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We’re all criminals now

79 点作者 DistantCl3ric将近 4 年前

13 条评论

jeroenhd将近 4 年前
The point of crypto currency is to do the exact thing money laundering laws try to prevent: to transfer large sums of cash untraceably across the globe, with no way for the government to do anything about it.<p>Recently it&#x27;s become a game of baseless investment, but anyone actually wanting to use crypto currencies as payment should&#x27;ve seen this coming from miles away.
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RustyConsul将近 4 年前
I miss the old crypto.<p>When it was this fringe, nerdy digital coin i could transfer to my friends to pay my bar tab. Yeah - Venmo&#x2F;paypal&#x2F; a billion other systems that did the same thing, but to my friends btc and eventually eth was cooler.<p>I could stake coins, provide liquidity, mine random coins from my laptop - It was fun. The concept of a global computer was awesome, interesting and nerdy. I&#x27;ve never used an exchange, but i could watch my coins go up and use them to play a couple random Play-To-Earn games, which was also fun.<p>Now we got all these &#x27;Scam&#x27; Coins. But they aren&#x27;t scams because they literally come out and say they are scams but still achieve billions of dollars in market cap because everyone is just trying to make a quick buck&#x2F; have constrained liquidity.<p>I think the SEC needs to come in and regulate this space, it would be a very welcome change to what crypto has become. Make stablecoins have 24&#x2F;7 auditability of their investments and have some vetting mechanism to trade on exchanges. That would make it nerdy and cool again.
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Loic将近 4 年前
Just remembering what someone from the trade directorate of the EU told me a some years ago about Bitcoin: &quot;If it starts to have a real impact on the ability to collect taxes and control money transfers we are simply going to make it illegal&quot;.
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ElViajero将近 4 年前
&gt; And by the way, this exact rule is the reason many South African startup founders incorporate in Delaware instead of locally, because it is extremely difficult to attract foreign investment if the investors know they will not be able to get the return on their investment (or share of the IP) out of the country again.<p>Except that in the USA you also need to declare transfers over $10,000 to the Internal Revenue Service (IRS). And this is done to find people trying to avoid paying taxes. It is the same for the European Union. And it is the same for any other country.<p>Quite often the answer to all this articles is &quot;the world does not work as you think it works&quot;, crypto-currencies are not special, it is just that the bureaucracy of countries need to catch up.
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X6S1x6Okd1st将近 4 年前
If this was just about the law and didn&#x27;t say anything about cryptocurrency or bitcoin these comments would be a lot more sensible.<p>It seems like simply including cryptocurrency in an article triggers an in-group vs out-group where people dive right into attacking positions.<p>Making it illegal to move more than 40 USD of value out of South Africa without written permission from the treasury is absurd. Every tourist has done this, I&#x27;ve done this. I&#x27;ll do it again without any fear of being charged for this crime.
munificent将近 4 年前
<i>&gt; the Reserve Bank making up seemingly hostile and uninformed rules regarding something that has no notion of borders</i><p>The <i>whole point</i> of being a government organization is the ability to make up rules and <i>define</i> notions of things like borders.<p>Sure, the rules may or may not be hostile and uninformed, but it seems silly to criticize a government for doing literally the primary thing it is designed to do.
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owlbynight将近 4 年前
The fucking stock art on this article lol
vmception将近 4 年前
Crypto doesn&#x27;t exist in a physical location.<p>You can prove somebody has access to a registry on a blockchain, you cant prove nobody else does. This has been one of the hurdles for custodial regulations to adapt to. South Africa has the entire concept wrong though.
csomar将近 4 年前
&gt; This is a fairly recent “announcement” and many people are upset about the Reserve Bank making up seemingly hostile and uninformed rules regarding something that has no notion of borders and is practically impossible for the regulators to control in terms of owning and transferring. Something that arguably does not even exist in any one location...<p>Actually it&#x27;s pretty simple. By &quot;owning&quot; Bitcoins, you own money&#x2F;capital. But it&#x27;s in the &quot;blockchain&quot;, or alternatively, the possession of such money happens inside South Africa. Once you do a transaction that transfers that capital (or the power of control of such capital) outside of South Africa (ie: a foreign exchange), you are breaking the law. If you are sending it to another friend in South Africa, you should be fine. (ps: Just reading into the substance of such a law, why it was made, I&#x27;m not a lawyer and this is not a legal advice).<p>&gt; And by the way, this exact rule is the reason many South African startup founders incorporate in Delaware instead of locally, because it is extremely difficult to attract foreign investment if the investors know they will not be able to get the return on their investment (or share of the IP) out of the country again. It essentially turns our country into an economic Black Hole.<p>All these Entrepreneurs are breaking the capital AND the fiscal laws of the country. Since I assume they won&#x27;t report their holdings (because of the capital controls).<p>&gt; First of all, we are dealing here with existing (very old) legislation that is fairly unique to South Africa. No “new rules” have been made. Not many countries deal with the type of restrictive exchange controls we have, in fact this specific clause was promulgated in 1961.<p>Most countries do have controls on the &quot;transfer&quot; of capital outside of a country border. (or into the country too). But since you are using the banking system, you do not notice such regulation.<p>&gt; Anyway, the Reserve Bank is now in a position where it must either continue supporting a 60 year old, unenforcable rule, or focus on updating legislation to align with 2021 realities.<p>The thing is, countries have a payment balance. They put these rules because they usually have a few big export companies (usually natural resources) or tourism. Allowing these companies to take their money out, will destabilize their balance of trade. They could ignore the crypto-kids (their size is negligible for now), but they can&#x27;t afford a loophole for the system. And for that reason, the law is unlikely to get patched.
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janandonly将近 4 年前
We have heard a lot of similar news out of other jurisdictions. And seeing how slow many lawmaking bodies respond to any stimuli at all, we will for the foreseeable future...
kache_将近 4 年前
Thank god for monero
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guest159835将近 4 年前
Free market... &quot;No person shall, except with permission granted by the Treasury and in accordance with such conditions as the Treasury may impose — take out of the Republic goods, including personal apparel, household effects, and jewellery which have a value in excess of 600 Rand (approx $40) or of such greater amount as the Treasury may determine;&quot;
mrverify将近 4 年前
Your honor, can the prosecution please be compelled to demonstrate where the bitcoin physically exists? Oh on this computer? Well, the key is memorized and there are several copies saved all over the world in cloud computers. Can the prosecution show the court, physically, where in the computer the asset exists?
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