TE
科技回声
首页24小时热榜最新最佳问答展示工作
GitHubTwitter
首页

科技回声

基于 Next.js 构建的科技新闻平台,提供全球科技新闻和讨论内容。

GitHubTwitter

首页

首页最新最佳问答展示工作

资源链接

HackerNews API原版 HackerNewsNext.js

© 2025 科技回声. 版权所有。

Ask HN: Why is there no Linux distro that “just works” like macOS?

47 点作者 surrTurr大约 3 年前
One would think that over the last decades, with a countless number of smart people, there would be a Linux distro on the level of macOS. I am talking about a distro, that you don't have to configure anything for. A distro that handles things like external devices screen recording without weird glitches. A distro that is _worry free_ and that _just works_. Why do you think that is the case? Or am I simply ignorant of the current state of Linux distros?

76 条评论

veqz大约 3 年前
My personal experience is that it&#x27;s been like this for years already. I&#x27;m mostly using laptops (Dell XPS at the moment) with some Ubuntu-derived distro with KDE Plasma on top, bluetooth peripherals, external monitor, and external USB-connected drives, and it all just... works.<p>Other people are reporting less good experiences, of course, so anecdotes aren&#x27;t worth too much.<p>I think the real answer is that macOS runs on very specific hardware, and as such it is much easier for Apple to make sure every part works together. Buying a laptop designed for Linux (or even better: a specific distro) would probably be similar to a general macOS experience.
评论 #30967836 未加载
评论 #30982361 未加载
deng大约 3 年前
As many are already saying, it pretty much depends on hardware. If you carefully select it, you won&#x27;t have much issues at all with a distribution like Ubuntu, which actually lists &quot;certified&quot; hardware here:<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;ubuntu.com&#x2F;certified" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;ubuntu.com&#x2F;certified</a><p>I recently installed Ubuntu on a certified Dell Precision and was impressed how smooth that went, even with stuff like full disc encryption, secure boot, docking station support, NVidia Optimus, etc. It&#x27;s not perfect, but neither is Windows. With a bit of fiddling you&#x27;ll even get features that are unavailable on Windows (like proper S3 sleep instead of &quot;modern standby&quot;, which is driving me absolutely bonkers). Even notoriously problematic stuff like fractional scaling on external monitors really worked well. Installing the NVidia drivers instead of Noveau is trivial, even Dell firmware updates for the docking station can be directly installed from the Ubuntu software center.<p>So while there surely is a lot to criticize about Ubuntu from a poweruser&#x27;s perspective (like the snap stuff), I must say that I was pleasantly surprised how much better the experience has become over the years.
评论 #30971826 未加载
daneel_w大约 3 年前
To people commenting how &quot;well if you install Linux the right way on the right hardware like this here purpose-built laptop, it also &#x27;just works&#x27;&quot;, what the OP is trying to underline isn&#x27;t just the technical aspect of the OS booting flawlessly and recognizing its periphery, but also the whole experience that comes after. One special part of this, which is easily overseen, is the fact that Apple has poured <i>hundreds of thousands of man-hours and millions upon millions of dollars</i> into HIG (human interface guidelines) studies, which is something no other vendor has bothered themselves with.
评论 #30966751 未加载
评论 #30966813 未加载
评论 #30968189 未加载
评论 #30966789 未加载
评论 #30969928 未加载
ggm大约 3 年前
Mac owns the hardware. If you run a hackintosh, you will discover just as many oddities as any Linux distribution does on variant hardware to the spec of a PC or laptop.<p>Try a Linux in system76 or some purpose built hardware, or the vendor installed Linux on a system.<p>BTW osx on my m1pro has its oddities with non apple external Thunderbird, displayport, Ethernet..
评论 #30978348 未加载
gregopet大约 3 年前
Please stop using &quot;it just works&quot;, you&#x27;re not Apple&#x27;s marketing department. Sure it just works for some people, but Linux distros and Windows also just work for some people. I&#x27;ve had and I&#x27;ve experienced a fair share of Apple WTFs and some stuff I could never get working properly. Computers are hard, &quot;It just works&quot; is a marketing slogan, nothing more.
评论 #30966883 未加载
评论 #30967144 未加载
develatio大约 3 年前
It really depends on what exactly you&#x27;re looking for in the &quot;it just works&quot; experience, but since you mention &quot;screen recording&quot; and &quot;external devices&quot; I&#x27;ll assume that you&#x27;re specifically asking about the modern gamer-streamer (w&#x2F; mic, hardware-based sound control, multiple inputs, ViV, etc...) setup and not a basic-browser-and-mail setup.<p>Linux, as in &quot;in the desktop environment&quot;, has a HUGE (a can&#x27;t highlight and stress enough the word HUGE) technical debt. It runs on a graphical server that was designed way before GPUs were even a thing (let alone multi-GPU, variable refresh rate monitors, HDPi, HDR, etc...). And because of all the design limitations, X just can&#x27;t compete with either Windows nor MacOS (in that specific environment setup that you&#x27;re asking for). It just can&#x27;t. Period.<p>Mir and Wayland were born precisely to fix this entire mess. Mir never really took off (because of community backlash?), while Wayland is... well... it has been &quot;in progress&quot; for +10 years and it&#x27;s still not &quot;there&quot;. It will get there, eventually, at which point it might be able to offer the &quot;it just works&quot; experience. Or it might not. We&#x27;ll have to wait and see.<p>The audio system was already fixed. A few times... We jumped from Jack, OSS and Alsa to PulseAudio and now to PipeWire and things look promising, but PipeWire is also in the progress, so we&#x27;re not entirely there yet either.<p>Bottom line is: There can&#x27;t be a distro that &quot;just works&quot;, because we&#x27;re missing the pieces to assemble such a distro.
