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Ask HN: EU devs who moved to the States for work, has it been worth it?

117 点作者 Winterflow3r超过 3 年前
For however you choose to define "worth".

24 条评论

cplanas超过 3 年前
ES -&gt; DK -&gt; US<p>For me it&#x27;s a mixed bag, and we will be probably moving back to Europe next year, after spending 6 years in between San Francisco and New York.<p>On the positive side, money. Software engineers make much, much more in the US than anywhere in Europe, including Nordic countries. My income tripled in the US, and my income was considered pretty high Denmark. Another positive side of the US is that there seems to be more opportunities, particularly if you are white or Asian and work in tech. My wife couldn&#x27;t get a job in Europe, here she joined multiple FAANGs.<p>On the negative side, the lifestyle doesn&#x27;t really fit us: too much focus on work. The problem is not -only- longer working hours, but that a lot people center their life around their job. I also find the social issues of the US (unequality, racism) more disturbing than the ones there are in Europe.
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simonw超过 3 年前
British, moved to San Francisco for work (actually an acquisition) in 2014. Still in the USA 7 years later, as are the rest of the team who moved over at the same time.<p>Financially definitely worth it - salaries here are so much higher even than London, not to mention stock options and suchlike.<p>California is a really lovely place to live. We saw a whale from our back deck once! It&#x27;s November and it&#x27;s sunny and warm outside. Very different from the UK!<p>Even with the best insurance plan we can find, interacting with the healthcare system here is so stressful that it&#x27;s the main thing that makes me consider moving back again.
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ranieuwe超过 3 年前
NL -&gt; DE -&gt; US for a FAANG, my net income has tripled. Cost of living is similar. Worth it from the view of financial security.<p>We enjoy the US, especially Washington but will probably move back to the EU in ~7-8 years. Miss a lot of things from Europe though, especially the school system and public transportation.
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throwaway_13490超过 3 年前
I moved from Stockholm to NYC 3 years ago.<p>Yes it&#x27;s been worth it for me. I really enjoy my time in New York and I was looking for a change.<p>Being far away from friends&#x2F;family is clearly not fun. I already changed countries several times within the EU before so I was used to it.<p>Some random notes since the question is a bit open-ended:<p>- I stayed with the same company, which helped me a lot because it gave me social contacts when I first moved (my colleagues).<p>- Having a guest bedroom is great because having friends or family over for a longer time is easier.<p>- The visa process is a pain while you&#x27;re in it. Looking back on it, it&#x27;s mostly the frustration at the lack of efficiency and unclarity that made it bad. Considering all the other things, it&#x27;s a visible and easy to discuss &quot;cost&quot; but changing social circles is the bigger challenge and less easily discussed, I think.<p>- Moving to a country where English is the native language is a _lot_ easier than moving to a country where you don&#x27;t know the language as well. This holds even if a large part of the population speaks English very well; if you don&#x27;t speak native language of a country, it&#x27;s hard to feel like a part of society.<p>- I personally don&#x27;t like the &quot;X in NYC&quot; (X being your citizenship) facebook groups. Bonding based on interests (sports, books, ...) has been more rewarding for me.<p>The experience has been totally worth it for me and I don&#x27;t regret moving one bit. That said... I don&#x27;t plan on having kids in the US&#x2F;growing old in the US.<p>(salary is better but I assume you looked that up already)
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thurn超过 3 年前
I&#x27;ve lived in the Bay Area for 10 years now -- one thing you should be prepared for is that it can be a very &#x27;transitory&#x27; place. The majority of people you will meet have plans to move back home in a few years, so it&#x27;s harder to form long-term friendships. Not sure if this is a regional thing or if you&#x27;d get the same phenomenon in big cities like New York or London.
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belugacat超过 3 年前
Lived in the US throughout my 20s, lived like a grad student (with a few splurges here and there to celebrate career milestones) and saved+invested most of my money earned during a FAANG career, during covid i bought+restored an old manor in a rural area in my home country where I can live on a few hundred euros a month (it blows my mind what 30 euros gets me in fresh produce from local farmers compared to $100 at BiRite in SF). I&#x27;m still ~40 minutes away from a mid sized city and airport that directly connects me to large cities in Europe.<p>It&#x27;s been worth it although it&#x27;s come at the cost of personal relationships somewhat.
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kello超过 3 年前
I did the reverse. American who moved to EU for work. I would say go for it! Unless you land a gig in Silicon Valley or working for FAANG tho, I would tamper your expectations of the salary in the States being that much better than (Western) Europe. I would never say not to do it though, I think it will be &quot;worth&quot; it 100% regardless of potential monetary compensation increases.
