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Ask HN: How to negotiate continuing to work remotely?

370 点作者 megasquid大约 4 年前
Hi HN. Like many of you I am working remotely due to COVID.<p>I want to continue working remotely, but my job wants me in the office next month.<p>How would you negotiate this with your employer?<p>Have any of you already had this conversation? How did it go?

63 条评论

pfp大约 4 年前
Don&#x27;t negotiate. Dictate.<p>I&#x27;m not joking either. I tried negotiating this (pre-covid), only to get a &quot;final offer&quot; of a measly couple of remote days etc. Being on the spectrum, I took their word at face value, found another job that does 100% remote, and put in my resignation. Surprisingly that &quot;absolutely final&quot; position wasn&#x27;t that final anymore, and they&#x27;d&#x27;ve rather had me remote than not at all. Had the new job not been a lot better substance-wise, the whole exercise would have been total waste of time.<p>Of course you&#x27;ll want to dictate from a position where you can follow your ultimatum if need be.<p>The nearing end of Covid is where people like us can - indeed must - make a stand against the returning suffocating madness of boring commutes, noisy open plan offices, incessant context switches; against sacrificing one&#x27;s creativity, flow and personal space to placate the emotional instincts and biases of the excessively social who rarely do the heavy lifting in our sector.<p>Stay determined and keep up the good work.
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ineptech大约 4 年前
I manage people and have some advice.<p>Start with, &quot;I&#x27;d like to be converted to full remote, what&#x27;s the process for that?&quot; The answer is probably &quot;I don&#x27;t know but I don&#x27;t think it would fly.&quot; Insist that your manager ask up the chain for an official answer.<p>If the answer is &quot;nope&quot;, next say: &quot;I&#x27;m not comfortable returning to the office for health reasons. Will I be fired?&quot; This is two-pronged:<p>a) it introduces private healthcare decisions, a legally fraught topic they do not want to deal with. Is it legal to fire someone for refusing to return to the office despite health concerns? Probably, but no one knows for sure and your employer does not want to be the test case. (If they ask, &quot;what health concerns?&quot; remind them that&#x27;s private. Don&#x27;t invent a fictitious medically-fragile aunt.)<p>b) It may force them to confront the fact that they will lose people over this. They very likely think of wfh as a perk, something they can decide by fiat without consequence. If no one quits over it, that&#x27;s exactly what it will be.<p>If they stick to their guns, it&#x27;s time to look for another job I suppose. If they have some explanation for why wfh is bad (&quot;productivity is down, look at this graph&quot;, or &quot;the value of hallway conversations&quot; or whatever) I wouldn&#x27;t bother arguing unless it&#x27;s a small enough company that you can argue with the person who made the decision.
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tsukikage大约 4 年前
I will be starting that conversation with my boss later this week. At the end of the day, I think the key thing is you need to be fully prepared to move on if negotiations fail and the current job doesn&#x27;t deliver what you are after.<p>For myself, I have enough buffer and leads that I am confident I can get somewhere fully remote or at least closer to home before the savings get uncomfortably low, and so that&#x27;s my red line now - one way or another, I&#x27;m not doing the two-hour commute again, it&#x27;s simply not worth it; I&#x27;d rather take a pay cut to keep the life I&#x27;ve become used to over lockdown.<p>YMMV, but IMO if you&#x27;re not prepared to move on and your boss senses this, the negotiation will end right there.
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perlgeek大约 4 年前
Key to a negotiation is understanding what the other party wants (and what you want, of course).<p>WHY do they want you to work on premise? Wanting your presence is just a means to an end. There could be many reasons, like:<p>* They think it&#x27;s easier to control how much somebody works if it&#x27;s on premise<p>* it might be easier to manage<p>* it might be inertia<p>* they think it&#x27;s more efficient<p>* somebody is trying to exert control, or demonstrate to a higher-up that they can do so<p>... and so on. You should first try to understand where they are coming from, and then you can try to argue your case, framing it in a way that they can get most of their underlying motivation.<p>Also, it helps to know in advance what you are willing to give up and what not (are you willing to walk away if you don&#x27;t reach an agreement? what compromises would be acceptable to you?)