评论 #30966867 未加载
评论 #30968519 未加载
ThePhysicist大约 3 年前
First of all, building an OS that works for everyone is tremendously hard. Doing so with a community of volunteers without central governance doubly so. Linux needs to support a wide range of hardware out of the box. And hardware is becoming increasingly complex, modern graphics card drivers e.g. rival the Linux kernel in terms of the total number of lines of code. So I&#x27;m actually impressed Linux works that well. Apple, on the other hand, builds a proprietary OS that just needs to run on select hardware, and they have full authority over all decisions down to the hardware level.<p>Regarding &quot;just works&quot; I&#x27;m also not sure MacOS is a good example. I&#x27;m using both Kubuntu (5 year old Lenovo T460p) and MacOS (brandnew M1 Macbook Pro) every day and I experience more crashes &#x2F; freezes on the latter. And despite the vast speed advantage of the M1 (one M1 core is almost as fast as my entire Lenovo CPU) KDE often feels much more snappy and responsive. So yeah, modern Linux is pretty damn impressive in my humble opinion.
hans1729大约 3 年前
Wow, lots of disappointing answers.<p>Easy: Apple hires TEAMS of designers, UX-experts&#x2F;engineers [...].<p>The reward incentives in open source environments are not aligned with the required workload. People who seriously compare <i>any</i> modern linux desktop environment to the UX that macOS delivers must be lost in tunnel-vision&#x2F;confirmation bias, it&#x27;s not even close.<p>Also, like some said, as Apple provides their own hardware, they don&#x27;t have to deliver general solutions.
评论 #30967698 未加载
评论 #30966812 未加载
izacus大约 3 年前
macOS only runs on compatible hardware.<p>If you buy compatible Linux hardware then Linux &quot;just works&quot; too. It won&#x27;t work with just random stuff you found in a basement the same way hackintoshes don&#x27;t &quot;just work&quot; either.<p>Also, after the trash fire that&#x27;s M1 Mac external monitor support I&#x27;d strongly dispute the &quot;just works&quot; tag for macOS too.
评论 #30966649 未加载
评论 #30966744 未加载
rvz大约 3 年前
&gt; Why do you think that is the case?<p>Good Question. Short answer is here: [0]<p>The most obvious failure of the Linux Desktop is the sheer alternatives of alternatives madness of not having a simple standard way of creating a sane desktop environment. This is why you have system components not working in an integrated fashion like what you see on macOS.<p>There are multiple system projects fighting, competing amongst themselves and reinventing the wheel to replace each other in one part of the desktop stack to prove they are the smartest out there rather than have a standard set of components to stick to that does its job well and integrates with other parts of the stack. Not create yet another competing alternative for the sake of it.<p>This is where the bugs get created and good luck figuring out where the bug is and <i>&#x27;defining&#x27;</i> Linux Desktop support. Is it in systemd? Wayland? GNOME? dbus? or maybe it is happening in pulseaudio or was it ALSA? See what I mean? Which distros are affected? Hundreds? or is it <i>&#x27;that&#x27;</i> user who has a customized install and tweaked a system component or kernel setting somewhere and it only affects them?<p>macOS does not have this level of unpredictability in the default install, unlike the hundreds of thousands of Linux distros one has to look at and trace the issue and maintain. That is why macOS, <i>&#x27;just works&#x27;</i> on the software level.<p>The hardware level is a different story where to spoil it; on Macs it <i>still</i> just works. Hence the reason why this ex-Linux user moved to macOS [0]<p>[0] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=30821580" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=30821580</a>
lnxg33k1大约 3 年前
Well because it wouldn’t make sense, you have a bunch of software that is build in a decentralised way without an overlord oversight, you are not bound to a corporation and to shareholder interests, but the main point is that if you aren’t bound to an approval process, an sdk, policies, then it’s hard to create a unified experience like on OSX. My question is that: if there is OS X, if there is windows, why do people want to turn Linux in a bad copy of those? Just use those. If Linux was easy, unified, behind an approval process then it would make no sense for it to exist, if you want Linux to be like OS X, just fucking use OS X
joaogfarias大约 3 年前
I&#x27;ve installed Artix (Arch based) two years ago in a 4 years old laptop. Just had to install a network program, because I didn&#x27;t want to configure wifi on the terminal. Everything else, since then... No yay -Syyu has caused any issues.<p>Additionally, you have to consider that macOS and Linux have different purposes. The later is meant to be used to perform computational work. The former is meant to spy on you. Naturally people who want to spy on you will work very hard for you to not have any barriers - whereas Linux people are more focused on empowering you to make more computational work.
hrbf大约 3 年前
The truth is: there’s simply no substantial interest. If there was, we’d have better FOSS products with regard to usability. Let me intentionally overshoot to make a point:<p>Developers are the ones building software. In a developers mindset, an interface is some sort of API, not a GUI. To them, it’s also more interesting to solve a technical problem than to build a great GUI.<p>Designers (especially software and UX designers) are not valued to the same degree as developers&#x2F;engineers in most organizations, including most FOSS projects. Apple is the only corporation that approached this differently from day one.<p>My own experience as both a developer and designer show me this to be true. Especially the abrasive and uninterested responses I encountered every single time I was offering to contribute to a design overhaul. The developers did not want to deal with it at all. Imagine how a talented but not highly technical designer would experience this community interaction.<p>All of the above is simply GUI-related. When it comes to interoperability between different projects, ideas and philosophies all too easily clash. And with no project leader to mediate and&#x2F;or decide, it oftentimes leads nowhere or even sabotage. To illustrate this, you may want to read about the ongoing ZFS kernel integration saga. And that’s not even GUI-related.<p>Given the current circumstances, mainstream adoption of any Linux&#x2F;FOSS desktop will never happen.
