

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SideburnsOfDoom将近 5 年前

Although "pour encourager les autres" is similar to "the floggings will continue", I do not think that it is the same sentiment, or in the same lineage.The sarcasm lands on the word "encourage" - so that it does not mean "encourage to have better morale", instead it means "encourage to work harder out of fear of punishment".The phrase means "to make an example of someone, as a warning to strike fear into the rest, and ensure compliance". (1) It is a crack of the overseer's whip.On the other hand, "The Floggings Will Continue Until Morale Improves" expresses a self-defeating cycle of interventions that perpetuates the situation.1 ) <a href="https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/pour%20encourager%20les%20autres" rel="nofollow">https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/pour%20encourager...</a>

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MattGaiser将近 5 年前

In modern parlance:Scrum meetings will continue until velocity improves.

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ArkVark将近 5 年前

The wikipedia article on John Byng (the ultimate source of the quote) is fascinating, particularly this section:<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Byng" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Byng</a>"Naval historian N. A. M. Rodger believes it may have influenced the behaviour of later naval officers by helping inculcate:"a culture of aggressive determination which set British officers apart from their foreign contemporaries, and which in time gave them a steadily mounting psychological ascendancy. More and more in the course of the century, and for long afterwards, British officers encountered opponents who expected to be attacked, and more than half expected to be beaten, so that [the latter] went into action with an invisible disadvantage which no amount of personal courage or numerical strength could entirely make up for.""So it seems that Morale did actually improve!

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mirkules将近 5 年前

Modern take on it:Scrum meetings will continue until morale improvesEdit: Accidentally submitted twice

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rm445将近 5 年前

Interesting read but I think this 'Quote Investigator' went off at a tangent with "pour encourager les autres" (a famous quote in its own right, but not quite the same sentiment). It seems more like the 1961 navy cartoonist who coined "all liberty is canceled until morale improves" deserves credit for the creative act, unless some earlier source is found.

maciejw将近 5 年前

Byng's fate seems to mirror a bit a history of Thucydides, an Athenian general who lost Amphipolis to Spartans and was sentenced for exile because of that. The sentence pushed Thucydides to create one of the greatest historical works of ancient era.It's funny that ancient Athenians were less barbaric than imperial Britons.

pwdisswordfish2将近 5 年前

First example that popped into my head was Mutiny on the Bounty. Anthony Hopkins as Bligh.

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ncmncm将近 5 年前

Looks like 1961 is the oldest example identified. The earlier quotes have a fundamentally different character.As "encouragement" goes, it is sometimes cited that the Soviet NKVD had a quota to shoot down the ten percent of their own infantry who were furthest from the front line of any battle. As might be expected, it is hard to verify, but it would have discouraged reluctance to advance.What is well established is that being taken prisoner was considered desertion, and soldiers released after the war, or liberated by advances, were routinely executed or sent to the GULag.

taejo将近 5 年前

A couple posters have brought up the "meetings will continue" version. US Senator Max Cleland used this is 2000, but I wonder if it can be antedated? <a href="https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/CHRG-106shrg85968/html/CHRG-106shrg85968.htm" rel="nofollow">https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/CHRG-106shrg85968/html/C...</a>