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iovrthoughtthis大约 4 年前
1. the developer market is super hot right now, there are lots of jobs.<p>2. you seem a capable developer (i checked your personal website).<p>i would approach the relevant contact at the company and ask if you are needed at the office 100% or if there is room for another arrangement, perhaps coming in for key meetings or a few times a month.<p>if not, i would highly recommend looking for a job that supports you working as you’d like to work. if you can, take some holiday to look for and apply to job openings that allow remote work.<p>you are working in one of the best paid professions, there should be little need for you to stay and work somewhere that doesn’t support you working the best way for you.<p>trust your gut.<p>happy to help if i can.
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dbenny大约 4 年前
CTO at Markforged here. If you can&#x27;t work it out with your employer hit us up. We&#x27;re hiring remote software engineers. We&#x27;ll ship you a printer so you can dev from home. Good luck! Like a lot of other commenters have posted - you have options.
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samcheng将近 4 年前
For what it&#x27;s worth, I&#x27;ve recently been interviewing candidates who straight-up resigned from their previous employer after facing a &quot;return to work&quot; ultimatum. You can too!<p>I&#x27;d like to add that there is a big difference between &quot;most of the company is in-office with some remote workers&quot; and &quot;company is fully distributed including leadership&quot; - with the former, it&#x27;s not necessarily a positive work environment being the remote person when everyone else is talking to each other in the conference room (or in the hallway).<p>In other words, even if you do negotiate an exception to your employer&#x27;s return-to-office policy, it&#x27;s likely not a good career move.<p>There are plenty of companies out there who have transitioned to remote-first, and the technical skill-set is still highly prized. Take advantage!
randomopining大约 4 年前
Here&#x27;s what I&#x27;m thinking.<p>1. Have value - the market is hot, you have 1-2 years+ at your job and know the codebase. Replacing you would cost them a good amount, they&#x27;d have to train a new person, etc.<p>2. Have respect - they know you get the job done and stick to your word.<p>3. Truly don&#x27;t give a f*k - have savings and know that you could get another job in a few months if you needed to.<p>If you have those, I seriously don&#x27;t know how you can fail. Unless it&#x27;s like a 300k+&#x2F;year hedge fund job where they want everybody there for the culture etc.
caffeine将近 4 年前
Like every negotiation it comes down to leverage (even though you wont USE the leverage, you cant negotiate unless you have it), and pain points.<p>So:<p>1. Start with doing recon. Ask your manager how has remote been? What does his boss think? How has the company done overall? What&#x27;s been frustrating? Knowing the pain points means you can later find concessions that are cheap to you but vital to them.<p>2. Get a fulky remote job offer from someone else. Doesn&#x27;t have to be a job you love but needs to be a real option. Now you have leverage.<p>3. Now you are ready to begin the process - &quot;if I wanted to stay fully remote, what would we do to make that work?&quot;<p>4. When you meet resistance, try to make a small concession along one of the pain points you identified earlier (&quot;I&#x27;m happy to commit to the same office hours as everyone else Tues-Thurs&quot;, &quot;I&#x27;ve identified a reasonable meeting wall setup for my house&quot;, &quot;I will come in 1 week a month to make sure we all stay bonded as a team&quot;). Make sure it&#x27;s something you dont mind conceding and it addresses their hottest pain point.<p>5. Always remain upbeat, and amicable during negotiations. This is a team effort to accomplish the goal of keeping you happy and productive at this company.<p>6. Dont mention the other job offer unless you really need to, or if they are dragging their feet. &quot;I really want to remain here and work remotely, but this other fully remote job offer expires soon.&quot;
twobitshifter大约 4 年前
I would like to know as well. Depending on the size of the company it may be easier to get special treatment. We’ve heard from top-down that we need to be back in the office and there’s been no special treatment given other than some allusions to a hybrid workweek compromise. The only way I think it would be possible at a large company would be to engage in some sort of wfh soft-strike collectively. With enough employees, leadership will listen. I think that if you don’t organize you’ll have to go along with the rest of the company. This is of course something dangerous to even discuss if you value your job.<p>On an individual level, JP Morgan will not let even their top employees wfh just because it will weaken their stance.
