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Tea – the toolkit that builds the Internet

89 点作者 tnorthcutt大约 3 年前

42 条评论

fxtentacle大约 3 年前
This website seriously bombed their first impression.<p>Oddly unspecific name? Check.<p>Low contrast? Check.<p>Generic illustrations like all hipster startups? Check.<p>Expects me to trust some random website with a root shell? Check.<p>&quot;Decentralization&quot; &amp; &quot;Governance&quot;? Of course. True crypto bros.<p>&quot;Whitepaper&quot;? You bet.<p>And I still have no clue what specifically they plan to do. It&#x27;s something about paying for open source, but then again we&#x27;ve seen many unsuccessful attempts there recently.
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vapemaster大约 3 年前
When I read web3 co.&#x27;s product&#x2F; tech description it almost always feels like some form of tech. literacy gaslighting. I always feel initially like there&#x27;s something elusive that I&#x27;m not grokking b&#x2F;c I&#x27;m not a blockchain zealot.<p>Then I sit back and realize that it&#x27;s usually because most of the examples I read are trying to solve non-technical problem (attribution, trust, etc.) with a buzzy tech solution all wrapped in a serious bit of speculation.<p>I think there&#x27;s a lot of room for improvement in the tech of our law, banking, and logistics systems (COBOL--&gt; anything else?), but the kneejerk to some &quot;decentralized&quot; system that needs total but in from it&#x27;s participants to work actually seems more fragmented and fragile than our current institutions...
romellem大约 3 年前
These give some more information:<p>- <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;medium.com&#x2F;teaxyz&#x2F;tea-brew-478a9e736638" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;medium.com&#x2F;teaxyz&#x2F;tea-brew-478a9e736638</a><p>- <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.binance.com&#x2F;en&#x2F;blog&#x2F;ecosystem&#x2F;binance-labs-leads-$8-million-seed-funding-round-for-tea-421499824684903608" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.binance.com&#x2F;en&#x2F;blog&#x2F;ecosystem&#x2F;binance-labs-leads...</a><p>&gt; Tea controls the graph of open source that underpins all modern digital infrastructure. Packages will be released on‐chain as NFTs with their dependency metadata included. As developers use Tea, governance tokens are available according to their real‐life usage to drive the entire open source ecosystem. ... “We’re not changing the nature of open-source. It’s still free,” explained co-founder Timothy Lewis. “Software wants to be free, but programmers need to be compensated. We’re bringing the creator economy to open source. Our vision is to fix how open-source is funded and create the tools that will accelerate its creation for the benefit of all humanity.”<p>and<p>&gt; We’re moving the package registry on-chain (we’ll use a low-energy proof of stake chain). ... We’re not changing the nature of open source. It’s still free. web3 has enabled novel new ways to distribute value, and with our system people who care about the health of the open source ecosystem buy some token and stake it. Periodically, we reward this staking because it is securing our token network. We give a portion of these rewards to the staker and a portion to packages of their choice <i>along with all the dependencies of those packages.</i>
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Steltek大约 3 年前
&gt; Homebrew has been used by tens of millions of creators to build things we all use every day, and yet Max Howell—the creator of brew and co‐founder of tea—was unable to make a living from Homebrew alone.<p>Homebrew is far from the foundations of Open Source or Linux. It mostly serves to prop up MacOS using Linux originated tech and make it a usable developer experience. Everyone says Apple users are more likely to pay for the things they use and that&#x27;s why developing Mac and iOS apps is so important. So what happened here?
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madisp大约 3 年前
&gt; <i>tea’s decentralization offers tangible benefits to ecosystem security. Every layer of your apps and dapps is signed and verified on‐chain. Users can rest assured that the software they are using is what all its creators intended. In day to day development our decentralization increases reliability (leftpad is a sore memory) and gives developers the flexibility they need to turn inspiration into empires; when a single proprietry vendor controls how your stack is composed and deployed your stack is centralized and under their control.</i><p>and then<p><pre><code> sh &lt;(curl tea.xyz) install deno.land ?</code></pre>
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travisathougies大约 3 年前
&gt; tech giants accrued fortunes on the backs of people they’ve never thanked, paid or even met.<p>I have a few open-source libraries, and I figure that... since I give them away explicitly for free... there is no expectation of being paid. If one expects to be paid, one should sell their product.