kaba0大约 3 年前
I don’t know about your experience, but MacOS doesn’t “just work” either. What about a buggy daemon that read-writes terabytes of data, chrome forgetting gained permissions on I guess version updates, randomly high CPU usage, oh and my favorite, during reboots I get a flickering purple screen, quite reminiscent of Ubuntu etc.<p>Linux comparatively works in a very very stable and reliable manner. Sure, low-end laptop with low-end hardware will likely cause trouble but it wouldn’t work well with Windows either.
评论 #30968760 未加载
abenga大约 3 年前
Because all Linux distros are just an amalgamation of thousands of programs and libraries, each with their own aims and pulling in different directions?<p>That Linux distributions work as well as they do is a miracle in itself, I think. Comparing them with the massively vertically integrated software and hardware package built by the richest company on earth is unfair. Notice that whenever anyone has attempted to subsume different parts of the Linux stack (systemd, etc) into one project, the wider community hasn&#x27;t really gone along with it without being dragged kicking and screaming, and some times it has led to further fragmentation. I don&#x27;t think this is necessarily a bad thing too, I feel the chaotic evolution,-not-design character of the ecosystem gives us a computing environment that has a better chance of staying free of whatever the clergy of the alternative cathedral model would choose to do, especially when sponsored by amoral corporations.<p>So, I don&#x27;t know what you would like to hear. Does Linux &quot;just work&quot; (whatever this marketing aphorism means?). I think it does, for me. My Dell XPS laptop running an Ubuntu LTS for work, a relatively expensive custom-built desktop rig running Debian Testing at home, and my medium-sized server for my personal projects running Debian Stable on AWS have run without any issues for more than a couple of years. Would I trade these for a massively expensive pretty aluminium box running a closed-source system that will take me several months to master as much as I have Linux (and really can never really, properly, understand due to it&#x27;s closed nature) just to save me probably a couple of hours a year fixing minor issues on my Linux boxes? Probably not.
raffraffraff大约 3 年前
I dunno, I&#x27;m forced to use Mac OS and I find it a pain in the ass. You might think it &quot;just works&quot; and you &quot;don&#x27;t have to configure it&quot; but there&#x27;s a ton of stuff I&#x27;d like to be able to configure, but can&#x27;t.<p>Recently, I wanted to connect multiple VPNs (work, different data centers) and selectively resolve DNS queries &#x2F; route traffic, but it doesn&#x27;t seem possible without a lot of work.<p>I&#x27;m not crazy on the app-switcher&#x27;s behaviour. I&#x27;d like to be able to cycle between all windows on all monitors, not &quot;apps&quot;, or &quot;windows from one app&quot; or whatever. I need to install 3rd party software for window tiling. (In fairness, Rectangle is perfect). I hate the lack of decent Gnu binaries (but again, homebrew fixes that).<p>I hate finder. I want to browse to &quot;&#x2F;Users&#x2F;raffraffraff&#x2F;.config&quot; and end up googling to find the arcane key combo to unhide them. Also, why the hell can&#x27;t I just click on the path and type the path I want?<p>For years I&#x27;ve been using Xubuntu with plank (dock) at the bottom and an xfce panel at the top. Haven&#x27;t had a crash in years. All hardware works. If something isn&#x27;t too my liking I can change it <i>if I wish</i>. That&#x27;s a feature, not a flaw.
评论 #30978518 未加载
评论 #30971497 未加载
burntoutfire大约 3 年前
MacOS is owned by private comapny and hence run like a centralized dictatorship. Whereas Linux is FOSS, so largely decentralized without anyone coordinating the efforts in order to provide a nice, unified experience (Ubuntu is trying to do that, but they don&#x27;t have nearly enough money).
评论 #30968077 未加载
LeoPanthera大约 3 年前
The closest you will get is probably openSUSE, which has &quot;YaST&quot;, a graphical tool to configure almost everything you will ever need, eliminating 99% of the reason to open a terminal.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;yast.opensuse.org" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;yast.opensuse.org</a><p>They also have &quot;PackMan&quot;, probably the largest single repository of third party software available to any distro, which eliminates the need to add third party repos for all but the most obscure software.<p>But, Apple still has one advantage. They make the hardware, <i>and</i> the software. You&#x27;re always going to have a very variable experience when the two are made separately.
jokethrowaway大约 3 年前
Not many ux savy people in OSS and there is no single vision being implemented. It&#x27;s a bunch of people with different ideas trying to agree with each other.<p>I would say the main problem is that people are mostly Devs and they care more about implementing &quot;this one thing&quot; for themselves instead of thinking about users. It makes sense, it&#x27;s OSS, you can&#x27;t expect people to work for free.<p>KDE somehow gets a lot of things right functionally but the design of the default theme contains very basic mistakes (eg. padding) and several interactions are cumbersome and seems to be there solely to justify tech work that someone wanted (eg. activities widgets and panels on the desktop). I think the pinnacle was KDE 3.<p>Gnome 2 actually got a lot of things right but was very low on features. They threw away a lot of it with Gnome 3.<p>That said, I find Mac OS to be pretty bad, UX wise, I generally install Arch Linux + KDE on my Mac devices.<p>In terms of functionality, if you have supported HW you won&#x27;t have many problems. Distro take a bunch of terrible decision for political reasons (eg. adopting pulseaudio and systemd as standards) and those are generally the things that will hurt you - but that won&#x27;t be that much worse compared to your typical Mac OS upgrade (eg. removing python2 in Monterey - who the f approved that?).<p>I wish there was a company developing a paid OS that works with a custom UI, I would definitely pay for that. Maybe one for the system76 people or similar.