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baby将近 4 年前
Google changed position because enough employees threatened to quit if they were forced to go back to work. I assure you that Google is not the only company in this position.<p>By the way, I’ve started asking recruiters on Linkedin if the role they are reaching out to me for is remote. I’m not looking for a job but I bet if enough people start doing that there’ll be a shift :)
sshagent将近 4 年前
I did this some 12 years, clearly this predates covid. I didn&#x27;t think they&#x27;d be that interested in despite my job clearly being doable remotely. I ended up working out how much my commute cost me in £ and then offered that they can reduce my salary by that much AND i&#x27;ll just work from home. Then threw in some &quot;I&#x27;ll always be available over video chat&quot; and if something is VERY important (not just team meetings) then you&#x27;ll offer to come in. The odd time i do need to go in, i tend to travel in my lunch break. Takes about 90 minutes, but ...i can make up that 30 minutes.<p>I&#x27;ve worked from home ever since, rejecting numerous jobs of twice my salary ....as quite simply i don&#x27;t want 4 extra hours of travel each day.
tailspin2019将近 4 年前
Not directly answering your question, but early in lock down when working from home, I realised that I had become so incredibly productive and also *happy* by not being in the office that I decided I would never return to an office environment ever again, if I could help it.<p>I was lucky to have a bit of negotiating sway due to our company having just been acquired and me reporting to the new CEO who was keen to keep me on board. So I could probably have negotiated remote-only as a permanent thing, but I actually chose to quit the business last year and become a freelance consultant, working for my old employer under a contract instead (which they were happy with as opposed to losing me altogether).<p>So now I run my own business, choose my own work environment and tools (I have setup an awesome home office during lock down which is a pleasure to spend time in!) and contract for my old employer while building up some other clients too.<p>For me, I’ve spent over half my career self-employed and I wanted to get back to this anyway, but for what it’s worth, if you want to fully dictate your work environment (location, tools, hours etc) you can’t beat being freelance!<p>I appreciate this is not the advice you were looking for - just my personal experience in case it prompts any ideas.<p>To more directly answer your question, just ask! One thing I’ve learnt over the years is that we often want things but are too afraid to ask. Even if you think you know what the answer will be, ask anyway. See what discussion there is to be had.<p>The other thing I’d say is if you can negotiate 1-2 days remote (if they force you to a compromise) take it, because you can grow those 2 days into more from there if you can prove you’re productive in those days at home.<p>It’s much easier to go fully remote if you’re already partly remote, so don’t look at it as a binary thing.<p>BTW I’ve been on the other side of this too, helping one of my direct reports transition to fully remote. I was on board with it already but I had to “sell” the concept to my bosses in turn, but we made it happen.<p>Good luck!
throwaway95011将近 4 年前
Began this negotiation with my employer a couple months ago for reasons unrelated to COVID (partner is taking on a job that requires relocation). Got pretty far, but was ultimately denied. Some things I learned in the process:<p>- Make it clear that work remote is a requirement for you<p>- Consider things that may make your manger&#x27;s life easier, as they may need to argue up the chain on your behalf. Draw upon any positive performance reviews, performance metrics. Consider whether you&#x27;d be willing to fly in for one week per quarter. Point to any existing permanently remote coworkers as examples &#x2F; precedents.<p>- Talk to as many people in your direct management chain as possible (without going around people of course).<p>- Be prepared to leave.
MrGilbert将近 4 年前
I&#x27;m in the same boat. Our CEO was an extreme opponent to wfh before the pandemic. You could get wfh on a day-to-day base, but only if you could provide good reasons for that. During the pandemic, we all proved that wfh works. Hell, some of my coworkers and I opened up a discord, were we are more or less in voice chat the whole time. It&#x27;s like working in the office, but without many of the downsides.<p>Being challenged, CEO decided to give everyone 12 wfh days per year. After asking why exactly &quot;12&quot;, he argued that this were the average days people requested in the last 2 years before pandemic. That&#x27;s just ridiculous.<p>Yet, I&#x27;m still at the company, because I don&#x27;t think that now is a good time to look for a new job without substantial savings. But alea iacta est, I guess.<p>Also, it doesn&#x27;t make sense to negotiate in private, even if I managed to get something negotiated: We are working in a team, and the team needs to be able to handle somebody who is working remotely. It&#x27;s pretty hard to not let people behind if you aren&#x27;t trained at wfh.
camhenlin大约 4 年前
It seems like nearly all tech companies these days are moving to fully remote hiring. Tell your manager that you’re staying remote indefinitely or you’ll be beginning the search for a new job. You’ve already had the last year to prove how productive of a remote worker you are. Bonus for you: tech industry salaries are on a massive upswing at the moment - if you do get a shiny new remote job, chances are you’ll also be able to grab a pretty sweet raise as well.
