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Pesticides are killing the world's soils

390 点作者 pmastela将近 4 年前

26 条评论

rosetremiere将近 4 年前
In Switzerland, we&#x27;re soon going to vote on two initiatives ¹² aiming at reducing pesticide use. The first is essentially about forbidding the use of all artificial pesticides by 2031 (also importation of food that was produced abroad using pesticides). The second is about removing subsidies to farmers that use any kind of pesticide, or regularly use antibiotics on their livestock, etc.<p>I feel like they are quite drastic initiatives, but it&#x27;s good to at least have a desire for change. I&#x27;m interested in any opinion from knowledgeable people on the subject!<p>¹ <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.admin.ch&#x2F;gov&#x2F;en&#x2F;start&#x2F;documentation&#x2F;votes&#x2F;20210613&#x2F;popula-initiative-for-a-switzerland-without-artificial-pesticides.html" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.admin.ch&#x2F;gov&#x2F;en&#x2F;start&#x2F;documentation&#x2F;votes&#x2F;202106...</a> ²<a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.admin.ch&#x2F;gov&#x2F;en&#x2F;start&#x2F;documentation&#x2F;votes&#x2F;20210613&#x2F;popular-initiative-for-clean-drinking-water-and-healthy-food.html" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.admin.ch&#x2F;gov&#x2F;en&#x2F;start&#x2F;documentation&#x2F;votes&#x2F;202106...</a>
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rmason将近 4 年前
I&#x27;ve watched the entire cycle in the past thirty years as a former agronomist. We were able to genetically modify plants so they generated natural pesticides as a defense against insects. This allowed us to stop spraying thousands of tons of less insecticides.<p>But the very people complaining about spraying chemicals rejected these new enhanced plants saying they weren&#x27;t &#x27;natural&#x27;. We have been breeding plants to do things the past 170 years ever since Gregor Mendel and his pea breeding. The only difference now is that we have better tools. You cannot win everyone over.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Gregor_Mendel" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Gregor_Mendel</a>
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latch将近 4 年前
Dengue is a serious health threat in Singapore. Fogging (1) is pretty common.<p>Now, the Singapore government says fogging should be used judiciously, not routinely. But, that doesn&#x27;t seem to be the case. Many condos will fog once a week, year-round. Supposedly all operations must be submitted in the an &quot;E-fogging Submission System&quot;, but as far as I can tell, there&#x27;s no visibility into this.<p>Singapore has also recently declared a &quot;climate change emergency&quot;, and I&#x27;d consider biodiversity, at the very least, a part of that.<p>My point is that: if the Singapore Government is unable or unwilling to manage this with a sense of urgency (or &quot;emergency&quot;), then I&#x27;m not generally hopeful.<p>(1) <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Fogging_(insect_control)" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Fogging_(insect_control)</a>
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unchocked将近 4 年前
I&#x27;m dismayed at how little we seem to know about pesticides, neonicotinoids for example but probably a host of other types. It certainly stands to reason that industrial application of poisons is going to kill a lot of species and destabilize ecosystems.<p>The decline of insect populations over several decades - which to me is symbolized by the near-extinction of the monarch butterfly, is probably more destabilizing to our environment than the loss of charismatic megafauna would be.<p>Pesticide policy, if the example of DDT holds, can at least be changed - and hopefully soils and insect populations can recover with protection and management in the same way that raptor populations have recovered in recent years. It will take a lot of work.
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sampo将近 4 年前
This is a skillfully written piece to raise anger. But if you look closely, there are some signs:<p>This piece refers to a study [1]. As they mention, this Scientific American piece is written by 2 of the 5 authors of the study. 4 out of 5 of the study authors don&#x27;t work in a conventional academic institution, but in nature conservation non-profits [2, 3]. The study [1] is titled &quot;A Hazard Assessment&quot;. If you know the lingo, a hazard is different from a risk. Hazard means: This could potentially be a risk, if right conditions are met. The study itself [1] is a literature search of laboratory and field studies on the impact of pesticides on soil invertebrates. From [1]:<p>&gt; Conclusion<p>&gt; This paper constitutes a comprehensive review of the impacts of agricultural pesticides on soil invertebrates. We found that pesticide exposure negatively impacted soil invertebrates in 70.5% of 2,842 tested parameters from 394 reviewed studies.<p>If you do a literature study on studies on how plant and insect poisons affect insects, the expected result is of course, insect poisons are poisonous to insects. And plant poisons can have observable effects, meeting the conditions of a hazard.<p>Now, to what extend is farming &quot;Killing the World&#x27;s Soils&quot;, and to what extent can the negative effects of farming be attributed to pesticide use, soil tilling, biodiversity loss etc., this piece is not a high quality contribution.<p>[1] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.frontiersin.org&#x2F;articles&#x2F;10.3389&#x2F;fenvs.2021.643847&#x2F;full" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.frontiersin.org&#x2F;articles&#x2F;10.3389&#x2F;fenvs.2021.6438...</a><p>[2] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Center_for_Biological_Diversity" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Center_for_Biological_Diversit...</a><p>[3] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Friends_of_the_Earth" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Friends_of_the_Earth</a>
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gravelc将近 4 年前
I work on developing pesticides based on RNA, which should significantly reduce adverse impacts on the environment (including soils) if commercialised and adopted. Biodegradable and highly species specific.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;phys.org&#x2F;news&#x2F;2021-01-rnai-based-products-sustainable-alternative-hazardous.html" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;phys.org&#x2F;news&#x2F;2021-01-rnai-based-products-sustainabl...</a><p>Still more development to be done, but there are alternatives to existing synthetic pesticides on the horizon.