MarkusWandel大约 3 年前
For me, Fedora has worked pretty well.<p>It helps to run on less than bleeding edge hardware for which the drivers are mature. Also, while you still can, to disable Wayland in favour of Xorg.<p>With that done, on the typical 5 year old laptop, you tend to get (no guarantee, but in my experience) flawless suspend&#x2F;resume, decent battery life&#x2F;thermal management, wifi, bluetooth (with the very latest Fedora 35 and Pipewire, bluetooth headphones finally work reliably with all audio profiles), the custom buttons on the keyboard, performant WebGL and so on.<p>That being said, nothing is perfect. For example you still can&#x27;t drag a window halfway across between the laptop&#x27;s screen and an external HiDPI display and expect it to scale so that the two halves are the same size. And some recent gadgets may only &quot;sort of&quot; work. Example, a USB audio dongle (for headphone jack-less smartphones) from the dollar store. Works but only exposes three volume levels: Off, medium and crazy loud. But what do you expect, if the open source drivers all need to be updated by volunteers after the gadget is already out there, use gadgets that are more mature.<p>What does work is that the resulting machine will be stable. So much so that you can leave it with your 80 year old mom, who lives 8 hours&#x27; drive away, and expect less trouble than with a Windows machine (we don&#x27;t have Apple products).
hadjian大约 3 年前
Apple owns the hardware and MS managed to get HW vendors to adjust everything to Windows.<p>IMHO, owning the Hardware or agreeing on one existing HW among devs is a good approach. These come to mind:<p>Dell XPS notebooks, which specifically support Ubuntu or<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;system76.com&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;system76.com&#x2F;</a> They build or assemble hardware specifically for their Linux distribution Pop! OS<p>No personal experience with neither, but a colleague uses XPS with OpenSuse and talks about a seamstress experience.
smoldesu大约 3 年前
It is <i>entirely dependent on hardware</i> (much like MacOS). There are &quot;zero configuration&quot; distros like Fedora that work fine for these purposes. However, most distros don&#x27;t really serve that niche; the Linux community is full of people who like to have their cake and eat it too. The idea of running Windows software and games on a Linux kernel like it&#x27;s native software, the allure of tweaking things endlessly to your liking to iron out every complaint of your OS, the idea of building your own workflow instead of conforming to the presets that someone else uses... these are the things that long-time Linux users value. Accordingly, people make OSes to fill that void. It&#x27;s obviously not for everyone, though; I know a lot of people who love the idea of free software, but balk at the idea of spending a couple hours writing a config for your desktop to get it juuuuuust right. I can&#x27;t knock them, but if you&#x27;re enamored with pedestrian OSes, then you&#x27;re going to inevitably feel failed by Linux at every corner. It&#x27;s not trying to be MacOS, and when it does... <i>glares at GNOME</i> ...the results don&#x27;t usually &quot;just work&quot;, or behave like a Mac for that matter.
hpaavola大约 3 年前
Ubuntu on Lenovo laptops have been just that many years. I&#x27;ve used 3 different X1 carbon laptops with ubuntu for many years now. Worry free, no tinkering. Just works.
评论 #30975149 未加载
rektide大约 3 年前
This is a superficial ask, &amp; laced with barbs. Linux does &quot;just work&quot;, without &quot;configuring anything&quot;, for many window managers, and it&#x27;s rarely laced with bugs.<p>This attitude is mainstream accepted bullying. This belief in adequacy is always given the benefit of a doubt, we let the doubt &amp; deficiency monster in, &amp; expect nothing from it.<p>There&#x27;s only one actual specific complaint- about screen recording, which I&#x27;ve seen be very good iut of the box. The rest is unconfirmable slander, is weakly expressed strongly held biases about how great and awesome macos is &amp; how everything needs to be like that.<p>The cultural snubbing of Linux is such an undertold story. So many cultural forces tear at this project, &amp; bemoan it. The support &amp; maintenance burden is vast, yet so much does get done. But this winning hearts &amp; minds campaign- no matter how many happy &amp; joyous users their are, of all stripes &amp; varieties, all it takes is a couple posts like this one, &amp; everyone will register inadequacy &amp; insufficiency. Even though many of our lived experiences dont match up to complaints, disbelief reigns.