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NKosmatos大约 4 年前
All these months that you’ve been working remotely has your efficiency&#x2F;amount of work&#x2F;evaluation remained the same? If yes then you can use this as a valid and measurable point for your discussion with your manager. Try to collect actual data (emails, messages, deadlines, quality...) clearly showing that while you were WFH. As others have suggested, have a plan B during the discussion&#x2F;negotiations. Can you offer a few days every month? Are you willing to loose any benefits or raises for a couple of years? What about equipment? You have to give something to the “stubborn” employers that don’t see the benefits of remote working, especially for specific jobs that can be performed from a computer anywhere on earth :-) Hope you succeed!
rconti大约 4 年前
My 5k+ person tech employer has basically said anyone who wants to work remote will be able to. The argument seems to be that it won&#x27;t be possible to competitively hire&#x2F;retain if remote is not an option.
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Buttons840将近 4 年前
Lots of good advice here. But also remember there are good books on negotiation, business dealings, communication, etc.<p>I recommend a book on negotiation called &quot;Never Split the Difference&quot;. It&#x27;s written by a former FBI hostage negotiator, it&#x27;s filled with interesting stories and good advice.<p>Some negotiation books seem like a &quot;bag of tricks&quot; which only work if the other person doesn&#x27;t know the tricks, not this book, this book is filled with advice that would work even if both parties are using the negotiation techniques described in the book.
tedivm大约 4 年前
There are a ton of companies hiring right now that are allowing ongoing remote work. If your company won&#x27;t let you find one that will.
vb6sp6大约 4 年前
I work for a very small company so when they start talking about coming back I give them some form of &quot;not gonna happen from me&quot; in a joking and light-hearted manner.<p>I&#x27;ve done this specifically to &quot;anchor&quot; my position. I&#x27;ve heard that others are saying &quot;2-3 days at home&quot; which seems foolish since that will be instantly whittled down to 2 days, and then fridays only, and then fridays only unless there is a big project (and there will always be a big project).<p>If we ever get to a serious &quot;why aren&#x27;t you coming back&quot; then we can discuss the reasons:<p>1. I dont like the commute and you dont like it when i am late<p>2. I&#x27;m working more hours since I&#x27;m not taking an hour lunch each day. I&#x27;m also not watching the clock trying to beat the evening rush. (you should have the numbers to back this up)<p>3. &quot;butts in seats&quot; is dumb. You aren&#x27;t dumb and I&#x27;m not done. We accomplished everything we set out to do in the last year with 0 butts in seat<p>4. The office has a ton of non-work related distractions. While I do enjoy the social aspects, I have a distraction free environment here which has allowed me to focus on some larger tasks such as completing project x and y.<p>5. Customers are never at our site. The only visitors we have are paper salesmen and dental hygienists (see #4) and i am tired of telling them, politely, to go fuck themselves<p>Unfortunately if they make employment conditional on in office you have to be willing to walk away. They might counter but you should be ready to leave if it gets to this point.<p>Good Luck
youeseh大约 4 年前
Good answers in your favor for following would help:<p>1. Are you &#x2F; your team demonstrably as &#x2F; more productive working remotely, compared to going into the office?<p>2. Does your company have a difficult time finding &#x2F; retaining talent due to their policy against WFH?
ska大约 4 年前
Approach this like any negotiation. Know what you actually want, and what you are willing to give up (and not). Try to determine what they actually want. Try and find a solution that is mostly positive for everyone.
o-__-o大约 4 年前
&gt;How would you negotiate this with your employer?<p>Quit.
koolba大约 4 年前
Find another job and don’t tell them anything until you have a firm offer. When it gets to that point tell them it’s full remote or the highway. If they refuse, walk.<p>If you do mention the offer after being refused your ultimatum, do not expect your job to be secure. You’ll be a marked man as you’ve demonstrated that you’re willing to walk away. Unless they counter with a <i>substantial</i> enough pay bump and you have equally substantial faith in them upholding the agreement for the long term (unlikely), walk.