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BTCOG将近 4 年前
I&#x27;ve planted a large variety of vegetables and clovers, buckwheat and things that wasps and bees love for several years. In the last two years of crop alone, I had absolutely no horn worms on any of my tomatoes or related Solanaceae family, no white moths able to lay eggs and destroy my kale, broccolis, or other greens and this is something if you&#x27;re familiar with farming is unheard of without pesticides. I welcome so many yellow jackets and red wasps, hornets into our backyard that they just annihilate all those pests. The only thing I&#x27;ve had a tiny issue with is clusters of aphids in my tomatoes late season and I can just spray them down with a mild nicotine tea or mint family oils. If you get the ecosystem into balance, there is no need for chemical pesticides. Needing them is a sign of a total out of whack ecosystem in the first place. Mid summer season, it&#x27;s fun to just sit back and watch 4-5 yellow jackets climbing up and down heirloom kale plants hunting. Without them, the kale would just about be leaf veins left propped up on stalks, as the greedy little worms will absolutely destroy all the leaf if left to their own devices. Don&#x27;t spray wasps! They are just as crucial as honey bees.
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rapnie将近 4 年前
In The Netherlands we have what we proudly call &quot;The Green Heart&quot;, the rural area inbetween the cities of Amsterdam, The Hague, Rotterdam, Eindhoven and Utrecht. But while this looks nice to the untrained eye, green pastures and all, it might as well be a desert. Monocrop grasslands with little to no life in the ground, hardly any insects let alone birds. Grown on industrial fertilizer, and sprayed with insecticides. It is quite sad.<p>Netherlands, a tiny tiny country, has this crazy intensive meat and poultry industry. We are largest chicken exporter in the world [0] and no. 6 in pork exports [1]. And in agriculture we are surprisingly number 2 worldwide after the USA [2].<p>While this is all nice and stuff for our economy, it has many downsides. Small, sustainable farmers find it very hard to eek out a living, and even the large producers find it ever harder to get good income. All the animals crammed together in mega stables pose pandemic risks, and overall the environment is suffering.<p>But what the technology being used shows is that higher yields are well possible, also with way more sustainable production methods. This should be the focus and then export that expertise around the world so we can all benefit.<p>I hope that in Netherlands itself we can scale back the crazy industrial race to the bottom, replacing with a mixture of traditional small-scale best-practice and innovative new agrotech.<p>[0] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.worldstopexports.com&#x2F;chicken-exports-by-country&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.worldstopexports.com&#x2F;chicken-exports-by-country&#x2F;</a> (2019)<p>[1] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.bizvibe.com&#x2F;blog&#x2F;food-beverages&#x2F;top-pork-producing-countries" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.bizvibe.com&#x2F;blog&#x2F;food-beverages&#x2F;top-pork-produci...</a> (2018)<p>[2] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;humboldt.global&#x2F;top-agricultural-exporters&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;humboldt.global&#x2F;top-agricultural-exporters&#x2F;</a>
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timeinput将近 4 年前
Does anyone have sources for suggestions about what we should do?<p>I read these articles, and worry, and wonder what can I do. It&#x27;s not clear to me that buying organic mono-cropped bananas at the mega mart is in anyway better or worse than buying non-organic mono-cropped bananas.<p>I&#x27;d really like to just build up some more understanding on what I can do in my daily life to make things not worse.
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giantg2将近 4 年前
Bees do touch soil. Quite often they like to collect water from rich, wet soils and dirty water. It&#x27;s thought that they enjoy dirty water over clean water due to minerals.