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pcr910303大约 3 年前
Hmm, at a glance this looks like it’s aiming to share funds of big, top-level projects to it’s dependencies. And for that, a big component of the project is a package manager… and the whole system is notably designed by the creator of homebrew. Seems like the blockchain is involved to guarantee that the fund sharing happens automatically.<p>I’m almost always doubtful on blockchain projects, but this does feel like something that might have a slightly bigger chance to succeed than other more scammy projects. I’d appreciate a less buzzword-heavy site though.<p>My main objection of this would be that dependencies might start gaming the system though. Would expect a bit more info on this in the webpage.
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greybox大约 3 年前
I wonder how quickly scammers will start monetizing other people&#x27;s open source projects just because they got there first.<p>[ref] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.deviantart.com&#x2F;team&#x2F;journal&#x2F;DeviantArt-Protect-Helping-Safeguard-Your-Art-884278903" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.deviantart.com&#x2F;team&#x2F;journal&#x2F;DeviantArt-Protect-H...</a>
jdmoreira大约 3 年前
My BS detector is in overdrive
rektide大约 3 年前
Massive wall of text homepage, so many &quot;it&#x27;s secure!&quot; &quot;it helps teams!&quot; &quot;blockchain!&quot; &quot;monetization!&quot; splats, but I have no idea, not a clue what it is or what it does or what it&#x27;s for.
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armchairhacker大约 3 年前
This is actually a good idea: something like homebrew or a package manager but with a convenient way to fund packages you use, or donate money to a pool so that widely-used packages are funded, or maybe just pay a monthly fee like $5 like Coil.<p>But blockchain is not the way to implement it. “Every project exists as an NFT.” Does that mean I’ll have to pay roughly $500 (the price to create an NFT in Etherium) if I want to deploy a package? Will I have to pay gas fees to download packages? How will I, with no interest in cryptocurrency, transfer money?<p>Is actually a lot more straightforward to do this centralized without blockchain. There are already projects like ‘npm fund’ whose goal is to create a graph which you can use to figure out how to divide $X among package contributors, and how yo send that money to their bank accounts. If the developer actually cares about funding package maintainers they should realize that blockchain is overhyped and pivot to distributing real money, managing it through something like a PostgreSQL database instead.
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bodge5000大约 3 年前
This whole thing about how OSS developers should be compensated for their hard work is something I can absolutely get behind, but I&#x27;m not sure how this fixes that, or what this even is.<p>It seems to be something do with blockchain? I&#x27;d like to say it could be one of the few decent&#x2F;non-scammy implementations of a blockchain in recent years, but yeh, I can&#x27;t really say that until I know what it is.
SAI_Peregrinus大约 3 年前
Ignoring the payment bits, I feel like package indexing could be a decent use of a distributed append-only public datastore.<p>You need a list of packages, and new versions shouldn&#x27;t prevent finding older versions, so an append-only system makes sense.<p>You want to allow anyone to upload packages, not just a blessed list of maintainers, but need to be able to authenticate that new versions were uploaded by the same entity as the previous version, so a decentralized trust system makes some sense.<p>So some sort of blockchain makes sense. On the downside it&#x27;s almost certainly going to be more expensive, get filled with junk packages made by &quot;maintainers&quot; who aren&#x27;t the original authors, and cause confusion about <i>which</i> packages are actually trustworthy.<p>Like Namecoin, I think it&#x27;s a viable use of a blockchain (other than the usual three of speculation, separating fools from their money, and evading laws around money). Like Namecoin, I doubt it&#x27;ll end up going anywhere because the advantages of the system aren&#x27;t that big compared to the disadvantages.