gwbas1c大约 4 年前
I transitioned to remote a few years ago when I moved. It helped that my employer really liked me, and considered me indispensable.<p>In my case, I started the conversation very early, almost a year in advance. &quot;I just married someone who might make me move.&quot; Even though we didn&#x27;t dwell on the discussion, the fact that I brought it up regularly made sure that it wasn&#x27;t a surprise when I announced that, &quot;I am moving and will need to work remotely.&quot;<p>If you&#x27;ve already discussed how much you like working remotely with your manager, then it shouldn&#x27;t come as a surprise that you&#x27;re asking to remain remote.<p>In your case, maybe consider stating that you will be in the office day a week? Then, when &quot;life happens,&quot; just don&#x27;t show up for 2-3 weeks and see what happens.<p>When I moved, my employer set up an office for me with a group that I was physically close to. I showed up once a week, then due to a bad winter, I just didn&#x27;t go in for 6 weeks. No one noticed. (Heck, no one noticed when I was there.) Then, the office situation changed and I asked to be remote full time.<p>If you get a firm &quot;no,&quot; then everything depends on how much leverage you have. If there is some major project due in the near future, point out that the job market is very healthy for remote employees and imply that you might quit without finishing your project. See if you can get some kind of severance package or retention bonus if you stay through the project <i>as a remote employee</i>. Otherwise, just quit when you have a new job.
Ankintol大约 4 年前
I&#x27;ve watched several people go through this conversation after a company made this demand. For this to succeed it seems that you need to be indispensable, or be part of an organized group that is indispensable, to the highest person in your management chain who is demanding a return to the office (probably the CEO). If that person isn&#x27;t aware you&#x27;re indispensable, you will have to try to convince them.<p>Best of luck.
AdrianB1将近 4 年前
There is no best way, I will tell you some options and what I did and works for me:<p>1. If you negotiate, the questions is what can you give to get something. The only thing you have is your work, so the negotiation can be simplified to &quot;you work there or not&quot; from your side and &quot;all office, part office or all wfh&quot; from their side. If you want &quot;all wfh&quot; then you have little to negotiate, if you want part time office and part time wfh you can negotiate the proportions.<p>2. What worked for me and a few colleagues: I am officially working partly from the office for almost 15 years. That &quot;partly&quot; is the key word and very subjective: in the winters I used to go to the office a few days per month, in the summer (easier commute, 30 min instead of 1-2 hours each way) a few days per week, the rest of the year was somewhere in between. In the past few years (more than one) I go to the office only when I need to be there, not when HR wants me there. My team is globally distributed, so it makes sense in my case. At the same time, I have a couple of colleagues working remote for many years, one is hundreds of kilometers away and one is one country border away; they are officially working from the office, but they are not physically needed there and nobody is looking for them, their immediate teams are also globally distributed. If this is not applicable for you, you cannot use this method.<p>Most companies will not allow full wfh for different reasons, some are very valid and reasonable, so the best option may be to work partly from the office and negotiate that part. I think most companies will agree 1-2 days wfh and for some people they will accept more, depending on the specifics of the work these people do and the value for this company these people bring. These are the 2 points you can use in your favor.
caseybettle大约 4 年前
I said I am moving to another city do you want me to try remote working or not? Yes. Within 3 months my productivity rose 5x, I received a large raise. Who knew not working in the equivalent of a hog barn (yes I have debugged code in a literal hog barn, one very thin door from the action) would raise your efficiency?
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xtracto大约 4 年前
I was in an executive position at a startup that wouldn&#x27;t move to full work from home. I quit and moved to another startup that will let me work from home. In the end it was higher salary, lower responsibilities and the ability to work form anywhere. Best decision I could have made.
blihp大约 4 年前
Successfully negotiating this realistically means being prepared to walk at most companies that don&#x27;t already embrace remote work. If you&#x27;re not prepared to do so, you&#x27;re not really negotiating as much as asking. If you&#x27;re asking, expect &#x27;no&#x27; for an answer.
lmilcin将近 4 年前
I have made sure my bosses and team are happy with me working remotely.<p>That may have required me to do some extra. I am taking up meetings and emergencies outside my time zone working hours, I am helping the team to work better remotely and I invested extra in good video and audio setup.
christophilus大约 4 年前
Apply to Elastic. Seriously. There’s a massive difference between working for a company that is remote first vs being one of a handful of special snowflakes.<p>If you’re working for a company where remote work is a negotiation, I say it’s a good sign that you should seek greener pastures.