davidthewatson大约 3 年前
If you think about it, Microsoft and Apple have considerable advantage when it comes to peripherals and bug fixing. With peripherals they have decades of experience working with vendors who are enticed to support them - I walked through the halls at building 27 (which was Windows engineering before I lived in Redmond in 1997) and the halls were decorated floor to ceiling with hardware peripheral boxes everywhere. That would have been Windows 95 or NT or something like that. Multiply that experience 25 years forward and you have a rough idea how much depth and breadth you&#x27;d get across every person, peripheral, and PC involved. No Linux vendor is close. Now consider the situation for bug resolution: you have dramatically narrower focus when you consider the source, tools, and binaries. Linux has numerous breadth and depth across kernel, hardware, peripherals, toolchains, and so on. There&#x27;s really no one outside canonical and redhat and IBM driving that commercially. Compare to Apple or Microsoft who can afford to fund development across vendors for decades with no impact to their bottom line. If you wanted to have something approaching macos or windows, it&#x27;s simple: reduce the features and focus on a single distro running a single desktop environment running on a single hardware environment. Fix those bugs and those bugs only. Ship! That&#x27;s pretty much what you&#x27;ve got here minus the funding (AFAIK): <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;pop.system76.com&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;pop.system76.com&#x2F;</a> Outside that, I&#x27;d vote for Garuda Sway, Manjaro Sway, or maybe Regolith Linux since I believe that Sway will eventually win the Linux Desktop war once people realize form follows function and those three have a headstart with the last having an easy port given i3 and ubuntu. I believe arch is a better base so I&#x27;d pick either of the arch-based distros, but garuda is ahead of manjaro given it&#x27;s keybindings being ahead by a year or so.
pengo大约 3 年前
If you have the right hardware, most Linux distros &quot;just work&quot; out of the box. I&#x27;ve deliberately bought Dell XPS machines for work because of this.<p>But I&#x27;ve also been helping older neighbours and friends gain or maintain connectivity by installing Linux for them on other hardware, and my experience has been that the &quot;just works&quot; label applies in most cases.<p>Worst case there will be a single module that requires an additional hardware-specific package, most commonly the wireless card. The problem many moves to Linux encounter is that the device being migrating is the only device on hand apart from a phone, so when the newly migrated machine won&#x27;t connect to the internet there&#x27;s no way of easily identifying and downloading the driver or extension needed.<p>I have migrated laptops which have multiple pain points, and it can be problematic. But, so far, I&#x27;ve not encountered a device where Linux won&#x27;t &quot;just work&quot; once these initial pain points have been mitigated with the appropriate driver or package.
jzellis大约 3 年前
Ubuntu has just worked for me for a long time, though I always have to do some tweaks to get it exactly how I like it (Mac keyboard layout, Quake-style terminal, etc.) I&#x27;ve recently installed Cinnamon (Mint&#x27;s desktop) on it and I really like it better than any other Linux desktop I&#x27;ve tried so far. The only thing I ever really have issues with is Bluetooth stuff and sometimes sleep&#x2F;hibernation issues.<p>I think Neal Stephenson&#x27;s analogy still mostly holds true: Windows is a suburban minivan, MacOS is a Lambo with the hood welded shut, Linux is a tank that can also fly but the instrument panel is correspondingly tricky.<p>On the other hand... ChromeOS and Android are, by and large, slightly tweaked Linux, and they &quot;just work&quot; for millions of people, so I guess it comes down to what you&#x27;re willing to put up with as a trade for simplicity.
ufo大约 3 年前
I feel that this kind of stuff is always a matter of what OS you are used to. When I need to use MacOS there are numerous things that I find hopelessly broken, because I am used to them working differently on Linux. And I&#x27;m sure the same will happen to Mac people trying to use Linux.
usr1106大约 3 年前
It depends what you want to do. If you avoid poorly supported hardware Linux has just worked for at least 10 years. However, if you buy random rather new hardware and expect it to support docking stations, Bluetooth, WiFi, multiple screens of different resolutions, great power saving, wireless modems etc. chances are that some feature(s) will be problematic. There has been no volunteer creating support for all of this, especially if it has not been sold very widely (yet). And most companies supporting Linux development either run servers or their specific embedded solution.<p>Myself I have used Linux as daily driver for at least 15 years. The more I avoid extra fancy hardware the happier I get. Saves the planet (well, at least my tiny share of it), my time and my nerves.
nabla9大约 3 年前
Google does just that (Android and Chrome OS). *NIX hardware vendors used to do just that for Unix. Silicon Graphics and Sun for example.<p>What you need is large hardware vendor (like Apple or Google) that takes Linux and really polishes the userland, UI, hardware drivers and curates and integrates all software. All drivers work for their hardware and UX as well for select number of devices. If the software is free, you need hardware sales because all that is expensive and tedious work.<p>It takes large teams to pull that off. Even big companies like Dell or Leonovo don&#x27;t see enough profit to do that. They put in some money and resources but not enough to go the last mile. Small Linux companies like System76 don&#x27;t have resources.
Koiwai大约 3 年前
The truce is, it&#x27;s because you defined it as so, for a lot of people, macOS doesn&#x27;t &quot;just works&quot;.<p>I use linux on most of my computers that doesn&#x27;t do GUI&#x2F;gaming, and Windows on the others, macOS doesn&#x27;t work in any of the cases for me.