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paxys大约 3 年前
Max Howell created Homebrew but hasn&#x27;t himself been involved in its development or governance since like 2012. The fact that Homebrew is mentioned in every line of this project&#x27;s home page seems to me that he is trying to cash in on its popularity to push a competitor that he can monetize, of course with all the current buzzwords (web3, blockchain, dao) sprinkled in.
Milner08大约 3 年前
If this is just a way to ensure donations go to the right place (maybe I do `tea donate` and it splits the donation between the packages I have installed) then that is quite interesting. But Max&#x27;s blog post has stuff about staking tokens and getting rewarded. Its so poorly explained its almost impossible not to take it as a scam. More importantly, what are they going to have for the average brew user that brew does not have? How are they going to drive people away from brew and over to Tea?<p>Interested to here more, but not putting out any hope for this.
dddddddan大约 3 年前
Homebrew is such a huge pile of crap: terrible migration paths, constantly removing things, no _easy_ way to pin versions.<p>Nix has already replaced it for me. I&#x27;m not getting involved in any NFT stuff, it&#x27;s all just scams all the way down.
paxys大约 3 年前
The hallmark web3&#x2F;crypto scams is that they will go on for pages and pages throwing in every buzzword under the sun, but will be unable to tell you – in simple words and under 3 sentences – what the product is what what it does.
wnolens大约 3 年前
Past the marketing, it&#x27;s all at the very end (though poorly worded):<p>&gt; graph of open source [software] on‐chain creating a map we’ll use to guide value redistribution... compensated without direct payment<p>Perhaps what they mean to say is.. `tea` facilitates a relationship between payer (commercial user of open source) and payee (open source developer of that software) with a smart contract.<p>So.. replace payment processor and middle-man fees with smart contract and gas fees? That&#x27;s mildly interesting, but I&#x27;m not even aware of a &quot;centralized&quot; version of this if it exists so not sure it&#x27;s called for.
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mynegation大约 3 年前
It is slogan- and buzzword-heavy but my best understanding is that it is a blockchain-based attempt to reward open-source contributors. As an example, lots and lots of software depends on sqlite and curl but their respective authors did not benefit proportionally from their successes. My guess: the idea is to combine dependency information with popularity scores to allow cryptocurrency flow down to the contributors in the same way reputation flows to the most referred links via PageRank.<p>The most important question I see here is how the money is supposed to flow into that system.
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HelloNurse大约 3 年前
Blockchain technology to add novel complications and failure modes to flaky package managers? I&#x27;m afraid it isn&#x27;t a joke.
eptcyka大约 3 年前
I still don&#x27;t understand what it is that this project is about.
shreddit大约 3 年前
I just read a medium article about that, and in short: the inventor? of brew got a child, saw NFTs and realized open source does not pay your bills &gt; maybe web3&#x2F;crypto will
hbn大约 3 年前
Do the naysayers have any actual points as to why this is a bad idea, or is it just another instance where people see the word &quot;blockchain&quot; and immediately start calling it bad and high-fiving each other?<p>It seems they&#x27;re going to be releasing a whitepaper. I&#x27;m willing to hear out ideas for how OSS developers could be compensated, especially if it&#x27;s coming from someone who has already created a successful and well-loved project from scratch.
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spiffytech大约 3 年前
<p><pre><code> $ sh &lt;(curl tea.xyz) </code></pre> Is there a technical benefit to using this versus<p><pre><code> $ curl tea.xyz | sh</code></pre>
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activitypea大约 3 年前
If this is real, this is horrible news. No thanks, I don&#x27;t want my package manager on the blockchain.
eximius大约 3 年前
I think I know the answer, but I&#x27;ll ask anyway.<p>What part of this project is improved by using a blockchain?<p>And is that worth the cost?