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TulliusCicero超过 3 年前
Not quite what you asked for, but I’m an American who went to Germany for five years and then came back recently. Quite happy to be back, though certainly there’s things I miss dearly about Munich.<p>The people talking about a lifestyle downgrade in the US aren’t wrong, exactly, but it does depend on your own preferences and values and situation. For me, the lifestyle in the Seattle area is better overall I’d say, but I definitely miss the transportation system in Munich a ton. Seattle is practically drowning in nerd culture, which I adore, whereas Munich had relatively little.<p>Also, not everything is as the stereotypes go. The public school our son is in here in Kirkland is fucking awesome, way better than the private school he was in in Munich (we were going to do public school there, but the system didn’t want him). Part of his better adjustment is obviously being a native speaker, but that’s not the only thing that’s better.
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Ginden超过 3 年前
I would like to notice, that significant portion of people moving abroad for work in high-tech industries are top performers. Extrapolating from their experiences isn&#x27;t necessarily helpful if you aren&#x27;t top performer yourself.
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malermeister超过 3 年前
I&#x27;ve lived in the Bay Area for six years, made a bunch of money and am now moving back to the EU to enjoy said money.<p>You make a lot more $$$, but it&#x27;s definitely a big lifestyle downgrade. I wouldn&#x27;t wanna live there permanently, but as a temporary thing to set yourself up nicely it&#x27;s not too bad.
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homedog31超过 3 年前
I moved from London to work for one of the FAANG companies in SV and my salary has grew more than 10 times over 5 years (partially due to insane stock run). Having said that I still enjoyed life in London more and planning to come back to Europe in few years since I will be able to live comfortably with money saved.<p>Edit: by salary I meant total income including RSUs, the salary is also much better but obviously not 10x.
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exdsq超过 3 年前
I’ve been in the Bay Area for 4 months and have enjoyed it, however I’ll go back to Europe in the next few years. You can get similar salaries if you find remote jobs out here or contract in London so the main reason should be for the lifestyle, not the work. If it helps I’m paying literally 7x more for my apartment than I did in England while my salary is fairly similar lol. It’s all fun though.
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mmaunder超过 3 年前
ZA -&gt; UK 5 years -&gt; US. Transformative for me. I ran a job search engine in London. There was no startup community to speak of and talk poppy syndrome is very real. Got to USA and relaunched it here, and found it laughably easy to do business here, incredibly supportive, failure is celebrated and there is no easier place in the world to raise cheap, enthusiastic and helpful money. I now run a 40 person cybersecurity company with the help of amazing US based investors and mentors, most of whom are also immigrants.<p>That’s my perspective as an entrepreneur. I actually worked for eToys.com in the UK and spent time based in the USA in LA and loved it. Faster moving, no classism, faster advancement and plenty of other amazing businesses surrounded me.<p>The States is amazing in my opinion for employees and entrepreneurs.
marcinzm超过 3 年前
A good friend of mine moved from Germany to the US. He&#x27;s got some grumblings about the social issues in the US (homelessness, public transit, dirtiness in cities, etc.) but seems happy overall. His income roughly tripled and he&#x27;s not even at FAANG.
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angarg12超过 3 年前
Non answer, but after years of waiting and further delays due to Covid, I&#x27;m finally due for my visa appointment and preparing to relocate to the US. I&#x27;ll let you know how it goes in 1 year!
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wdb超过 3 年前
I haven&#x27;t really found a job that&#x27;s 2-3x more compared to Europe when not taking equity into account
beagle3超过 3 年前
One thing you have to be aware of, is that the US assumes any financial dealing outside the US is strictly for evading taxes.<p>If you have a pension fund in your home country, you’ll likely be reporting and paying tax on its interest. Be prepared to have your looked country banks refuse to deal with you or limit you to saving accounts, and lots of other complications. When living in the US, my tax filing (because of I had to sell some non U.S. assets) one year topped 200 pages; and every year it cost me about 5-10 full work days to prepare the tax filing.<p>Many people just don’t bother reporting everything, whether out of ignorance or out of negligence - and very rarely get audited. But I wasn’t willing to take the risk.<p>My advice is: before moving, find an accountant who specialized in US tax for people in your country (and the treaty), and discuss your specific situation. Minor changes before moving could make your financial life incredibly less stressful - and most of them cannot be done once you’ve moved.<p>At the very least, you must know of FBAR, FATCA, and the treaties that apply to you. But really, two hours with a professional tax person will probably have an ROI of x1000 or so.