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edderly将近 4 年前
Decide who you&#x27;re negotiating with. Is it your manager or is it the company or organization? There could be differences in opinion depending on who you ask. Do not bother talking to HR.<p>Ask for feedback on your performance while working remotely. Also you can provide evidence that you are working &amp; performing well.<p>Clearly you want to still work for this company, point that out.<p>Ask yourself what your career path is at this company, is there a difference between your expectations at this place and theirs? Will this be affected by your presence in the office?<p>Do not put salary and benefits discussions on the table yourself, leave that up to the company.
yawaworht1978将近 4 年前
Many companies use misleading job descriptions, claiming remote work etc. But they do not mention that it is only due to covid and that they will not give up their offices. For whatever obscure reason.
GiorgioG大约 4 年前
My company went from freezing remote hiring 2 years prior to COVID 19 (because they spent tens of millions on a new HQ) to &quot;Hey if you want to work remote, do what&#x27;s best for you - obviously we&#x27;ve proven it can work.&quot; Companies may become more flexible - especially if your line of work is in demand.<p>Just have a conversation with your manager &quot;It&#x27;s important to me that I can work remotely. What can you do?&quot; If he&#x2F;she says &quot;Nothing, you have to come into the office&quot; find another job.
abfan1127大约 4 年前
I&#x27;ve been having this conversation for the last 9 months with my employer. I set the tone early that I:<p>1. routinely and mostly work with people in other states. 2. continue to perform as good if not better at home. 3. my home-office setup is as good if not better than in-office.<p>I let him know I have zero interest in returning to commuting 30-40 minutes each way to call another state.<p>I&#x27;d start the conversation as soon as possible. highlight the benefits for the company. highlight that you&#x27;ve honored his&#x2F;her trust and represented the team well.
zacharycohn将近 4 年前
If the conversation doesn&#x27;t work out, you can always join a company that&#x27;s committed to distributed work in the long term.<p>Like www.demandstar.com... the uh.. the company I work for. :)
codegeek大约 4 年前
You can negotiate if you have leverage. Are you really good at what you do ? Are you able to show that wfh doesn&#x27;t impact your performance and you are doing same or even better since wfh ? Are you trustworthy who knows how to get shit done and doesn&#x27;t need to be supervised all the time ? If yes to most of these, you could talk to management and see what&#x27;s possible. Otherwise, tough.
Ocerge大约 4 年前
Don&#x27;t think you need to negotiate at all. I have no plans to work remotely when my office reopens (I hate it, it&#x27;s bad for my mental health), but without even looking for _any_ job, I get 3-5 emails a day about remote gigs all over the US just by being on LinkedIn and having a software dev job. If they say no, just leave, somebody will take you.
SN76477将近 4 年前
I am working my way though Never Split the Difference by Chris Voss.<p>He goes through some very powerful negotiating techniques and strategies.<p>If you are short on time, try a summary like this. It will help you will be better equipped for your negotiation when the time comes.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;youtu.be&#x2F;QIRk382yJm4" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;youtu.be&#x2F;QIRk382yJm4</a>
heavyset_go大约 4 年前
Make it clear that you have, live with, or take care of someone with health conditions that make you worry for your own health or someone else&#x27;s.<p>Organize with your coworkers who feel the same way as you do about returning to the office, and negotiate as a group.<p>It also helps to have an offer from a company that can meet your needs if your current employer won&#x27;t.
mbrodersen将近 4 年前
“Working from home during the last year has demonstrated that I have fewer sick days, all issues were resolved by email&#x2F;phone, and my productivity is up. So I think it makes sense for me to continue working from home. Please let me know if there are any issues&#x2F;problem with this so that we can discuss and find a solution.”
milenafagandini大约 4 年前
IMO employers have an irrational fear that people that work from home don&#x27;t work at all and say its &quot;the office culture&quot; and being a team. If their opinion is already set on this, try negotiating half the week at the office and the other half from home. So both of you get the best of both worlds.