gmuslera大约 3 年前
There are hardware and software reasons.<p>In the case of macOS, the company developing it only have to worry about a limited set of possible hardware devices, that they are even designed by them, or tightly approved what components have them on (like sound or wifi chipsets). In the case of Windows, the manufacturers of the devices, usually not Microsoft, are the ones that should make the drivers for their own components, knowing all of internals, and of course, the makers of the computers&#x2F;laptops being sure that everything works well. And in those cases, usually the OS is already installed by the time it reaches the consumer. But in the case of Linux, you have independent developers trying to reverse engineer, figure out how to interact using sometimes incomplete or outdated specs, and the mix and match of devices in a model of computer may not be all covered. And you have to install linux on it.<p>Unless, like with Windows and MacOS, you buy a computer designed for and builtin around Linux with it preinstalled, where everything &quot;just works&quot; (depending on how serious about it is the manufacturer, at least).<p>Regarding software, instead of an homogeneous set of core libraries, rules of user interaction, ways to interact between core applications and so on, you have independently developed applications, frameworks, versions, redesigns and so on, it gives you far more choices, more ways to mix and match the components to make a solution for you, but it may not be consistent, not the same development rate, and you may hit some compatibility issues between versions. Distributions do some work around this, at least for their core apps, but you have too much options, and the applications may not be aware of others or meant to be run in just one distribution and way to do things.<p>Also, the traditional profile of the user used to be more technically minded one, so the design of a lot of components allow more fine tuning and configuration, at the cost of the usability of having just a few ways to behave. But that mix and match leaves space for misbehaving too. There had been some developments to avoid i.e. libraries conflicts, like snaps, but consistency and interaction between apps and frameworks of different developers may not be always perfect.
daneel_w大约 3 年前
Give Linux Mint Cinnamon a try. I&#x27;m a macOS lover, but at work I&#x27;ve used Mint exclusively since 2016 and I think it&#x27;s pretty darned alright - it&#x27;s definitely not macOS, but it really is alright.
azeirah大约 3 年前
I noticed that on specific laptops, over the years Ubuntu and other large distributions work better Out-of-the-box, especially if it&#x27;s a popular device with laptops.<p>For instance my couple years old Thinkpad yoga had some wifi issues in the beginning, but it got better later. There were also some very specific configuration issues, but the defaults got better over the years.<p>Also, people were making github repos with a one-click &quot;fix a lot of stuff&quot; scripts. So I guess if you have a specific device, it can get better. Like framework laptops, popular thinkpads, those dell laptops etc
kkfx大约 3 年前
Well, personally *my distro* (custom NixOS, just a small set of configs and an oneliner to build the custom iso) just work OOB, OSX for me do not work at all, certainly not with the default setup.<p>It&#x27;s empty, it completely miss tools I use, and makes automated deploy of them not much easier, so...<p>IMVHO &quot;just work&quot; means: &quot;i know a certain environment and I&#x27;m lost outside it so I ask why others are not equal&quot; like you go to another country and ask why people there talk another language, differently written and so hard to use (for you, of course)...
personjerry大约 3 年前
Open source projects are often engineer-driven, and as such they lack the product management and UX design investments that companies like Apple put in to make their products &quot;just work&quot;.
rbreaves大约 3 年前
I could bake things in a little bit more but meh, it is scripted and people can easily contribute to it or not. I think I created something every bit as good as macOS more or less, I still need to fix the script to fully setup gesture support though. That is about the only thing lacking from my perspective.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;sourceforge.net&#x2F;projects&#x2F;sorunme&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;sourceforge.net&#x2F;projects&#x2F;sorunme&#x2F;</a>
zvmaz大约 3 年前
I use Fedora with Gnome 42 and it &quot;just works&quot; for me.
phendrenad2大约 3 年前
I think the lesson to be learned here is: &quot;Just works&quot; means different things to different people. The condescending replies, which seem to accuse the OP of not using the right distro, or not using &quot;the good Linux hardware&quot;, are all by people for whom Linux does &quot;just work&quot; (for them). Personally, I don&#x27;t think that Linux &quot;just works&quot;, but again, that&#x27;s based on the factors that I care about.
modinfo大约 3 年前
Why is macOS so stable? Because macOS developers only have to concentrate on making macOS work well on one type of computer.<p>Windows and Linux distributions have a much harder task because they have to work on every PC, which means some features are simply missing or don&#x27;t work because they don&#x27;t know the exact hardware on which their PC will run, for example hibernation in Linux still doesn&#x27;t work correctly because every computer works differently.
jgb1984大约 3 年前
I&#x27;ve been running Debian on my desktops, laptops (testing&#x2F;unstable) and servers (stable) for more than 2 decades. It &quot;just works&quot; for me.
评论 #30966846 未加载
Saphyel大约 3 年前
I bought a Dell XPS 13 with Ubuntu it works fine out of the box, no issues in the last 3 months.<p>I also have a macbook Pro because my workplace forced me to. I had several problems with gpg, docker, Bluetooth, etc.. the list can go on as much as you like tbh. You can google this if you don&#x27;t believe me. Not sure why people is under the spell of &quot;MBPs just work&quot; unless they use it as a stone it doesn&#x27;t.
0xbadc0de5大约 3 年前
Been running Linux (Fedora) as my primary OS for well over a decade. My experience is that it has been in the &quot;Just Works&quot; category for at least 8+ years. Although the last 5 have been particularly good in terms of UI polish and quality of life enhancements. Combine that with the underlying power and flexibility that Linux provides and it&#x27;s hard to beat.
ravish0007大约 3 年前
Sometimes people get irritated because it seems like I over engineer my laptop. I can&#x27;t get the damned HDMI working or maybe resolution is not proper. I pity myself and feel guilt that I&#x27;m wasting somebody&#x27;s time. Point is, it&#x27;s a candy shop when it comes to Linux, you make what you want. For me its okay to debug again and again.
daviddever23box大约 3 年前
It’s not just the Linux distro itself, but firmware and hardware integration as well.<p>The blame for this lies with PC hardware manufacturers, and their least-effort approach to integration (which also affects Windows to a lesser degree). The degree of laziness (partly driven by low-margin, tight-deadline project timelines) can make one’s head spin.<p>Apple simply executes better &#x2F; different.
