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Italy seeks to shield supercars from combustion engine ban

33 点作者 aloukissas超过 3 年前

14 条评论

jacquesm超过 3 年前
Bad idea from an image perspective, from a statistics perspective it wouldn&#x27;t matter. But if you want to create buy-in from the population the best way to sink that is to give an exemption to the ultra rich.<p>The easiest way would be to start enforcing the ban <i>today</i>, but percentage wise, and then over the course of the next 14 years enforce a fixed percentage of the cars produced to be fully electric until the last vehicle to roll off the line with an ICE is made in 2035. That way nobody gets an excuse and the likes of Ferrari can make bank by selling their ICE based vehicles at auction for ever higher prices. Problem elegantly solved.
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_fat_santa超过 3 年前
As a massive gearhead I am absolutely in favor of this exception. Lots of practical and pragmatic arguments are being made here like the fact that very few of these cars are sold and they spend most of their lives in a garage, but allow me to make an emotional argument.<p>I got to drive a Ferrari a about 2 years ago, and after that drive I am convinced that the only way to understand why these cars is to drive them. Sure the look insane and the spec sheet is equally insane, but the thing I took away most is all the little sensations you get while driving it. The exhaust crackle, the whipping acceleration when the turbo spools, the rev jump when you downshift.<p>All these little pieces of magic will be lost if supercars have to go electric. Yes they will all retain the same power and handling, but when I drove that Ferrari the most fun I had wasn&#x27;t when I was flooring it but when I was just putting around town, shifting between 2nd and 3rd gear and hearing the exhaust crackle and engine rev. After my drive I was left with chills down my spine and a determination to one day have one in my garage.<p>I really really hope Ferrari and Lamborghini get this exception, it will be one of the saddest days in the automotive world when these automakers have to put their V8&#x27;s and V12&#x27;s to pasture.
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jimmar超过 3 年前
They don&#x27;t think they can make electric super cars in 14 years? They have plenty of notice. On a side note, John Carmack was on Joe Rogan&#x27;s podcast and talked about supercharging his Ferraris. In the same podcast, Carmack said he actually prefers his Tesla over the Ferrari. The supercar companies may be in trouble, and extending the life of combustion engines is unlikely to help.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=sM_tqQNJWzc" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.youtube.com&#x2F;watch?v=sM_tqQNJWzc</a><p>Around 11:56 he talks about why his Tesla wins in many ways over his Ferraris.
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peoplefromibiza超过 3 年前
I think everybody is getting it wrong.<p>As Italian (and Ferrari fan, but that&#x27;s another story) what really matters for Ferrari (and ~~Lamborghini~~ Maserati) is that they aren&#x27;t mass produced, they are not an industrial product (most of them are assembled by hand) and - most of all - all of the parts are produced in Italy!<p>What the minister is saying is that if Ferrari can&#x27;t build autonomously their own batteries - from scratch - they can&#x27;t produce a real Ferrari.<p>Of course this is different from buying batteries from a supplier and strapping them in a mass produced car, assembled by machines.<p>It has nothing to do with rich people or taxes, it&#x27;s just a matter of bootstrapping an entire industry from the ground up.<p>Of course Ferrari knows how to build electric engines, it&#x27;s completely out of touch to think that one of the leading car producer in the World in terms of know how can&#x27;t do what BYD does (Ferrari is the only F1 team that still manufactures all of the components of their car from the engine to the chassis and everything else)<p>edit: Maserati, not Lamborghini.
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the_third_wave超过 3 年前
Just make the things run on some &quot;renewable&quot; fuel like ethanol or RME and that whole carbon thing can be relegated to the sideline. If&#x2F;when it comes that far it&#x27;ll probably be more expensive to run these cars but given that the clientele is not that price-conscious that should not be a problem. While it is not really feasible to produce enough ethanol to run the entire ICE fleet it should not be any problem to produce enough for a limited number of &quot;exemption&quot; vehicles. Included in that list can be classic cars, many of which were built to be able to use multiple fuels anyway - e.g. a Model T or Model A Ford can run on ethanol straight from the factory by adjusting the mixture (which is a standard part of operating such a vehicle anyway).<p>Ethanol has a high octane number and as such is useable for high-compression engines like those in &quot;supercars&quot;. Fuel consumption will go up but the clientele does not care about such trivialities. Converting petrol engines to ethanol is a simple task so Ferrari (et al) should not have any problems doing such.
giuliomagnifico超过 3 年前
That’s funny, because I’m Italian and here the chairman of Ferrari already said that they’ll launch an electric Ferrari by 2025<p>&gt; “If we bring in new technology, then we need to bring something new to the market. That’s how Ferrari has always worked with new technology. The evolution of new technology is 100% in the DNA of Ferrari.” <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.autocar.co.uk&#x2F;car-news&#x2F;new-cars&#x2F;ferrari-launch-first-ev-2025" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.autocar.co.uk&#x2F;car-news&#x2F;new-cars&#x2F;ferrari-launch-f...</a><p>Same for Lamborghini<p>&gt; Lamborghini R&amp;D boss Maurizio Reggiani: “If you look at the timing for a fourth model line, there is the potential that this will be the right time for a full-electric vehicle,” <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.autocar.co.uk&#x2F;car-news&#x2F;new-cars&#x2F;lamborghini-plots-all-electric-four-door-gt-2025" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.autocar.co.uk&#x2F;car-news&#x2F;new-cars&#x2F;lamborghini-plot...</a><p>So I think the Italian politicians are quite dull and short-sighted, as (almost) always.
josephcsible超过 3 年前
This seems reasonable to me. The overwhelming majority of cars are not supercars, and most supercars spend their lives sitting in garages, so this will curtail a lot of powerful resistance to the electrification movement despite only negligibly reducing the CO2 savings it will bring.
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jsnell超过 3 年前
This reminds me of one of Peter F Hamilton&#x27;s book series, set in a world ruined by climate change with a strict ban on fossil fuel use. One of the characters is a billionaire who is still being driven around in a Rolls Royce with a combustion engine, since he likes the sound of them or something equally banal. But since he is a good guy billionaire, he gets around the ban by installing a carbon capture system on the car.<p>I wonder whether that would actually be a viable real world solution, or if the weight and performance problems would from it.<p>(Oh, who am I kidding. In the real world the Ferrari owning jerks would just disable any such system except for inspections.)
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fy20超过 3 年前
One thing a lot of the comments here are missing is that EVs are already very close to matching the performance of ICE supercars. The Tesla Model S Plaid has the fastest quarter mile time for a mass production car, and it&#x27;s not a sports car, it&#x27;s a family car. Just wait until Ferrari or Lamborghini bring out a real supercar EV. Nobody will want to buy ICE after that...
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Why_O_My超过 3 年前
Is there even an agreed upon definition for a &quot;hypercar&quot;, what whould stop say Tesla from calling their model s one?
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mertd超过 3 年前
I have no hard stats on who buys supercars but I have a feeling a significant number of them don&#x27;t like the idea of cars not running on oil.
stanislavb超过 3 年前
Just imagine a nice and quiet street&#x2F;neighborhood with EVs only, and then someone passes by every morning with a roar of a super car…
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joncrane超过 3 年前
This is essentially to protect Ferrari and maybe Lamborghini...can you name any other italian supercars?<p>I don&#x27;t really count Maserati.
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throw3849超过 3 年前
This is crazy. Lightweight low emission cars are banned for strict limits, but supercars get exception?