DaiPlusPlus超过 3 年前
UK —&gt; US (when it was still in the EU), I was approached by a top 5 company right as I graduated (to helps to put in internship applications). West coast. I&#x27;ve since got my LPR (Green Card), and changed employers 3 times now. I now work for a tiny company that I partly own.<p>Definitely worth it: my total comp is 3x-4x what it would be in the UK for the exact same kinds of work.
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zz865超过 3 年前
If you have the opportunity to work in the US definitely do it. Its a great change from Europe, esp if you like business &amp; tech. Once you&#x27;re here Europe really feels like its heading for relegation.<p>After that I&#x27;m not so sure, we got citizenship and now feels a bit like a trap. I like the land, people and climate (though too hot) but it seems a bit shallow and corporate. A lot of people from other parts of the world make huge sacrifices to bring their kids here to the land of opportunity, I worry there is too much materialistic reward and not enough culture.<p>Interestingly dont have a problem with the inequality, I think the rich here are almost to be pitied working non-stop to buy an even bigger 2nd house and a more luxurious car? I&#x27;m not even sure why they do it.
rurban超过 3 年前
For a few years it&#x27;s worth to see how our grandparents lived in that era. Also good money.<p>But we eventually came back to a democracy, and saw what we paid our taxes for.
1991g超过 3 年前
It has been worth it for me. My quality of life here is far higher than back home in the UK, I&#x27;ve found a city and state that I enjoy living in - 300 something days of sunshine a year vs grey skies in the UK - and the salary delta is outrageous.<p>Although, I didn&#x27;t move strictly for work - I intended to build a life here, and my initial visa was dual intent for that reason.
tester756超过 3 年前
What&#x27;s the diff between EU and US when it comes to free days?<p>How many paid, free days per year that you can take in almost any amount in a row do you have?
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H8crilA超过 3 年前
<a href="http:&#x2F;&#x2F;levels.fyi&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">http:&#x2F;&#x2F;levels.fyi&#x2F;</a><p>This site is very accurate
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morrbo超过 3 年前
I&#x27;ve worked in a lot of Europe and spent a lot of time working in all over the US too. I genuinely believe that it&#x27;s down to the person. Personally, i&#x27;d stay in Europe, but one of my good friends (who did the same route) set up in Austin Texas. The compensation is a lot better in the US that Europe in general (but you can still find ~$300k+ in EU if you look for it). I didn&#x27;t enjoy SF (downtown, not Palo Alto) and Florida at all. SF was dirty, both felt unsafe, and Florida felt very fake, etc. However, just down the road from SF (San Diego) was beautiful and a totally different vibe. Boston was also really cool.<p>As for the working environment, the general thing I found was that the US tends to have more people which are absolute experts, whereas EU is more general. If you get hired to do, say, firewall config in the US then you&#x27;d be an absolute expert on Cisco, and there would be another separate person who is an absolute expert on Checkpoint. In EU there would be one person who (whilst they might be shit-hot) would be 80% as good as their US counterparts, but on both Cisco&#x2F;Checkpoint. Just an observation I had across several companies. The main things which drove we away from the US were the working environments - long days, and the general intensity. Also unsaid things like travel time in general being a lot longer, just because stuff is more spread out, than EU. I also found that a lot of the meetings were very confrontational, there was a lot of competitiveness&#x2F;trying to make others look bad, etc. than their EU counterparts.<p>That being said, the time I got completely eviscerated in a meeting on purpose (to make the consultant look bad) was in Eastern Europe. YMMV, but of course these are just my general observations. It sounds weird, but being from the UK I missed the music scene a lot. The US people were absolutely lovely though, everywhere I went everyone made me feel welcome, even the people who look to tear you a new one in meetings 30 minutes later.<p>These are just some random sunday evening musings from someone who has worked a few years in both (some FAANG, some large, some small companies) in both. My observations are pre-Trump though, it does seem recently that there&#x27;s a lot more division in the US these days, so the environment might be totally different now. I&#x27;d honestly give it a go if you&#x27;re young, see if you like it. You can always move back. FWIW my favorite places in both were probably a smallish company in San Diego, and work in Malta. To choose any places to live for me, other than the UK, i&#x27;d most likely pick Boston and Sweden. 99% of the time the people you work with make the atmosphere though, so you can get lucky and unlucky, which is why i&#x27;m trying to generalise my experiences as much as possible. I realise i&#x27;ve gone on a mad tangent here, but yes it was totally worth it and i&#x27;d do it again if i could.