kzrdude大约 3 年前
It&#x27;s said that streaming using macOS is just to slow, streamers on twitch use or switch to Windows to get a good experience. So it seems like it doesn&#x27;t &quot;just work&quot;!<p>If you care about details, you always need to fine-tune. There is no &quot;not changing any settings&quot; for serious work. :)
simonblack大约 3 年前
I have been using Linux Mint MATE for roughly 10 years now. BECAUSE IT JUST WORKS on both my desktop and laptop.<p>If you&#x27;re thoroughly familiar with MacOS, you may have to invest a little time in &#x27;Unlearning MacOS&#x27; before you can come to speed with <i>any other OS</i>, Windows included.
thefz大约 3 年前
&quot;Just works&quot; is too easy when you write the software and manufacture the hardware it will run on. Linux distros face the challenge of hardware compatibility. You can&#x27;t even compare a heavily modfied BSD kernel with a modern day distro and say it &quot;just works&quot;.
aborsy大约 3 年前
I install Ubuntu on all sorts of hardware, and it just works.<p>I have more issues with Apple OS’s. Latest example: Hotspot from iPone to iPad frequently drops and needs reconnection, Zoom volume is too low and I can’t fix it, privacy buttons are randomly enabled after disabled, etc.
deepsun大约 3 年前
Using Linux Mint for 8+ years on a lot of different laptops and 4 desktops.<p>Everything &quot;just works&quot;.
评论 #30968074 未加载
评论 #30967932 未加载
marssaxman大约 3 年前
I don&#x27;t know what &quot;external devices screen recording&quot; is, but Ubuntu has offered me a worry-free, everything-just-works experience for many years. In fact I prefer it to macOS for its convenience.
amelius大约 3 年前
You can buy Linux PCs that &quot;just work&quot;, see e.g. System76, Dell, etc.
评论 #30966948 未加载
brudgers大约 3 年前
MacOS just doesn&#x27;t work at all with touchscreens, on Thinkpads, or on Raspberry Pi&#x27;s.<p>Homebrew exists because MacOS doesn&#x27;t just work very well with a vast array of free and open source software.<p>Most distros just work on ThinkPads.
miki_tyler大约 3 年前
There is a piece missing. Apple controls its product end-to-end, including HW. If a linux distro would specify a default HW for which the distro is optimized, then they could be at the same level that IOS.
antonpirker大约 3 年前
I use the normal Ubuntu distribution for about 15 years now. Nothing else. I had not to change any config files in forever and every device i owned worked out of the box. So <i>shrug</i>
Daunk大约 3 年前
macOS doesn&#x27;t &quot;just work&quot;, it works on computers specifically made for it. There are lots of computers made for Linux and they all &quot;just work&quot;.
giords大约 3 年前
Fedora and Ubuntu are quite turnkey ready, for what I recall.
elviejo大约 3 年前
How about a system76 laptop, with their POP_OS? The operating system designed for a specific hardware, should &quot;just work&quot;.
rurban大约 3 年前
Unlike macOS, Fedora just works. I had to switch over when the pain with macOS and it&#x27;s HW got too much.
seba_dos1大约 3 年前
I have never seen a macOS installation that &quot;just works&quot;, and troubleshooting was insane. Even as recently as a few days ago I was trying to make it use the correct sample rate for USB sound card and failed. In my personal experience, GNU&#x2F;Linux is much closer to be worry free and when things break (as they always do no matter the OS) it&#x27;s usually much easier to figure out what&#x27;s wrong and fix it there.
topdancing大约 3 年前
These days, you want to use someone that&#x27;s based on ostree - so either:<p>- <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;silverblue.fedoraproject.org&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;silverblue.fedoraproject.org&#x2F;</a><p>- <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;endlessos.com&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;endlessos.com&#x2F;</a> (based on Debian)
yashasolutions大约 3 年前
system76 is what you are looking for.<p>They select the hardware and have created a line of linux-first laptop (and also desktops and servers). They just work. Not only this, but they are also very repair-friendly. Perf are very good too.
mardiyah大约 3 年前
&quot;am I simply ignorant of the current state of Linux distros?&quot;<p>You knew the correct answer
emerged大约 3 年前
That’s comparing Apples on an Apple tree to oranges on any tree on the planet…
peter-m80大约 3 年前
Linux mint just works for me
azaras大约 3 年前
There is, I am using a Slimbook with their Ubuntu. Just works.
sys_64738大约 3 年前
Because some of us still want to run 32-bit applications.
ykevinator2大约 3 年前
I think Ubuntu achieved just works at 18.
taypo大约 3 年前
because distros are trying to build things that work over and over again, instead of improving what exists.