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adreamingsoul将近 4 年前
I’m fascinated by soil and all the interactions between microorganisms, insects and plants. Does anyone have any recommendations for books on soil science (Edaphology)?<p>Over the course of three years I transitioned a small plot from a monoculture into a thriving “forest garden”. My goal was to restore the soil health and utilised a variety of plants, insects, and mycelium to achieve that. It was an amazing adventure that taught me a lot and also helped me through a mental crises. That experience and experiment has motivated me to be a soil farmer.<p>My biggest lesson was that pests and weeds are symptoms of a larger problem. INSTEAD of trying to manage them, look for what nature needs to manage them. For example, what attracts ladybugs? What environments are friendly for ladybugs?
mdavis6890将近 4 年前
It&#x27;s easy to be mad about some outcome that you don&#x27;t like. It&#x27;s much harder to actively consider tradeoffs among various available (actual, not hypothetical) options.<p>Pesticides raise crop yields and increase farmer productivity. Of course we could stop using pesticides, but then we would need to devote more labor to farming, losing out on whatever else that labor would have produced instead. We would have fewer haircuts, shoes, medical procedures and houses. Maybe that&#x27;s okay - I&#x27;m not trying to argue that point. But we have to consider the tradeoffs.
Abishek_Muthian将近 4 年前
Small time farmers who are at the mercy of handful of Big Corp. will do everything at their hands to increase the yield for meeting the demand laid down upon them or they perish.<p>So this is not just a technical problem.
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sofixa将近 4 年前
So is this about the world or US soils? The title suggests the former, but everything in the article and all the authors of the study are around the US. Considering the vastly different regulations and practices in the EU ( e.g. grazing, crop rotation are very popular) i suppose the situation is different.
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jtdev将近 4 年前
My next door neighbors just had a pesticide treatment sprayed on the entire exterior of their house... including patio furniture, outdoor cooking area, the yard that their young children play in... this just one week after a neighborhood wide mosquito treatment (I opted out and asked for an MSDS from the application company).<p>I just don&#x27;t understand people. I would rather see a spider&#x2F;wasp&#x2F;ant occasionally than be doused in pesticides.
ed25519FUUU将近 4 年前
My observation is that smaller farmers, especially cottage farming, have a really good grasp on soil health and actively cultivate soil via grazing.<p>Grazing is one of the best things we can do to build soil. Animals and the soil grew up and evolved together.<p>It’s a shame the world is turning so strongly against meat, regardless of how it’s raised.
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agumonkey将近 4 年前
Are there any new ideas regarding small scale electronically controlled insect repellents and plant control ? I don&#x27;t know .. like small ultrasonic transducers to annoy them or maybe LEDs .. or maybe changing pH conditions.
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Finnotesorg将近 4 年前
This is one of the serious issues that should be addressed at a serious level. The thing is we want to change but we are not ready for it. For some of us Just money matters, not health.
ffhhj将近 4 年前
It&#x27;s weird how drug trafficking from third world countries is illegal, but developed countries selling poisons that destroy natural resources in these lands is perfectly fine. Both must be illegal. Megacorps are always looking for small farmers in low-industry countries to adopt their chemical fertilizers and pesticides to fight native bugs that can be controlled with organic agriculture. These countries don&#x27;t need to produce huge volumes, there is no need for all those imported poisons. Make them illegal and don&#x27;t let them kill their nature as well.
jillesvangurp将近 4 年前
Legislation to shut down subsidies for non sustainably grown produce would transform the industry in a hurry because most of it is also not sustainable from an economic point of view and very dependent on subsidies. That&#x27;s the tool to use to fix this.<p>E.g. US corn subsidies are an anomaly. The world does not need so much corn and biofuels are a particularly lousy excuse to grow that much corn. Corn syrup is not an ingredient that is either common or high in demand outside the US. It&#x27;s a market that only exists because of corn subsidies. In the same way, we&#x27;re subsidizing soy, which gets exported from Brazil and from freshly burned down rain forest. The US is a close second for this stuff. Again subsidies combined with mostly very unsustainable styles of farming. Both industries depend on large scale use of pesticides and a few other unsustainable practices and exports to countries that look the other way.<p>If you are a vegetarian and want to save the planet, stop eating unsustainably grown soy. If you are a meat eater, stop eating unsustainably grown meat where the animals grew up eating unsustainably grown corn and soy. At a macro level it&#x27;s multiple layers of unsustainable practices that we subsidize so we can have some artificially cheap food that probably isn&#x27;t that good for you. It&#x27;s not cheap at all. You just pay for it via your taxes. And we&#x27;re leaving the damage cleanup for future generations. We&#x27;re just really good at allowing people to dodge the real cost of things.<p>The Netherlands has a nice ongoing debate about reducing nitrogen emissions from mostly cattle and traffic. The reasoning goes as follows: high nox concentrations are bad for health (fact), therefore building close to where the concentrations are high is no longer allowed (because it kills people). This simple ruling basically shut down construction next to highways, which is where a lot of prime real estate is in the Netherlands. That is causing a lot of farmers to adapt their behavior because the communities they operate in are not cool with the high nox concentrations any more. They even reduced maximum speeds on the highways from 130 km&#x2F;h to 100 km&#x2F;h to cut down on the emissions and thus allow construction projects to resume.<p>That basically happens when you put numbers on the damage, change the incentives, and put some simple rulings in place. This btw. happened under a mostly conservative right leaning government too. Headed by the party that not so long ago championed the raising of the speed limit to 130 km&#x2F;h (VVD). The current government is more or less the polar opposite of tree hugging hippies. Highway loving VVD and farmer friendly CDA are two of the coalition parties. And they got this done.<p>We should do the same with pesticides. There&#x27;s plenty of good reasons to stop killing our environment like that. The least we can do is stop subsidizing that.