lewisflude大约 3 年前
I think this page is poorly phrased given the sheer number of cryto-skeptics in the developer community. I also feel that the page more generally fails to show the benefits of tea over brew, and has a general entitled tone.<p>I can totally understand feeling bitter about the corporate worlds approach to use of open source software, but it&#x27;s also precisely _because_ some of these tools are open source that they get traction in these environments in the first place.<p>I feel like a open source developer should not expert to be financially rewarded or given a fast-track ticket to career success solely because of open source contribution. However, of course there is more the development community could do to support open source initiatives.
sandstrom大约 3 年前
An admirable idea, but I&#x27;m doubtful it would work. Happy to be proven wrong though.<p>Another idea on this topic:<p>Someone should try an open-source license where any company with more than, say, 500 employees need to pay a small tribute, for example a fixed $1000 &#x2F; year. Small enough of an amount that any large org could pay for it, and large enough that if you have 10+ large companies you&#x27;ll get good money from your open-source project.<p>500 dependencies would be 500 000 a year, which should be sustainable for most 500 employee the company.<p>Don&#x27;t really know how to enforce it or build an org around it, and there are likely several hurdles to overcome.
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pdonis大约 3 年前
When did piping curl output to a shell become an acceptable installation method?
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api大约 3 年前
Edit: is Max Howell even involved with this? If not then it&#x27;s just another cryptocurrency scam trying to monetize someone else&#x27;s work.<p>Look at:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;brew.sh" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;brew.sh</a><p>The donations link is at the very bottom. If they need money they should put it up at the top the way Wikipedia does and make it a one-click easy thing with an embed that takes things like Apple Pay.<p>I&#x27;ve never been prompted or asked to donate to Homebrew at all.
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jll29大约 3 年前
This is all very confusing.<p>Google sent a blanket, the world is unfair - is this going to be a solution to the problem that any complex software relies on the work of thousands of contributors, who would otherwise get NIL?<p>&gt; at a glance this looks like it’s aiming to share funds of big, top-level projects to it’s dependencies<p>Use the blockchain to redistribute tech giant&#x27;s wealth to the developers of its open source roots? Yes, send the cheques, please!
floatinglotus大约 3 年前
I read this and it doesn’t mean anything to me. It’s like that crappy AI bot that writes IT marketing phrases built the whole site.
haroenv大约 3 年前
What the hell is this even?
smlavine大约 3 年前
&gt; sh &lt;(curl tea.xyz)<p>No thanks, goodbye.
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snambi大约 3 年前
please license brew&#x2F;tea to enterprises. Most of them are willing to pay for license, if the developers ask for it. It can be opensource, but add some licensable features that company will pay for.
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kodah大约 3 年前
imo, if you want to fix open source funding then you need to address these problems:<p>- a lot of companies that use open source don&#x27;t donate to open source<p>- a lot of companies that adopt open source refuse to contribute to it or try to takeover the project<p>- companies will always fulfill bare minimum license requirements at most. At least, they ignore the license completely.<p>- companies ignore any open source which isn&#x27;t a first order dependency.<p>I couldn&#x27;t really tell from this page whether this product will somehow address one or multiple of these items.
AbraKdabra大约 3 年前
Please stop doing this kind of buzzword crap and &quot;tea is a delightful product suite that you will adore.&quot; bullshit, give me some real stuff, not false promises.
layer8大约 3 年前
I read through the whole page and still have no idea of what this actually is and what problems it is intended to solve.
dorianmariefr大约 3 年前
&gt; $ sh &lt;(curl tea.xyz)<p>Nope
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harel大约 3 年前
Homebrew is a mac thing. I know it exists on Linux but it&#x27;s pointless and impractical to introduce another package management to an os that already has one built in. Tried it, and I will not repeat the experience. So I assume tea is also a mac only package management, just with some crypto br(o|a)nding. Why?
jake_morrison大约 3 年前
Apple needs to fund a proper package repository.
spacexsucks大约 3 年前
Is this a scam? Dumbest website ever