sdwolfz大约 3 年前
There&#x27;s many factors to this, some of which are:<p>1. Branding. Unlike MacOS&#x2F;Windows, there is no ONE Linux, you have Linux &quot;Distributions&quot;. So the brand is split between different entities with different goals and mentalities. The most known, and defaulted to, outside of hardcore Linux enthusiasts being Canonical&#x27;s Ubuntu. As you can see from the name, it sounds quirky, but alien, hard to embed into people&#x27;s minds. Others don&#x27;t do well here either: Fedora Red Hat Linux, Manjaro Linux, OpenSUSE, Elementary, whatever, none of these are relatable, they&#x27;re just exotic names. Solution: to have a &quot;default&quot; Linux, just Linux, no other names. When you search for Linux on Google you should get the first result to be &quot;Linux&quot; the &quot;default&quot; distribution, with a big download button for the ISO to install, with the default experience, without having to think about what other words surrounding it mean. Just like MacOS and Just like Windows, you should have a proper default. Not saying other distributions shouldn&#x27;t exist, but they should be an afterthought for the average user.<p>2. Evangelism. You don&#x27;t see people queuing for days in front of a Linux store to buy the latest Linux laptop on release day like you have for Apple and Microsoft products because there is no evangelism, no virtue signaling towards consumer vanity surrounding Linux. And I think there should be if you want normal consumers to show desire; mainly because the &quot;competition&quot; is doing it. Instead Linux markets itself towards the other end of the spectrum: bulky, hardcore, geeky, non fashionable by choice, and this hurts general public interest.<p>3. Corporate. There are features missing from Linux that corporate environments require, either with good reason or only to tick a checkbox, but nevertheless the reason doesn&#x27;t matter, as long as they require it, Linux should provide them. The list includes: TMP full disk encryption. Active Directory setup with UI tools, reliable screen sharing and recording, system user for administrators to log in remotely, users wiht different privileges to install tools for normal users, antivirus and VPN support for different vendors, a way to push updates and manage certificates, passwords, disk encryption remotely, with UI tools for each. This is not an exhaustive list but just things for which I was denied a Linux laptop in the past at different workplaces. While there has been some improvement here and there, there hasn&#x27;t actually been a unified, across the board solution for these that is usable by sysadmins in corporate environments, which are not programmers, so they want UI tools to manage these, and ideally the same tools across any distribution, so they don&#x27;t have to learn a new tool every time they want to do their work.<p>4. Desktop Environments. Just like with the branding, there must be only ONE default. I don&#x27;t really care which, or even if my preferred one gets thrown out and my most hated one becomes the winner, as long as there will be only ONE. This is very important, I would even say the most important point. Without stability, comfort, and harmony in this area there will never be an environment of desktop apps available for consumers to enjoy and use for their work. And desktop apps is what normal consumers expect from their OS.<p>continuing in a comment...
评论 #30967052 未加载
osener大约 3 年前
By “just works” if you mean seamless installation, boot and device recognition, it has to do with the wide range of hardware Linux has to support with less investment per piece of hardware. But for a decade or more it has been doable to get similar experience if you can buy specific hardware (like building your desktop or buying a prev gen Thinkpad) and pick a widely used distro. Of course, I have to say the out of box experience of Apple products might be the highest bar for general purpose computing there is at the moment.<p>… But if you are including daily casual and professional use, in my experience macOS has been considerably buggier than Linux. Upgrade to M1 caused sooo many headaches with the software I use, but even before this macOS has been getting buggier and buggier every month. Not a single week goes by without having issues with<p>- Apps like Chrome and Slack bugging out. They can’t find my camera and mic devices, their UI rendering gets corrupted with weird green matrix like artifacts, crashes…<p>- Bluetooth headphones made by Apple (Beats Flex) keep disconnecting every 15 seconds in a loop (fine with iphone, broken with Pro Max macbook). One day it almost deafened me because somehow Zoom was able to boost volume 10x beyond system maximum, caused me ear pain for more than a day.<p>- Good luck trying to set up a multi user system with Homebrew and stuff. Everything expects admin access, and even with two admin users you constantly have to fix permissions and switch users to install software. Did I mention everything you try to install and use wants admin access? You get bombarded by admin login prompts as even the most useless piece of software tries to auto-update itself multiple times every week, and sometimes breaking more than itself as it overwrites the wrong folder because of some buggy install script.<p>- Docker runs like crap. I thought it was bad on my Intel MacBook, I but it is horrible on M1. Surprise surprise, intel emulation is slower no matter how much people claim emulated intel on m1 is faster.<p>Funny thing is, after upgrading to M1 my main speed gain has not been because of faster hardware, and instead it was moving more work to EC2 instances in the cloud due to not being able to do my work on M1. I might as well “upgraded” to a chromebook.<p>- Every macOS upgrade breaks apps I rely on, from utilities installed by homebrew to Emacs or chat apps.<p>- Every time I plug in a screen, or a usb hub with peripherals, the whole thing goes nuts. I then have to start a dance where I spend five minutes turning devices on and off, unplugging cables just to get all of my monitor, keyboard, mouse, mic and cam working at the same time. It often drops at least one of them every time I get back to my desk. Restarts usually fix it (never had to restart a computer so much to fix issues).<p>- Many &quot;magic&quot; things that &quot;just work&quot; such as Handoff, wireless connection between macbook and iphone, some icloud features are only working 50% of the time. When it doesn&#x27;t, there&#x27;s no path to troubleshooting, maybe if you restart your computer, log out of icloud and back in or something it will get fixed.<p>I can keep going, but overall I am appalled by all the paper cuts of this supposedly premium hardware and software that cost an arm and a leg.
beernet大约 3 年前
Ubuntu entered the chat
评论 #30966612 未加载
Chol大约 3 年前
If you claim that macOS &quot;just works&quot;, then you have never insenely used it.
ddaalluu2大约 3 年前
Manjaro also just works. If I didn&#x27;t have arch running I&#x27;d be using that. Arch isn&#x27;t perfect but pretty close on the desktop. And since you don&#x27;t want to deal with setup and configuration, Manjaro handles that out of the box.
everyone大约 3 年前
You are simply ignorant.
reph2097大约 3 年前
MacOS doesn&#x27;t &quot;just work&quot; if you install it on non-Apple hardware. Most of the time it won&#x27;t even boot. Nuff said.
评论 #30966784 未加载