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x0x0大约 4 年前
You should make a decision tree.<p>eg is hybrid something you would be willing to do? Your boss? Your employer?<p>You&#x27;re pretty junior, however, so I&#x27;m not sure you really have a strong position if you can&#x27;t come to an agreement.<p>The best negotiating tactic is a job offer, though you don&#x27;t need to threaten. just be prepared for them to say ok.
edent将近 4 年前
Join a union.<p>You as an individual have very little power. You don&#x27;t know the intricacies of employment law. You aren&#x27;t a trained negotiator.<p>A Trade Union has a bunch of lawyers and negotiators who work for you.<p>Join a union. Convince your colleagues to join. Use collective bargaining to negotiate with your employer.
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rizpanjwani大约 4 年前
Playing devil&#x27;s advocate: as a business&#x2F;employer why would I continue to pay you your current first-world salary rather than find someone top-notch for 1&#x2F;3 your salary in India, or any other English speaking country with a lower cost of living?
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varispeed将近 4 年前
It&#x27;s very simple - if they want you back, and you don&#x27;t want to go back, then tell them so. I am only willing to agree to max 2 days in office a month. The moment they start to ask for me to come in more than that I&#x27;ll post my resignation.
ElectricMind将近 4 年前
I think people try this negotiate but not entitled to remote work.<p>When you applied for the job , did it say &quot;REMOTE&quot;? If no, then there is no entitlement to anything. You have to agree what company says.<p>If you not happy then you can find a new job that says &quot;REMOTE&quot;.
swader999大约 4 年前
Make yourself indispensable. Crank out quality code at a rate above your pay level. Or offer to work on call hours that no one else wants to that really don&#x27;t cost you much to commit to.
rajacombinator将近 4 年前
Same as any negotiation. Have an alternative, threaten to walk.
dkarras将近 4 年前
Be of irreplaceable (or hard to replace) value, have leverage.
Rockwell70将近 4 年前
In my case I told my boss to either let me WFH or I’ll find someone who will. He knows my skills are in demand so acquiesced.<p>I did have another offer in hand but didn’t mention that.
paxys大约 4 年前
Be ready to quit. You already have all the leverage in the world. It&#x27;s incredibly easy to get a good remote software job today.
pgt大约 4 年前
You can&#x27;t negotiate without options. You have to be willing to walk away, and the only way to do that is to gather options.
crossroadsguy将近 4 年前
Tell, don’t ask.<p>Personally I’d like to go back to office. But I do understand why many people may not want to.
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mkhpalm将近 4 年前
Just let them know you&#x27;re not comfortable in an office setting due to health concerns.
the_gipsy大约 4 年前
I&#x27;m about to move out before vaccination levels are high enough to enforce returning to the office. I have enough savings-cushion, I&#x27;d collect unemployment, and there are plenty of remote offers.<p>I&#x27;m very stubborn on it, because to me it&#x27;s very easy. Home vs Office is a very hot and polarized topic. It&#x27;s easy enough to please both type of workers, at least in IT. If C-level management is incapable of compromising on this, then that&#x27;s not my problem, fortunately.
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SergeAx将近 4 年前
How&#x27;s lots of comments here describe returning to office as a &quot;bad deal&quot;? WFH was a forced move due to the pandemic. Now life is getting back to normal, vaccines are generally available, and office work is coming back. So it is not a bad deal, it&#x27;s just returning to initial deal, after force majeure is over.<p>It is true that lots of companies are embracing wfh or hybrid model right now, so if in TS shoes I would just changed the job and called it a day.
aalphamuzammil将近 4 年前
Remote work is the future
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richardanaya大约 4 年前
Shame on corps needlessly making people work in offices.
WrtCdEvrydy大约 4 年前
&quot;Since we&#x27;re not requiring vaccinations, will the company be paying a 5 million dollar life insurance policy for my family as beneficiaries? I&#x27;m fine dying but I like to put a price on my own life&quot;<p>This is what I would say if I worked at a place which actually wanted people to come back to the office.
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29athrowaway将近 4 年前
If I was your manager, the questions I would ask are:<p>- Do you have a designated space that is adequate and safe for work?<p>- Do you have an ergonomic setup including an ergonomic chair and desk?<p>- Do you have reliable &#x2F; high speed internet connectivity?<p>- Do you have a proper microphone setup? (and camera if required)?<p>- Will you commit to be responsive via instant messaging or another communication solution during office hours?<p>- Will you comply with good practices regarding the handling and disposal of confidential or sensitive information?<p>If you can answer yes to all of that, I would have no problems with you becoming a remote employee.
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