mro_name将近 4 年前
Science found out: Field poisons are toxic.<p>Thanks for the quotable reference.
johnthedebs将近 4 年前
We have solutions to this for most (maybe all) contexts, at least as far as agriculture is concerned, in regenerative agriculture[0]. It requires a paradigm shift from the dominant type of agriculture taking place in the US and many other parts of the world, but it is not only better for soils and ecosystems – it&#x27;s probably much better for our health as consumers, potentially more profitable for farmers, and can have an enormous positive impact in reigning in climate change.<p>It can seem too good to be true, but consider that when we mess with one aspect of nature by say, growing mono-culture crops rather than poly-cultures, we end up needing to intervene in many other aspects of ecosystems. The choice to annually till fields and grow acres upon acres of single crops year after year means we also need to recreate (poorly) natural systems of fertility (fertilizers), competition defense (herbicides), pest defense (pesticides), and disease defense (fungicides).<p>This model has other negative externalities as well, such as soil erosion, poor natural water infiltration and holding capacity, leaching of fertilizers and *-icides into surrounding areas and bodies of water which interrupt natural processes and are detrimental to life and health elsewhere, poor carbon sequestration, etc, etc.<p>The core principles of regenerative agriculture are to mimic nature and take advantage of natural processes rather than fighting them at every step, and to avoid intervening whenever possible. In the same way that the fastest and most maintainable line of code is the one you don&#x27;t have to write, the cheapest and most effective agricultural practice is the one you don&#x27;t need to do.<p>For those interested in a deep dive with a farmer from North Dakota who is very successfully putting these ideas into practice, see Gabe Brown[1] (who I first heard about here on HN, and for which I&#x27;m very grateful). If you&#x27;re interested in agriculture, farming or even just gardening, I highly recommend watching the whole video. For a higher level and more accessible take, check out the documentary Kiss the Ground[2].<p>I&#x27;ve been trying to put these ideas into practice in my own ~100sq ft of growing space in NYC and, while it&#x27;s still early in the growing season and hard to distinguish variables year-to-year, my garden is looking <i>dramatically</i> better this year[3] than at the same time in years past. Some of it for sure is a better sense of timing on my part and early warm weather here, but there are a lot of promising signs and I&#x27;m looking forward to seeing the state of things towards the end of the season when last year I had lost most of my tomato plants to pest pressures.<p>[0] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Regenerative_agriculture" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Regenerative_agriculture</a><p>[1] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=ExXwGkJ1oGI" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=ExXwGkJ1oGI</a><p>[2] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;kisstheground.com&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;kisstheground.com&#x2F;</a><p>[3] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;imgur.com&#x2F;a&#x2F;ybquJIX" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;imgur.com&#x2F;a&#x2F;ybquJIX</a><p>Edit: The article specifically mentions regenerative agriculture, but says &quot;pesticide companies know that these practices are often accompanied by increased pesticide use.&quot; I think it&#x27;s a misnomer to call something regenerative agriculture when pesticide use is even higher than in conventional agriculture.
cryptos将近 4 年前
Capitalism needs to be fixed immediately! The root cause is that short-term profits are more important than sustainability. Using pesticides is just one of many symptoms.
cm2012将近 4 年前
The much demonized Roundup actually greatly reduces pesticide volume needed compared to older pesticides. Save the environment, love Monsanto.
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keithalewis将近 4 年前
But what would Henny Penny and Chicken Little have to say about this? At least SA still has the integrity to admit this is an opinion piece.
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chewz将近 4 年前
Remind me to buy a pack of cotton t-shirts with &quot;Stop pesticides&quot; logo<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Organic_cotton#Ecological_footprint" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Organic_cotton#Ecological_foot...</a>
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